Listless kittie, "what's wrong with Andy?" 18.3>4

[poised]

Andy, my beloved shelter pet is almost comatose this morning, not eating, slinking to the back of his closet. I've had him 8 years, he might have been as old as 2 when I got him. He basically stays inside except for brief forays into the yard. So snowy here, he's back within 5 minutes. We did have an incident of poisoning about 9 months ago when he rolled around in pollen from a lily bouquet my well-meaning son sent me. I had him flooded with subcutaneous fluid at emergency vet and he made a turnaround. He'd lost 1/4 of his body weight, put it back on fairly soon when I switched to very expensive Farmina crunchies. He loves their "wild boar and apple" variety.

I have noticed a diminishing interest in food the past couple of days and today, no interest whatsoever, his energy is very low, which is unusual for the Macho Master of My Domain. . He is drinking water, then pussyfooting back to the closet.
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Lise:Hexagram 18, GŬ,

Can o' worms

Decay. Eminent - expansion. Harvest wading the great river. Before Jia three days, after Jia three days.

The great image says: "At the foot of the mountain the wind blows: decay. The noble one inspires the people to raise virtue.

"Everybody has alien influences embedded in his soul. Many are hidden; one does not even know they exist. It seems as if they are part of the personality. Especially those one collected in childhood. "

Changes to:

Hexagram 4.
Méng

Not knowing

Ignorance, expansion
Not me seeking the young and ignorant
the young and ignorant seeking me
The first oracle-consulting is informing
two or three times: confusing
Confusing and therefore not informing
Harvest: determination

The great image says:
At the foot of the mountain a spring wells up: Ignorance
A noble one nurtures virtue by reliable conduct

Mountain
Water

" One has to care for the ignorant, the formless. It still has unlimited possibilities. Without it, life would die away by lack of renewal.
" Blessed are those who have something of this in their mind, how little it may be.
"And listen carefully to those who speak from out this unborn thing. They are the true sages. Lao-Tze said: “I am ignorant, like a baby that has never yet laughed ...the people are bright, bright, I alone am dumb, dumb”. (DaoDeJing verse 20)."

Here's the part that may or may not hit the nail on the head, so to speak:

"Méng: a pig SHI3 (3), covered MI2 or MAO4 (2) with or by plants CAO3 (1). On OB there is no grass radical. According to Wang HongYuan: hunters disguised in animal skins. It seems the pig might not be a pig, but another animal, maybe a tiger. The two images resemble each other and are easily confused. "
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Seems very explicit that tigers (cats) and pigs (wild boar) are associated here. I'm thinking that Andy's very expensive wild boar crunchies might be causing his listlessness. Perhaps that "Can o'Worms might be exactly what he has. Don't think so, but who knows?

Your interpretations most appreciated. Thanks so much.

 

[Liselle]

Hi Poised,

Poor little puss-puss.

I can certainly see how the references to pigs/boars on LiSe's page about hexagram 4 would make you wonder if the problem is the wild boar crunchies. How long has he been eating them? I certainly don't know, but if it's been a while, and he's only been listless for a day or two - I'd think it would have disagreed with him before now? But I don't know.

About the reading, 18.3 > 4. I tried thinking of ways to combine the hexagrams, to give a framework for the answer. 18 can mean seeking the causes of things - the sources of corruption (which is exactly what you want to know - why is he sick). So 18 > 4 might be saying something like, "not knowing (4) the cause (18)," or "learning (4) the cause," or "ignorance (4) of the cause."

For that matter, very simply "Why (4) is he sick (18)?," which was your question - what's wrong with him. 4 can mean asking questions, asking why, seeking to learn. 18 can mean sickness, "corruption" in the body.

So you have two hexagrams which, each in their own way, are about finding out something. That seems very much what you need.

18.3
'Ancestral father’s corruption.
There is small regret,
No great mistake.'

