Look I've been here before http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?7363-61-unchanging

That thread is 6 years old. Am I six years wiser in regard to the message 61uc can deliver ?



Mmmm I see it a bit differently now, in particular I think of how the experience of 61uc contrasts with the experience of 62uc. In 61 one's own truth, one's own consciousness looms large. It fills the whole horizon it is so true. It's big but it's big in the way your teeth feel big in your mouth. Everything in your own mouth feels BIG to you. Your teeth are TRUE, they are there in your head and they are very important. They can affect your life a lot. But outside of your mouth your teeth don't count for much. They aren't as important to anyone else. 61 could look a bit like a mouth. Dui, lake below and Xun, wind above. I see 61 as referring to inner truth...which is lucky because that is the name of the hexagram. I actually wrote that without thinking that yes it was the name of the hexagram. I don't feel it is all about 'truth' itself but one's own inner truth, one's subjectivity that counts for so much from the inside looking out.

Of course in 62 it's the reverse. One's own truth, one's own subjectivity doesn't count for a whole lot in the landscape of the question you find yourself in. You're a small bird carrying that message of inner truth against a great big sky.

Lise

Hulk

61 - Stone-age still lives under the surface
62 - Beware of the inner giants, act like a dwarf

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I'm not sure what was meant by 'hulk' ....but I am quoting from an old printout from a forum.

Actually I'd now say that one needs to beware of inner giants in 61. Not to be wary as such, but be aware of how intensely real this is to you...and of course that overlaps with 62.

Maybe with 61uc your inner truth is the truth about the matter you enquire about ? That is to say there no is objective truth against which your truth on the matter can be measured. With 62uc your truth can be measured, seen as distinct from the truth, reality of your environment.

So very broadly I'm seeing 61uc can be that your inner world is all on this matter, whatever it is, and in 62 your outer world counts for more in terms of where you need to be.

Experiences Well, on looking through my journal I only note the times I have cast 61uc I seemed to be seeking some confirmation that things were as I thought they were regarding relations with various others.

That's all. I found no questions on anything especially tangible, I appeared to be seeking reflections.

Hilary writes of the pair in her book

'Small Exceeding steps over the line; Inner Truth means trust.'

With Inner Truth, you have complete confidence; things feel stable and dependable. Small exceeding is the opposite experience: stepping out into the world, feeling small, exposed and out of balance, constantly aware of the need to adapt.

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Wing writes of 61 unchanging

The upper trigram of penetrating efforts, SUN, is enhanced and amplified by the rising lower trigram, TUI, openness. Hence an open attitude achieves true penetration and INSIGHT into the situation. This must be accomplished before any action can take place. In it's static state this hexagram suggests that the object of your inquiry cannot be affected at all, nor will it affect you, until a sincere rapport is established. Begin on this immediately.

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Interesting.


How have you personally experienced 61 unchanging in your readings ?

Also am linking to some interesting takes on 61uc in this thread http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?20213-61-unchanging

The shadow hexagram, that is what you might be very much drawn to do but is precisely what not to do, here is hexagram 4. Make of that what you will.


http://www.invisibletouch.co.uk/iCh...Line4=1&Line3=1&Line2=8&Line1=8&txtFrmState=2

I had a 61uc reading where I asked about a shipping transaction which I'd been assured by a person had been completed, but it wasn't showing up in the usual way on the internet (no email confirmation, no charge made to my bank account). I was apparently worried about it, and was typing voluminous notes to myself (the computer version of walking around the house muttering, I think ). In the middle of that, I checked the internet once more, and it had appeared on my bank statement. I think Yi was telling me that everything was okay, that the transaction had been recorded while I was typing about it. The inner, underlying truth was that everything was fine and taken care of, even though I hadn't gotten the external confirmation I expected.

4 as the shadow...maybe if you think of 4 as "Not Knowing," or ignorance, and it meant that I shouldn't remain in that state? Because when I made another attempt to find out, I found that the transaction had appeared.

Maybe that tells me something about hexagram 4, too. I often think of hexagram 4 as "Learning" - but then it wouldn't work as the shadow in this case, since learning (checking the internet once again) was exactly what I should do. So maybe 4 shouldn't be thought of as learning?

