I enrolled in a dance school last autumn.
I have been reproached both in private and in front of the class about 4 times by the two owners - a couple.
While the guy called my attention on the fact that I should not miss any class as dance needs discipline and that I should try to memorize what we do and stop imitating other people, and he did that in a very professional and unattached (may I say disentangled?) way, the girl is being very harsh towards me, looks at me with disgust (or that's how I feel she feels about me), and whenever there is a difficult passage, she would explain it to each of the others, and help them do it, and then move on as if I didn't exist.
I have to say I feel intimidated by her which is not helpful in making myself heard.

Today something happened and she told me to leave the class before its end.

in the end I went up to her and explained my reasons but everything was a disaster as I was overwhelmed with emotions, tears fell down and she kept repeating that I am doing nothing in class, just sitting on my ass and imitating others, and if I have the intention to go on like that I'd better stop going.

She's a brilliant dancer though and I like the work. But I fear for my self esteem and I wouldn't like this to have a bad impact on my body/movement which is already far from perfect. Plus this nastiness might just be her way of teaching, there might not be anything personal with me

So I asked Show me what happened 23.2>4
Something crashed: yes, the stillness we lived before. This uncommunication came to a halt.
Change of skin. The line seems to illustrate that I'm alone
Hex 4 is me I guess, the unexperienced student

What if I keep on studying with her 29.1.2.5.6>27
I never got 29. At first I was shocked at reading the lines, then I found these in memorizing which shocked me even more!

29 isn't only about danger, it's about teaching and/or learning through what is yet unknown.

Chris mentioned words like 'rehearse, practise, repeat a lesson, coach' cos they are not words I'd normally associate with 29. In 29 seems like you go under ( the water) again and again - in life I've found it referring to making the same error again and again and so being subject to the same danger over and over till you can manage it. (Trojina)

29 has changed a lot for me in the last coupla years. I used to quake when I got it before. But now it often seems to show a pit regarding the rising waters of the emotions more than any outside event. 29 can disappear very quickly too once the recognition and resolution has been seen and thought through.
Then again, it can indicate a time where whatever you do and however you think you gonna have get dirty whether you like it or not and you gonna have to use your bare hands to crawl out carefully and methodically - preferably by the light of the moon. And that can be dangerous all right because them thar predators can smell ya....
So, I suppose 29 can feel like hell on earth and can represent real pain as you fight to keep your head above the water and mud busy trying to claim you. Then it can also be a fleeting sign post to watch your step - there's a loose board over the crossing.
It's a fascinating one along with 44 and 51. It doesn't have to be a horror ride it can be an amazing challenge that really builds will and character. The trick is to keep that in mind while the mud oozes through your toes... (Topal)

So 29. for me is saying that the proper attitude to have at this time for things to go well is one of "Follow your Instincts and Go with the Flow" . I'm thinking hex. 29 is a sort of "Information will be revealed on an As Need to Know Basis" hexagram. And so far, it's working. Rather than being The Pits, the trip and all the twists and turns are flowing just fine. The lesson seems to be not to press to know exactly when or what or how or why or where anything is going to happen, but just to stay actively involved, and have faith that it will. (Rosada)

Click to expand...

So could this reading possibly be positive?

27: nourishment?

What if I drop the course? 12.1>25
This looks good to me: I am in time to avoid danger!
Keep getting this bloody 25

So it's a difficult choice.

Out of mere curiosity, I finally asked why so much anger 63.1.6>53
63.6 because she had already told me not to imitate other people
Both lines invite to withdraw though..

Hope this isn't too long and get read by someone


considering the lines of the relating hexagrams :

(What if I keep studying with her 29.1.2.5.6>27)
27.1 and 27.2 talking about me not taking my responsibility and depending on others (as I do during classes)

(What if I drop 12.1>25)
25.1 is positive, as was 12.1

(Why so much anger? 63.1.6>53)
53 is the goose symbol of wedding faithfulness. Could she be a little bit jealous of him? (he's always been very kind and cheerful with me)
53.6 dance!

REPLIES:
Femke:

Heavy stuff, Olga.
It sounds like you let her put you down, because you want to learn something from her. I admire your modesty and determination to soul-search. But this sounds dangerous.
She sounds sadistic (is the rope-tieing a bondage-sm-thing?).

I would suggest:

-based on the hexagrams, get out of this situation while you still can (12.1) and return to your inner innocence (25). Alternative of 29 etc. sounds seriously harmful. Not a stable 29 as a balanced learning situation.

-do deep-rooted research within yourself (12.1) as to what exactly in her style of dancing and maybe overall personality, you find so attractive. And than, try to find the beautiful, undeformed essence of that (25 possibly). You are drawn to that, so in my experience there is usually a hidden characteristic of yourself that you want to develop. But the way this woman goes about it, sounds deformed and dangerous. What is the underlying quality of this behavior? And how can you develop that quality in yourself?