A father is an authority figure, the head of the household, the one who makes decisions. (Probably best to take the gender roles lightly - the I Ching wasn't written with a 21st century sensibility.)

An "ancestral" father would be one who is old, possibly generations removed, someone whose values and ideas have been passed down for a long time. But perhaps those have become corrupted, become changed into something they weren't meant to be, revered too much, or simply no longer suitable.

Trying to apply that to this situation...do you think you're trying to be the "father" here? Taking the responsibility onto yourself? Is that something you typically do, take on a lot of responsibility? If that's your long-standing tendency or personality, it would probably account for "ancestral father." "Corruption" of that might mean it's not suitable in this situation.

Are you able to take him to the vet, hand the father role over to the vet?

Completely different possibility - that once again Andy's been exposed to something poisonous (that you don't know about - hexagram 4). LiSe's page about 18, as you pointed out, talks about worms, venomous insects, poison in general. The line might still be advice to take him to the vet rather than trying to handle it yourself ("father" role, again).

If you can't take him to the vet - and I do understand how expensive that can get, although you're not saying there's a financial restraint - I'm not sure what to suggest. "Small regret, no great mistake" might mean that whatever is wrong isn't hugely harmful or fatal - but I do not feel comfortable relying on Yi interpretation guesses for instructions in this case. (I am definitely guessing - I have no medical knowledge at all).

But my best guess about the reading would be take him to the vet if at all possible. Let the vet figure out what's wrong (and how to fix it - 18 is also about repairing decay or corruption).

Best wishes.

 

[Liselle]

I suppose another possibility might be - do you have anything around that belonged to your father or grandfather, that wouldn't be good for a cat to get into? That you don't know he got into, or that you don't know he could get into, or even that you don't know exists (hexagram 4)? I have no idea what that could be - just dreaming up notions.

"Ancestral father's corruption" again - do you live in an old house, could there be something house-related that he got into? Er...exposed insulation...I don't know.

(These ideas come from the fact that my own cats have been known to eat: strings from raggedy carpeting, strings from raggedy draperies, sofa batting. All those things happen to be raggedy or exposed because the cats scratched at them , but that wee factoid is irrelevant...)

 

[poised]

Liselle, I really appreciate your response to Andy's situation. Your offhand remark may be ta valuable clue:

"{All those things happen to be raggedy or exposed because the cats scratched at them , but that wee factoid is irrelevant…)"

Andy has a huge carpet=covered tree house in the living room, overlooking the yard. His favorite spot. Just a few days ago, he scratched right through the carpet covering to the not-wood under it. I looked at it askance yesterday, wondering what it is made of. Perhaps something poisonous to cats…….Plus, his "ancestral father" could be my old bf who actually bought the treehouse for him a few years ago. I do live in an old, but very well maintained apartment building. With endless snow here this year, it's been a real dance to keep possibly poisonous ice-melting junque off my steps. The maintenance men shovel every morning, spread some awful ice-melting chemical on my steps and the sidewalks below. The chemicals hit the steps at about 8:00 a.m., by 8:10 I sweep them off and, if it's really icy, sprinkle kittie litter on them instead. It's been a dance all winter, and Andy may have licked bits of ice-melting stuff off his paws -- not that he spent much time outside.

And yes, I'll take him to the vet if he doesn't improve by tomorrow. Actually, I was out for a couple of hours this afternoon, came back to find Andy cruising the apartment, begging for treats. Gave him his treats, then he retired to the closet. Within 5 minutes, he came out and started nibbling at his cat food, ended up eating quite a bit. Good sign:>)

 

[Liselle]

I'm glad to hear he's doing better!

(One would hope they wouldn't make cat trees out of something poisonous to cats, even if it is supposed to be covered over with carpet. But you never know, do you. )

 

[poised]

Tigers, pigs, corruption of the father

Took Andy to the vet today. She took a very long time examining him, found many strange little nodules under his skin and probably in his intestine. Her first question was, was he ever shot with buckshot? I felt the nodules too, quite a few of them, I think not quite that hard. I don't know my adopted boy's early history, but his "ancestral father" or former owner might have used him for target practice. Rather doubt it, as he relates very well to the men we know.