(Now I'm not even sure where I got the "learning" idea. Looking at Bradford Hatcher's list of hexagram names, I see that only two or three call hexagram 4 something like learning. The vast majority stick to the inexperience/immaturity types of names.)

Except...I'm pretty sure I've had readings where hexagram 4 really did mean "there's something you don't know about," in the sense that when I found out, it would answer my question. That's a form of learning - when you learn what you don't know, things will become clear. But how would that work as the shadow in this case, where learning what I didn't know is what solved the problem? So I kind of both do and do not understand 4 as the shadow here uch:.

Well there is plenty written about trust and connection in hexagram 60 so perhaps your answer was indicating you could trust ? In 4 you are pretty much in the dark one way or another. Things are not secure or known, perhaps you cannot trust what your understanding tells you in hex 4, there are things you don't know, wheras in hexagram 61 trust can be placed in connections.

Glad you reminded me of that aspect of 61.

Also The Image of 61 from Hilary's book

'Above the lake is wind: Inner Truth.
A noble one deliberates over legal proceedings and delays exectutions'

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In your example I imagine 'executions' would have been sterner measures ? So in effect it seemed to be saying to trust and wait before making a complaint ?

I feel in 4 one has first to accept one doesn't know and one needs to experiment freely to learn. You didn't need to keep checking if trust were being advised although I would probably do the same thing as you and after all checking did no harm but OTOH it didn't make the process, the transaction happen any quicker.


I wonder if 61uc here was 'trust this' ?


BTW I don't think there is that much written on the meaning of the shadow hexagrams or hexagrams of context in terms of how to use them in readings. I think it's still being discovered by everyone. Perhaps it doesn't mean anything at all. It's Karcher's idea I think...so it's still just an idea rather than a well known or used connection to understand answers. I like to see what the shadow is with unchanging hexagrams, I'm still enjoying seeing if it's useful concept or not. I think it's something to play with. If you find it useful, find it works for you, then your knowledge about how it throws some light on your readings is brand new and as valid as anyone's. What if it weren't what not to do and some other aspect of what we perceive as a shadow ?

I don't know....we are all very much explorers with the hexagrams of context I think. Theorists can write theories and see patterns but we need to use them....about parcels, sick cats and so on, to see how they actually work.

Yes, I see what you're saying about how the shadow hexagram is someone's idea, not divine law.

Upon re-reading Hilary's article about shadows and ideals (which includes excerpts from Stephen Karcher's essay), and looking at it through the eyes of my example, there are at least a couple points I missed.

One, which you had already mentioned, is that the shadow represents a mindset you are very much drawn to. In my example, I was really involved with my condition of not knowing, what with all the muttering I did into my computer about it. Granted it was a time-sensitive package, but I wouldn't normally fret that much about a moderately tardy confirmation email.

The other is the idea of a spontaneous solution. Hilary quotes Karcher:

"If you completely release your awareness from these configurations by focusing on the Ideal, the necessary energy the Shadow Site contains will manifest itself spontaneously."

Hilary adds, "so the Shadow hexagram only appears as something that offers its blessings, or solves its problems, by itself."

I can see how my condition of Not Knowing did resolve itself. Somehow that is supposed to happen through the Ideal, which, for hexagram 61, is hexagram 47, Confinement. I'm not sure how confinement in the usual sense applies here, but 47's Oracle text does include the phrase "There are words, no trust," and I hadn't trusted the words of the employee who told me the package had been shipped.

I don't know. I don't want to force things to fit. I think you have the right idea about trying these things in a lot of readings and seeing what happens.

Well here's a nice one. I have been working one-to-one with individuals in a prison setting but have been looking for a short but effective counselling or therapy course to go alongside this work, to support it - but without being too distracting and impractical (ie. 4 years of daily psychoanalysis not really an option). Finally came back to the first course I looked at and asked yi - 'I think I like this course the best, after researching the other options. What do you think?' 61uc.

My initial reaction was one of affirmation, as this seemed 'true' to me. When I checked Wilhelm, I read this:

"Wind over lake: the image of Inner Truth. Thus the superior man discusses criminal cases in order to delay executions.