-I would not pick a deformed teacher, but search for one who has the same quality, but expresses it in a non-harmful way (but you haven't asked about that yet).

Love and take care, Femke


Rosada:
12.1
You must safeguard your future possibilities even if this means withdrawing entirely from people who in any way threaten your integrity.

-Guy Damian-Knight, The I Ching on Love.

No amount of trying to please her will change her behavior.
Rosada

Trojina:

Olga you won't get an intelligible answer to 'why so much anger'.as she may not be angry and even if she were answers may be about you not her.

As these feelings of being picked on are an on going issue for you I'd advise you just continue with the class but I could be wrong.

12.1 might suggest you join another group.......but first maybe all these feelings are a pattern for you. Maybe she isn't that important ?

Butterfly spider:
Olga. I have had a great deal if experience if dance dance teachers teaching and dance teachers and music teachers. I have worked in areas of dance bordering on not dance - as part of a group of girls trying to get through college. Some advise

If you are made to feel belittled by anyone they are not a good teacher. If you feel repulsed by anyone pertaining to teach you - they are not a good teacher. I could go on. Just remove yourself

My brother has dyspraxia and about 35 years ago came to a dance class with me in Lindon run by Charles Augins - he was so hard, disciplined and a ferocious teacher. My brother went to the beginners class - with me - to give him some outlet away from home and get him mixing. He was never going to be a dancer just trying to move and enjoy himself. Charles was so supportive - come on xxxxxxx you can do it. One pose - a standing one with arms in arabesque was easy. He said to the class that xxxxx was the perfect dancer - we should copy how he was standing ... He said such posture and balance was beautiful thing to see. Xxxxx my brother shone with pride and still talks about Charles.

Now, this is a good teacher. Who is anyone to belittle or intimidate - I teach music and dance and have been on courses recently where I have been made to feel worthless. It is not me that has the problem

Charles was in a Bond Movie with Roger Moore - my brother watches it a lot. It makes him feel good about himself

That is what a good teacher does your reading emphasises this
Good luck
X

ginnie:

Olga, you titled your post "insulting and nasty teacher," so you already had her pegged at the beginning . . . Knowing this, how can you stay? She has singled you out for abuse, and yet you become confused, forgetting what you knew before. Remove yourself from her classes. Turn your back on her and walk away.

Olga:
I fear with this title I might have biased your opinion on her?

It might be that she's just over strict and can't stand untalented people or that she can't stand that I keep copying other people because I don't remember what we have to do.
I remember in the chat we had after the lesson she said I was being lazy and not put too much effort, to which I replied that I was doing my best which probably isn't enough for her class.

Today I didn't go to her class but we met in the hall.
I am thinking I might try one more time and see how it goes. After all we had an exchange after the class yesterday, so something has changed. If I still feel uncomfortable I will leave.

29.1 could mirror my situation now. It talks about character and habit. get used to bad (to bad dancing in my case). I also found it talks about not too much attention (which I also get reproached about)

29.2 a suggestion for me: at the moment you are not able to get wonderful results, so just be happy about dealing successfully with the situation and stress. You can achieve small things. Water itself takes time to find its way through the earth.

29.5 be happy to deal with the difficulties you find. You won't get buried alive anyway

29.6 You will finally make friends with the teacher and she will tie you up. If you allow this you will have three years hell! you will survive anyway

By the way I have found in my notebook that I had asked about a month ago what I could learn in this school and I had got 32.5>28 which I had not posted here as I had found positive, challenging, I remember it talked about possible deep changes in me if I had the perseverance to continue.
32 is perseverance and constancy and are generally things I lack. I feel this school has given me discipline so far. Now I am not skipping a single lesson while last Autumn I would stay home if it rained.
32.5 talks about following masters (the teachers)
28 could be the excessive stress it's involved?

Rosada:
Dear Olga,

Yes, it certainly could be personal dislike with no good reason but that does not explain why you tolerate it and keep going back for more. If you really believed in yourself you wouldn't allow her to disrespect you this way. Consider if you had just put a lot of money into fixing the motor on your car. The outside of the car might look ordinary, but you would know it was a fine machine in top notch shape. Now suppose someone came along and said your car was a piece of junk. Would you be hurt? Would you try to change their opinion? Probably not because you would know so well that it was an excellent car and you'd easily recognize that the person didn't know what they were talking about. And you certainly wouldn't loan them your car keys. Same with this dance class. If you were truly in touch with your capabilities and had clear intentions of why you are in this class you would recognize this teacher as being inappropriate and wouldn't have any qualms about leaving and finding a new class. However, the fact that you continue to show up for this abuse suggests that something in you doubts your ability. Something in you is saying, "Well I really am an unteachable clod so it doesn't matter if she abuses me because even the world's kindest and most patient teacher wouldn't be able to get anything out of a blob like me. In fact, staying with this crazy person shields me from having to face how untalented I really am."