She thinks it might be cancer, tests are about a thousand American dollars, and if it is cancer, he has so much of it, he'd never recover anyway, so I'm not having tests done right now. Less drastic things might be the cause…lipoma, little fat globules, which are essentially benign.

Then we discussed his diet. She very much does NOT LIKE wild boar (pigs) for cats (tigers.) Gave me a sample of a different kind of cat crunchies she likes, special formula for irritable bowel, as he is somewhat constipated. Told me to mix it with his regular crunchies. I came home with the bag she gave me and he tore into it right away and ate about a handful, I think no need to mix with stuff that he isn't eating anyway.

So, at this point, I'm changing his diet, going back to the vet in two weeks. IF his appetite picks up and he starts to gain weight again and behave like a normal kittie, that's the best possible outcome and I'm hoping that's what we'll get. Leaving it at that for now.

Many thanks for your help and good advice.

 

[Liselle]

Fingers crossed. Am obviously hoping for "fat gobules" rather than "buckshot." (Could people please shoot at tin cans instead of cats. )

Thanks for the update, Poised - will wait to see what the vet says in a couple weeks.

 

[mulberry]

Poised, how is Andy doing? I know I'm late to this thread, but 18 screams "poisoned food!" to me. It's possible you'll never know the cause (4), but being over zealous in trying to fix it is the right course of action (18.3). I personally would not be very worried about the nodules found by the vet. I've known a couple of dogs who got these and lived for many years with them.

Check online to see if anything you've fed him has recently been recalled. There have been so many pet food contamination problems in recent years, with dire results. If you can, for the time being maybe switch him to an organic, made-in-America brand? One that's never had a scandal? With the vet's blessing of course. And also I've seen that even some purportedly all-USA pet foods have had problems, too. I guess there's no way to have total confidence, but buying something more expensive and higher quality for now might be worth it, if it's a possibility for you.

Besides food, I agree with others that you should look for other sources of poison around.

I hope Andy continues a swift recovery!

 

[poised]

Progress report

Nothing I've fed him has been recalled, and vet has pretty much eliminated his lily poisoning 10 months ago for his ongoing distress. He continues to lose weight, spend most of his time in the close, and to refuse to eat much of anything. I've purchased every kind of cat food imaginable, he shows real interest, but then backs away. Even the crunchies the vet wants him to have were received with gusto at first, now just languish in the bowl. Weight continues to fall off. Finally, yesterday, I took him back to the vet for what I was reconciled to being the last time.

She really did not want to put him down. He's too young, has so much life left in him if we can get him regulated. Not cured, just regulated. She pumped him up with subcutaneous water, gave me the apparatus and told me I can continue to pump water into him or bring him back to her and she'll do it at a very reasonable price.

We came home and he looked with great interest at a new kind of cat food I'd bought on the way home. He was licking the contents even as I opened the can. Put some in his dish and he ate with gusto, just a tablespoon but that's progress. This morning he seemed to feel better, jumped onto his grooming table and begged to be combed. And combed. And combed. Just couldn't get enough of getting groomed, which is a great sign. When I came home from shopping, he was back on his perch in the living room, staring out at trees and birds. Looked relatively normal, and other than refusing to eat, seemed like a happy boy.

My friend, a nurse, came this evening and got the drip line back in, pumped him full of water. Showed me how to do it. He rallied after that, became playful, loving, like his old self. Ate a little more food and finally went back to the closet after a couple of happy hours/

Is this progress? Perhaps. Friend's cat, she told me, stayed alive for two years with water injections daily until finally his kidney gave out.

What this has to do with the original hexagram, I really don't see. I've done several other throws and 4 comes up a lot…which sometimes means "quit asking, I already told you."

Any additional thoughts on 18.3?
Many thanks