Image Commentary:

Wind stirs water by penetrating it. Thus the superior man, when obliged to judge the mistakes of men, tries to penetrate their minds with understanding, in order to gain a sympathetic appreciation of the circumstances. In ancient China, the entire administration of justice was guided by this principle. A deep understanding that knows how to pardon was considered the highest form of justice. This system was not without success, for its aim was to make so strong a moral impression that there was no reason to fear abuse of such mildness. For it sprang not from weakness but from a superior clarity."

This "deep understanding that knows how to pardon" is exactly what I'm trying to achieve...! Granted in this case it's rather specific and not necessarily applicable to 'the cat has gone missing'-type question...

ps. I also had 61uc recently when I asked 'shall i buy this desk' - a 2nd hand desk outside a charity shop and at a good price. I was dithering as I have problems with desks, too big, too small, too high, too low, or something not right with them. Anyway, 61uc - so I bought it.

Result? I love it, it's a perfect desk...

pps. just checked through my journal for more examples. Others are less clear-cut, but I think in each instance the yi was telling me 'look inside - you know the truth of this'... a sort of 'trust your intution/inner knowledge' kind of answer. They were all questions that, yes, I knew the truth deep down. Which I guess links to the shadow hex, 4. As in - 'you already know the answer to this'.

I said to Yi, "I really was supposed to blah blah instead of blah blah? Seriously???"

Yi: 61uc

"Yes. Seriously."

i casted this hex a while ago but only now its true meaning is starting to slowly settle in. however, once voiced, written about, put into words - it loses its power, becomes automatically less true...

but i will try anyway... at some point in life i got this pivotal idea that changed my general outlook on pretty much all human relations and even might have changed my core values / adjusted my moral compass. i shared this thought with people closest to me, and while it resonated with some, for some it was a bit of an "aha" moment that gave food for thought, for others it was - okay, whatever, everybody has their own opinion. one friend of mine seemed quite bothered with it though, so we got into a bit of an argument about it that just went on over extended period of time. that person would challenge this truth of mine in every possible way, provoke me to defend it, leading to eventual falling out i wrote about in the unchanging hex 55 thread...

as i'd been wondering about sending final explanation to that person of what this idea actually meant to me, i received unchanging 61 as an advice. at the time i had the image described here by Trojina in mind "the way your teeth feel big in your mouth", as indeed, this was pretty much how i felt about it (and kind of still do whenever i'm to speak of it), so i went on with the best description of my absolutely subjective understanding and feeling of what that truth of mine was...

looking back, though i wouldn't call it a mistake, but more of a lesson, i realise there's a completely different side to it. as mentioned in the beginning, that truth, although filling every inch of my being, once voiced - becomes subjective, thus just only partially true... and partially a lie we cannot share the inner truth with anyone by talking about it.

but as long as it's carried quietly within - it's not at all subjective, it is universally and objectively true.
this, i believe, is what the judgment talks about (referring to wilhelm's translation) - when dealing with pigs and fishes - creatures that are most difficult to influence, the force of inner truth must grow great before its influence can extend to them...

i believe there are universal truths in this life that we all can find and attain, but it's not by putting them on the plate in front of others, that they can learn about them - once we're lucky enough to find them, we can only carry them through in our being, if they're to ever reach minds or hearts of other people. kinda sad, but true - to me at least

i read this great metaphor somewhere about playing hide and seek - imagine you're a kid, closing your eyes, finishing the countdown, and once you open your eyes again - all other kids are standing right in front of you. in a way - you win! you found them all. but where's fun in that?

so if we find some truth (and cast hex 61), maybe the advice is - let's not spoil the game for others (they might even get so outraged at being given the truth they simply won't take it) - but rather help them have fun and continue the game...

For me, 61uc (as an open weekly reading) confirmed it being about feelings of confidence, reassurance, and things working out in the end. Note that "in the end," however, meant that things weren't always smooth sailing. In that, the serenity prayer came into mind a number of times: "God [or concept of choice] grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference":

Mon., a first day of housesitting and landscapers working there broke a water main. I wandered about a bit wondering what to do, but thankfully it was repaired within a few hours. That same day, I received an email from the county saying the building permit I´d been waiting for for two years needed still more revisions (after scrambling to take care of what I thought were final revisions the week prior to housesitting) and I couldn´t do anything about it because I was out of the area all week. Missing the window of permit approval meant possibly delaying the project yet another year because contractors are so unbelievably booked up in my area. My contractor, however, stepped in and went out of his way to take revised drawings to the county the next day and work out additional corrections on the spot and the permit was approved by the end of the week. To my great relief, all was well.

