...life can be translucent

Menu

Mei Hua and Liu Yao interesting example...

Gmulii

visitor
Joined
Oct 22, 2018
Messages
229
Reaction score
68
Lets get some Mei Hua / Liu Yao info going on...

This was quiz posted in the Five Arts forums long time ago by Jlim. He made his own forums when he started to teach blindman bazi, some time laters, we have a lot of Liu Yao topics there. All can be found from google and is free to view.

However, I always liked this example as its good example of using both Mei Hua and Lio Yao on a very unusual form of question.
Instead of posting it as quiz will just explain how we read it back then.

So the question is "what is the gender of my baby?" and the answer is 43.3 and the question is asked on 13 November 2016.

Quiz2.png


Now, we don't care about strength of lines, strength ot trigrams or anything like that. We just need Images.

And Images seems to be very clear.
In Mei Hua we view the Trigram without changing line as Ti(Us or the person that is asking) and the other one as Yong(the environment or what we ask about).

Some schools change Ti and Yong based on Images. For example a male around 30 years of age asks and Trigram without moving line is Kan. Kan represents the second Son(as the Yang line is second), that is 18-35 male, so we can look for him there.

In both cases we have Dui on top of Qian.
Dui is the youngest daughter that is 1-18 female.
Qian is the father, 55+ male.

1 image of a girl, 1 image of the environment as Qian in the initial situation.
Something yin in a very yang environment.
Now, qian is very yang trigram, so much that anything it changes to will still be a transition form Yang to Yin.
However, no need to wonder about that here, as Qian moves, from Qian it changes to Dui.

1 image of a young female girl on top of another image of a young female girl.

Without knowing anything more we can guess it will be female and we would be right. : )

However, back then Jlim posted answer with Liu Yao as well, I will repost it here, as the whole example seems very nice for getting familiar with Mei Hua/Liu Yao in the west.

1) Yong Shen is Offspring Line You, weak by Month Hai and Day Hai. This weakness
indicates a girl. Yes, CM has gender bias.
2) Yong Shen is in Dui trigram, which means younger daughter. This indicates a girl
3) Changing line is 3rd line, this line is Yang but changing to Yin. This indicates a girl
4) Yong Shen (Child) comes together with Self line (female). This means Child is same
gender as Self, so this indicates a girl.
5) Second line (uterus) comes with hidden line Si. Hidden line is the baby in her belly, which
is Si Snake, a Yin Branch. This indicates a girl.

Can still see the original topic somewhere in the Five Arts forums. Hopefully this topics are helpful or at least interesting, as the idea is to try to make these systems at least a little more known in the west. As without that going into the more complicated Five Arts systems will be difficult. And some of them are very much worth going into, in my humble view. : )
 
D

diamanda

Guest
In Mei Hua we view the Trigram without changing line as Ti(Us or the person that is asking) and the other one as Yong(the environment or what we ask about).
What happens, in this method, if you get changes in both trigrams?
 

Gmulii

visitor
Joined
Oct 22, 2018
Messages
229
Reaction score
68
Hexagrams are made in a different ways and changing line is always one.
Its for fast question/answer in a situation.
So for example a question comes in mind, we look around us and we see a car plate. The 4 numbers from there after we make some calculation make a Hexagram.
The calculations are very specific, however and the idea is even 1 wrong division and the idea is lost for that time(if you remember well enough can recheck later with more suitable images or calculations and it becomes clear, more often then not).

In connection to the other topic in Tao of Yi Jing he gives the calculation and they are the same that are used professionally as far as I know. However not in the same way, as it seems he always use Year/Month/Day etc. and in practice practitioners just look for a few numbers,event or even sound to make the Hexagram and changing line.
(the rules are in page 89 in Tao of Yi Jing, if someone is curious, I can post here as well)

There are other ways, one I like a lot is from situation. One classic example is old man going southeast, so we create Qian on top of Xun(as this is Father and Southeast) while the changing line is based on the hour in the Chinese 2 hour periods.

The way I understand it for that to work there need to be specific feeling that there is something deeper in the situation, its difficult to describe, but its very specific. Either that or taking your attention as it happens a lot of times over and over again.
 
F

Freedda

Guest
Lets get some Mei Hua / Liu Yao info going ....
For the many of us that do not know, can you explain what these terms mean? They are new to me and I don't understand them.

Thanks.
 

Gmulii

visitor
Joined
Oct 22, 2018
Messages
229
Reaction score
68
It's styles of Yi Jing. In Asia there are many schools and styles out there each with its own approach. In general Mei Hua is just a different style, and so is Liu Yao.

Mei Hua Yi Shu 梅花易數, its sometimes translated Plum Blossom Divination. Uses only 1 changing line and focuses on Trigram relation and Images. It isn't as popular in the west, but there are materials about it.

Liu Yao 六爻卦 is Six lines divination. Also popular as Wen Wang Gua, or the Gua(Trigrams/Hexagrams) of King Wen.
Its another style that is(as far as I'm aware) the most popular way of reading Yi Jing in the East, can have many changing lines, and works with the lines more then anything else.

Mei Hua and Liu Yao is the pinyin transcription of the Chinese characters, but its WWG and Plum Blossom.
Just different styles, there are more out there, but this are more widely used and this we can learn in the west, although still with some effort.
 
D

diamanda

Guest
Hexagrams are made in a different ways and changing line is always one.
Its for fast question/answer in a situation.

So for example a question comes in mind, we look around us and we see a car plate. The 4 numbers from there after we make some calculation make a Hexagram.
The calculations are very specific, however and the idea is even 1 wrong division and the idea is lost for that time(if you remember well enough can recheck later with more suitable images or calculations and it becomes clear, more often then not).

Ok I see, thanks for explaining.
So in your initial example, that woman got her result in the manner you just described? Or was it a normal cast, which was then interpreted by this method?
 

Gmulii

visitor
Joined
Oct 22, 2018
Messages
229
Reaction score
68
Normal cast, interpreted by both methods.
In this case all differences in Mei Hua/Liu Yao doesn't contradict each other, so we can read it as Mei Hua even though it wasn't.
That isn't always the case, obviously if we have 5 changing line, Ti and Yong will be assigned in another way.
(looking at the Liu Yao reading in the same example, we can see how, there is one more situation when Ti and Yong will be reversed, that would be if Ti was in the lower Trigram instead).
 

Clarity,
Office 17622,
PO Box 6945,
London.
W1A 6US
United Kingdom

Phone/ Voicemail:
+44 (0)20 3287 3053 (UK)
+1 (561) 459-4758 (US).

Top