If you really did believe in yourself you would be saying, "I have great potential and there are teachers out there who know how to see it and develop it. I won't waste my time - God's time! - on any one less."

As to what you are able to learn from this class I think 32.5 - 28 is telling you to see when it's time to let the whole thing collapse.
How about asking the I Ching for what you should look for in a teacher or what a sort of class you deserve?

Olga:
Hi Rosada, I haven't been back yet! I was thinking about trying once more tomorrow but I haven't decided yet.The reason is she's one of the few people here doing this kind of dance and she's really good (at dancing). It's not that easy to find good teachers. Some teachers are nice to be with but just come to class to earn their money and are not interested in you learning.
I experienced something similar in theatre: when teachers were strict I usually discovered something important, a new key to a problem I had.
As to your example of the car with a good engine and a bad outside, I would probably get angry and upset at someone insulting my car and not believing it is wonderful, and would probably start justifying myself and try to convince them. I guess that's the problem and the reason why I'm still stuck here. I lose my time trying to convince people instead of just going ahead.
Last night I asked
in what position am I with the teacher? 52.5>53
careful about what I might want to say!

How do you suggest me to approach her? (in case I decide to continue study with her) 63.3.4.6>25
not clear but I bet it's saying I'm a stupid 25

and finally What will her classes give me in the end? 44.1>1
That's the most important question I believe and the most clear to me: dangerous person, intrusive, sexual, unbalanced power, a spider capturing you in her web. And the line seems to say just don't study with her!

Rosada:

What position am I in with his teacher?
52.5 - 53 Measured words and clear instructions lead to progress.
Could the I Ching be describing a good student/teacher relationship and leaving it up to you to decide if this description fits your situation?

How to approach her?
63 - 25. After Completion - Innocence.
Take the long view. As you consider how to approach her, remember that after all is said and done, you want to be able to look back at this time and be able to say it was a worthwhile experience, no harm done, you gave it a shot and it didn't leave you scarred.
This makes me think it would be good if you were really clear about your goals. Like, if you want to be able to perform at a certain level of expertise and you think working with this woman will get you to that level than your approach might be, "I don't care how she treats me, I shall devote myself to her guidance because I trust that ultimately this woman will lead me to being the dancer I aspire to be and if it doesn't work out at least I'll be able to say I gave it my very best shot." On the other hand, if your goal isn't so ambitious and you're taking the class mainly so as just to be limber and have more self confidence on stage your approach might be, " This woman is a bit over the top for what I'm trying to do but I'll give it a month and if I don't see significant progress I'll drop the class - no harm done."

What will you ultimately learn from this class?
44.1
Don't sweat the petty stuff.
Don't pet the sweaty stuff.
1.
Focus on the important stuff.

update:
I went to the teacher's class again today.
I've decided to take it as Topal's view that

29 doesn't have to be a horror ride it can be an amazing challenge that really builds will and character. The trick is to keep that in mind while the mud oozes through your toes...

Click to expand...

I've taken up the challenge and danced all the time with my eyes closed so as to change my habit to copy people in front of me, trying to learn through a new modality, and the effects were the following: shivers all over my body. My body was shaking as if I was going through a forest of lions. Weird sensation. I didn't know why but I felt I was frightened. I felt I was in danger, even if I wasn't at all.

So that was 29 for me: danger. Not real one.. just a new modality for my body that made me feel as I was in danger. If before I was pretending to dance, just copying other people, today it was ME in my body doing things myself. A great satisfaction. And the teacher was pleased, and smiled. And said that's the way to learn.

I think you have quoted me out of context, before I had relevant information in the duplicate thread here http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?20256-insulting-and-nasty-teacher

I'm cross referencing because I feel my own POV is misrepresented here. Also this is a duplicate thread.

People gave many answers and now you made a new thread here as if you hadn't been answered in that one already. I don't much like being quoted out of context Olga so maybe would you mind not quoting me ?

Thankyou.

Oh and for reference, this which you quoted above

Trojina:

Olga you won't get an intelligible answer to 'why so much anger'.as she may not be angry and even if she were answers may be about you not her.

As these feelings of being picked on are an on going issue for you I'd advise you just continue with the class but I could be wrong.

12.1 might suggest you join another group.......but first maybe all these feelings are a pattern for you. Maybe she isn't that important ?

Click to expand...

I later said I was mistaken after I had heard certain facts about this teacher. If these facts you reported in that thread are true then none of this quote holds. So why edit me to say what you want.

What I really think is in that other thread in which you reported she was abusing you. Now you say she isn't.

How am I to know which is true ? I don't. But the one thing I do know is what I think and what I think is in the previous duplicate.