Tue., I got stuck in an elevator on the way up to work. It came to abrubt stop and the doors wouldn´t open. Fortunately someone answered right away when I pressed the alarm button and they called for someone to help me out right away. The doors had to be pried open and I saw the elevator was about a foot higher than where I was supposed to be! Thankfully, no harm done.

Wed., this time the landscapers blew a fuse when using an outdoor outlet, so I woke up to no electricity in one of the main rooms I was using. I couldn't find the breaker box, so worked around it the best I could, then on my way out to work, found the breaker box in the garage, so was able to reset it and have electricity the rest of the week.

Fri., I was able to step in and easily help out a new coworker struggling to deal with a medical emergency at work.

Sat.. on and off throughout the week, I'd also been providing emotional support in the form of calls or emails to a woman whose life had been devastated by life´s twists and turns. I'd had to measure what I was able to provide, however, considering my own situation and limited amount of time and resources. On Sat., we had lunch together and were able to celebrate an almost unbelievable story of how life had completely turned around for her in a major way either by her navigating things or by things falling miraculously into place. A great ending to the week.

Last night a man invited me over to his house to watch a movie. Tired from work but excited to see him I queried Yi: "How should I respond to X's invitation to watch a movie tonight?" and received 61UC in response. I decided to join him for a movie and Mr. X picked me up at work. A minute or two after merging into traffic X informed me that he was married and that anything we did together would have to remain secret. Inner Truth indeed.

Never went to his house, never saw the movie but I did thank him for telling me the truth when he took me back to the parking lot where my car was sitting.

One of my cats is on two kinds of diet, special low-protein kidney-disease food, and also weight loss. He is not happy. Cats are obligate carnivores, so while lower-protein food is medically necessary, it's surely not satisfying, and to top it off he's not getting as much as he wants.

Among other signs of discontent, he's been chewing on everything else in the house (cardboard, plastic, pieces of mail, rugs), which isn't good for him or the things being chewed. I'd asked Yi why, and got 27uc: "Your own quest for something real to fill your mouth" - he's looking for something to eat that he considers real food, and isn't finding it.

In yet another attempt to figure out how best to deal with all this, I asked, "Yi, if he understood he needs diets and could talk to me, what would he say?" 61 unchanging.

What I've gleaned so far:

• "I understand," (says cat) "but I can't relate to this!" (The unchangingness.) "My tummy is empty!" (Hole in middle of hexagram. ) "Piglets and fishes are indeed good fortune - so where are mine??"
  
  
• 61 is about trust, and so is this problem. The diets aren't satisfying, he doesn't trust his food supply, and so he's anxious.
  
  
• Hexagram 4, Not Knowing, is the Shadow hexagram (count back 61 places from the end, a.k.a. 65 - 61. See this pdf (direct download link) from Stephen Karcher who discovered the Shadow, Hilary's Quick Insights course on the Shadow, and a couple of Hilary's blog articles here and here).
  
  The premise of my question was "if he understood." (I thought I needed that in order to make the question even slightly reasonable.) But *I* need to understand that the problem isn't that he doesn't know (which of course he doesn't), it's that even if he did understand, it wouldn't help much - he'd still be hungry and upset. That's true for humans, too, right? Understanding the reason for badness might help us bear up but doesn't really fix anything.
  
  
• Sequence from 60: 'Measuring and also trusting it, and so Inner Truth follows.' This is the most practical advice so far: it immediately told me I have to try even harder to measure out his food over the day so there's always something available - don't let his dishes get completely empty. That will help him trust it.
  
  
• Paired hexagram (another Quick Insights course, course sample, blog article) with 62: 'Small Exceeding steps over the line; Inner Truth means trust.' Pretty much everything Hilary says in her commentary (in her book and also included in Resonance Journal):

  With Inner Truth, you have complete confidence; things feel stable and dependable. Small Exceeding is the opposite experience: stepping out into the world, feeling small, exposed and out of balance, constantly aware of the need to adapt.

