Lying i ching?

[sliponshoe]

just curious: ever happened to you that the i ching gave you a prediction that did not come true? did it put you off it or did you search within yourself to find a fault in your handling of the oracle?

 

[bradford_h]

Hi-
That whole question falls apart if you don't believe that the Yijing gives you predictions.
To me the Yi always poses a choice of options, although more often than not it only makes one of the options explicit. For me, the depiction of a disastrous course of action or dire consequences does little more than ask "See how stupid it would be to go here? Don't do that."

 

[bruce]

When I ask for a prediction, I first prepare to be a fool. But I do it anyway sometimes. The master can ignore it or answer it, but never lie.

 

[bruce]

I once asked, what do you (Yi) receive from this exchange? The answer was 21.6 - 51. I can not hear the answer, but I can feel the effect. Predicting the future is like that. It may not be spelled out, but the shocked senses become keen enough to see it coming.

 

[kevin]

Hi Bruce

<blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1>quote:</font>

It may not be spelled out, but the shocked senses become keen enough to see it coming.<!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote>

Beautifully put. For me that is the heart of divination.

The consultation shocks the mind into the 'fertile chaos' of new possibilities. Different ways of seeing and a knowing then emerges.

If there is no shock then there has been no connection.

--Kevin

 

[void]

Also what we think of as a desired or excellent outcome may not be in the perspective of the Yi and vice versa. I often think this in the realm of the relationship question - the person thinks the seeming excellent auspices mean the realtionship will go from strength to strength, whereas the Yi is referring to the personal growth following the demise of the relationship. Just a thought.

Puzzled by what you meant Bruce in your sentence "I can not hear the answer but I can feel the effect". Did you mean thats what you thought the Yi was saying to you ?

 

[bruce]

Thanks, Kevin.

Void, yes, that's how I interpreted Yi's answer. I was asking as a limited mortal what the Yi gets from my exchange with it/he/she/them, and as a mortal, I am unable to hear or understand the answer (21.6) to that question. But I can nonetheless be influenced, shaken and moved through Yi's energy. Apparently, what Yi receives is not as I view receiving, but is more like being without purpose, yet nothing remains unfurthered.

A recent discussion with a Buddhist friend went this way. She claimed that a Bodhisattva desires that we be delivered from ignorance, and suffering thereby. I questioned whether a Bodhisattva can have desire at all, rather than being without purpose, yet nothing remaining unfurthered. Compassion doesn't require intention. It is a state of mind and soul. Therefore to ask a Buddha what he receives from our exchange is like asking the ocean what it receives from my cup of water.

 

[peace]

I can not hear the answer, but I can feel the effect.
_________________________________________________
It may not be spelled out, but the shocked senses become keen enough to see it coming.
_________________________________________________
The consultation shocks the mind into the 'fertile chaos' of new possibilities. Different ways of seeing and a knowing then emerges.

If there is no shock then there has been no connection.
_________________________________________________

=================================================
Yes, these are wonderful. I have often been rattled enough to see things with a different eye.

Relationship questions are always tricky.
Options - that's all the answers are.
And I never ask about the other person.

What I may ask if really anxious is:
Based on what I project onto this person, how do I think they will see my behavior? (or something like that).
That's why it's so difficult to address this when someone asks these questions on the board.
I believe that all we can do is give our interpretation of the line as we see it and hopefully give the person a more thorough perspective of the lines.

Anyway - HAPPY NEW YEAR EVERYONE!!!!

Rosalie