Hi Trojina, I just copied your first answer before too many things were said.

You said 29 might mean to stay and I think it was right what it meant for me: to overcome my fears.

But generally speaking I'm wondering if it makes sense to change one's opinion after knowing something more of the situation. I mean isn't this being influenced?

What I really think is in that other thread in which you reported she was abusing you. Now you say she isn't.
How am I to know which is true ? I don't. But the one thing I do know is what I think and what I think is in the previous duplicate.

Click to expand...

What I said is true, she was being harsh. She may start again next week, who knows!
Yesterday she wasn't. She was pleased. And said that our "clash" was worth something after all.

I met so many teachers that get abusive and insulting to make you develop what they want. Have you ever?
I guess it might be in the arts.

The misunderstanding was probably due to the fact that I wrote it as if my question was "is this person abusive or not?" while my question was: "what happens if I keep studying with her?"

I hope I have made myself clear now

Hi Trojina, I just copied your first answer before too many things were said.

You said 29 might mean to stay and I think it was right what it meant for me: to overcome my fears.

But generally speaking I'm wondering if it makes sense to change one's opinion after knowing something more of the situation. I mean isn't this being influenced?

Click to expand...

All answers are within a context, make no sense without context and yes of course context changes how one sees the answer. I Ching is not a slot machine, it answers the situation. In that thread you painted a picture of abuse. Seeing the answer against the backdrop of abuse would change how the answer might be read. Now you tell a different story and the other thread was a waste of time.

Where did you get the false idea that people here were meant to tell you what your readings mean with no content and suspending their own memories, minds and thoughts. It isn't actually a reading 'service' here, more like sharing and learning.

What I said is true, she was being harsh. She may start again next week, who knows!
Yesterday she wasn't. She was pleased. And said that our "clash" was worth something after all.

I met so many teachers that get abusive and insulting to make you develop what they want. Have you ever?
I guess it might be in the arts.

The misunderstanding was probably due to the fact that I wrote it as if my question was "is this person abusive or not?" while my question was: "what happens if I keep studying with her?"

I hope I have made myself clear now

Click to expand...

No but never mind. You keep changing the story so there is no point in me even trying to follow it. A few days ago you painted a picture of some horrendous abuse, everyone rallied round to help you...then you changed the story and then deleted your posts.

I can't see why we should have two threads, with exactly the same question and exactly the same cast,..but one where you didn't like answers from others, so deleted all your posts ....only to re post your question on a new thread with all the bits you liked from the last one.

Clearly I'm not the right person to assist you in your readings or offer any thoughts since I remember what people write in threads, I remember their story, and that comes into play if I answer them in on going threads. I'm not about to have a lobotomy so Toodlepip and Good Luck in the world of alternative/parallel realities and duplicate threads where only the current acceptable answers are presented.

I am not telling a different story. The story stays the same. I reported the same thread except for a few personal details of the teacher which I don't think it's right to have them here as she said that in private to us. It was my mistake to tell them, I shouldn't have in the first place. But that doesn't change anything in the story. It's the usual story of a teacher getting mad at someone because that person is not performing or communicating the way she wishes him to. That's it. I don't see the point in carrying this over.
People are abusive yes, and then they change. Or I might have misperceived her abusive behaviour which might just have been connected to my not performing the way she wanted me to.

I met so many teachers that get abusive and insulting to make you develop what they want. Have you ever?
I guess it might be in the arts.

Click to expand...

But this begs a question.

Olga if this way of teaching is so usual/ normal to you then why did you start a thread complaining of how mistreated you were ?


You complained and described abuse
People said 'no don't let this happen Olga, leave'
You said 'oh it's okay, it's normal, don't you know anything'

It's a kind of theme

I'll leave you to the capable hands of those who understand the theme better than I...

I had asked what I could learn in this school and I had got 32.5>28

Click to expand...

ROSADA: As to what you are able to learn from this class I think 32.5 - 28 is telling you to see when it's time to let the whole thing collapse.

The school has closed. I already knew it was about to close. Just wondering if Rosada's idea of letting the whole thing collapse could be referred to the fact that the school was about to close.

Olga:
I came across this thread and it was so touching. I admire your character; but it's heart breaking to me. Thankfully, you received very compassion and loving guidance from some people. I wonder if you have a mother or an older sister. The idea of you out in the world alone, trying to grow, to blossom, seeking guidance so nakedly seems such a harsh destiny. I don't know your age, but maybe you are young. Maybe not.
Whatever the case, I pray that you will find a loving mentor who will stand in solidarity with you and not allow you to be spiritually brutalized as you go about developing as an individual and in your give career.
With the utmost warmth and good will,
Mookah

A note: Mookah used to post here as Sitara.

(Mookah, you are absolutely welcome to change your username, but maybe put a note in your signature of your previous username for a few weeks, so as not to confuse people?)