  Click to expand...

  My cat is experiencing the 62 side right now, so he'd tell me that has to be turned around. I think this might partly have to do with advice from the vet to enrich his catly experience by hiding his food around the apartment. These diggers are great things - I have four; he hunts for them and gets exercise - but I wonder under the circumstances if I should move them around less? Not sure yet about this one.

Thoughts upon receiving 61uc this morning re inner change by focusing on positives (anchoring the good; turning things around, seeing constructive solutions or possibilities in situations I don't have a lot of power within)

The "pigs & fishes" are tuned to natural rhythms, like waves & currents in rivers & streams, an undulating flow; like salmon rising & flashing out of the water (Well, once we had rivers & shores teeming with fish ) Both were once sources of wealth & prosperity, fish & pigs - we have a saying in Ireland about "being on the pigs back" as in a quick way to make a lot of money, without much land + pigs will eat anything, rubbish included, but not everyone would do it, as it was seem as dirty & low class compared to the more 'noble' cattle rearing (which was wealth/money here since prob late Neolithic); same with fish, a smelly but lucrative activity, gutting, boning, boiling up bones to make glue (tallow from pigs too - light)

Perhaps the pigs & fishes show us how the natural rhythms are flowing & 61uc is reminding us that the object of our inquiry is still distant to us, because it's a bit idealised, we're not paying enough attention to the "pigs & fishes", but no worries yet, as we are still deliberating & should refrain from judgement "deciding criminal cases" yet anyway?

Neither fish nor swine need expensive feeding or vast land tracts & can be lucrative if you aren't afraid of the dirty work involved; but 61uc perhaps just involves including these aspects of life (or what they symbolise) in your deliberations on your matter / subject of inquiry?
For all of human history up until recently (certainly at the time of the yijing transcription), there were always fish in the ocean & pigs or pig type creatures in the woods & heaths; so "there is always work, for those willing to do it"

Wing writes of 61 unchanging

The upper trigram of penetrating efforts, SUN, is enhanced and amplified by the rising lower trigram, TUI, openness. Hence an open attitude achieves true penetration and INSIGHT into the situation. This must be accomplished before any action can take place. In it's static state this hexagram suggests that the object of your inquiry cannot be affected at all, nor will it affect you, until a sincere rapport is established. Begin on this immediately.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

There's an everflowing abundant source of natural energy & flow that you need to find a rapport with to understand your area of inquiry with more depth & the "pigs and fishes" in the situation can help you see & understand these natural rhythms better, whilst still not judging, or finalising your query, or punishing wrong doing, because there is none in the situation, or the 'criminal activity' is not apparent yet, perhaps never will be?

The "judgement" aspect, to me, is reminding me of a case in early Irish Law (8th or 9thC) where a man's sheep got into a queens woad field & et the whole crop (woad is a plant prized for it's blue dye, it was used in Europe before cheap indigo came from colonisation); so the queen, very upset, called for the Brehon (judge) to kill the sheep; however the Brehon (Irish Breitheamh) pronounced that woad produced crop every year, as did the sheep & so ordered the herd sheared & the wool given to the queen!
It makes me think about older legal systems & that perhaps there was one in ancient China, where a legal matter would have to wait a season or two before a situation could become visible or apparent, or a judgment could be ascertained?

So it could also mean "Please let thing develop & mature a bit more & also, observe other flows going on around, under & 'background' to your own query"?

For me right now, relating to the above query, it means - let the situation mature, let it continue to flow, refrain from judgement, be open, stay nourished, everything comes back around to fullness again; this is how you turn things around, a bit of patience to understand natural cycles



(Oh to make it go quicker, - Think of Mendel with his fruit flies & peas - quicker than mice, but still, he had to wait a few generations)

based on an experience that details I will spare you, I think that maybe 4 as shadow means that with 61 you have your own truth, and even though you know that this is your very own personal reality, you DO know it. In this case it is not good to question it and say you don't know (4), and although the outcome of following my own truth may not be the most desirable, 1 - I cannot abandon my core ethical values. 2 - I have to give a chance to the other side to hear it and correct themselves, it is up to them if they give this trust or not.