hi i am in a situation where i was dating an Indian male (I am American) for two years and we split for a period and working things, but I had to get renew my visa. When I was gone, his family got him engaged. He is much older than is usual in India for such things (nearly 40), but somehow--by what means I do not know how--they got him to go ahead. Maybe he doubted my return. When I finally got back, I know he tried to see me but the family found out I was back, and turned up the heat. When I last spoke to him, he was very distressed and sounded nothing like himself, and he asked me not to contact him. I asked him whether this was a permanent thing, and he told me that he would let me know.

At first, I complied with he is request to give him time to handle the situation, but then I began texting from time to time because he told me that he was not very good in the first few minutes of the conversation i know that there is a lot of pressure, and there is money involved (as in dowry, etc) I asked the Yi the following questions, and honestly, my heart is so involved, I cant make heads or tails of what is going on, so am asking for some help...

How does he see this woman? 14 > 1 (14.5>1)
Will he go through with the marriage? (14.5 >1)

How does he see me? 45 >58 (sorry i lost the changing lines here, but i know the first one changes)

How can I best proceed in this matter to have the outcome that I wish to achieve 63 > 1
63.2.4.6 > 1

I was trying to phrase a question that would get to an outcome between he and

If there are any other questions that you think might be better phrased or perhaps would glean more insight, please feel free to pose questions...Also, not sure how to do timeslines with the i-ching as i am a pretty much a beginner and am learning...

Thanks!

You must understand that marriage has nothing to do with love, except in lands where Rousseau's romantic love took hold. Marriage is an institution established for economic, dynastic, or political reasons. The ancient Chinese also separated loved from marriage. It appears to me that the man is very compatible with his arranged mate, and that she has some kind of money involved here and he must comply with his family's wishes. She may be well off economically, and hence why his family is pushing hard for this match. It appears to me that he will marry her.

As for you, he obviously loves you. The 45 to 58 with the first lines changing doesn't mean that he doesn't love you. He does. However, love has nothing to do with marriage. From 63 to 1 says to move on. You have gone has far as you have gone with the man, and now you must begin again. 63 generally requires a quick marriage or else it won't happen. I think you may be too late.

If you need to ask another question, perhaps the best might be: What are the consequences of me attempting to prevent X's arranged marriage?

I think 14.5 suggests he will act from his truth, whatever that is.
Maybe he needs time to be strong enough to tell his parents his true feelings and act on them (hex 1)

45.1,2 > 58
The first line seems to reflect your separation and return. Perhaps no he didn't expect you to come back, which is why he allowed himself to be carried along by his parents' arranged marriage plans? But now that you're back - 'one grasp of the hand and you can laugh again' - you need to make sure he knows you're serious about him - give 'expression to this need'.
45.2 is nice because it suggests you can relax. That you know and understand eachother. But perhaps that's only if you express your true feelings to him (line 1) and you can then progress to this stage. Where it's only a matter of time before fate/mutual interest leads you together again.
58. suggests to me he is stimulated by the exchange between you two. You have fun together - a good partnership. two lakes better than one. So all in all a valuable and mutual relationship is suggested.

63>1
Hmm I think hex 63 suggests that the conclusion is already in motion. Do you have any instincts about what it is?

Line 2 suggests don't panic and chase him. 'That which is a man's own cannot be permanently lost. He need only be able to wait.' So try and believe in yourself and your relationship and don't resort to grand or panic stricken gestures to get him back.
Line 4 I think suggests you make clear that this sort of damage - his parents causing a leak in the boat of your relationship - shouldn't happen again. Maybe they will keep interfering unless you change the form of your relationship... I don't want to presume anything but, could you marry him instead I'm sure it may not be that simple. But doing that could reflect getting into another boat, rather than having to keep plugging holes in a more casual relationship that is vulnerable to outside influence and undermining...
Line 6 A reminder not to dwell on what has happened - the two of you to move forward.. once the situation is cleared up. Not to doubt that its the right conclusion... It's hard to say though what that is - although 45>58 is positive for a relationship. I suppose it could mean that you end up wanting to get out of the situation altogether - find another boat, not compromise your dignity (if you feel he's taken something from you unfairly) and move on... Do you deeply care for him enough to commit? Or do you think making a new start alone would be better? Hex 1 fits in here again as new beginnings - either within the relationship, or without.

Hope that makes sense and helps.

:bows:

Hi!
Thanks so much to both of you for your help! Yes the marriage thing is a cultural issue of large proportions. Love marriages in the big cities like Bombay where I am located are quite common now, and the Indians here have been watching "Friends, "The Good Wife, "Desperate Housewives," "Sex and City," "24," "Ghost Whisperer," etc etc etc -- most for years. So they have been influenced (badly or well debatable!), but, yes, still arranged marriages are still the norm but not as much between total strangers.

He is definitely aware that I love him, think we should be together, etc. I have a feeling that the family has convinced him on some level that Americans don't know how to stay in marriages, etc., and the continual pressure on him as made him severely confused and the fact that he has not seen me has worsened matters between us.

I would also tell you that, I realized much later, that my computer (I use a computer to throw the coins) for whatever reason, whenever I tried to get the outcome, REPEATED the response of previous question which had nothing to do with the outcome. I don't know I did realize it at the time with one of the questions, but no the first time it happened (probably just overwhelmed by the whole thing), and only discovered when I was asking questions about a different situation...so

I asked the yi again:

Will he go through with the marriage:

I received 6 > 10 (6.1 > 10)

Also,
SINCE I ASKED HOW SHOULD I PROCEED TO ACHIEVE THE OUTCOME THAT I WANT:

63

Water above fire, already across
The noble one takes thought of misfortune and guards against it

So from what I understand water above fire is like a kettle, so things are already at the boiling point...

To me, given the image of the boiling kettle, this would mean that the steps I have taken to date are enough and the wise person but be wise and make sure that the situation doesnt deteriorate further either by too much complacency or by too much force

OR

what i have said and done to date are enough (crossed) and my part is over, and i need to protect myself from further harm.

Changing line 2: She loses her carriage curtain. Do not run after it. In seven days it will be recovered.

Sine I know that carriage curtains were a matter of propriety according to my research, this line suggests that:

This is warning not to lose all propriety, but now to sit back and let him realize my worth or self-promote. Let him figure it out.

Changing line 4:

The finest clothes turn to rags. Be careful all day long.

So again since I have asked HOW TO PROCEED, i think that the yi is saying to know that even the best situations can deteriorate, so to keep vigilant and making sure that things do not deteriorate between us.

"His head is in the water. Misfortune."

Research: The man who has safely crossed water, and then gets his head wet, can only have done so by turning back. If he goes forward without looking back, however, he will escape misfortune.

So I agree with you em ching here, i would add that don't spend time thinking about what has already taken place as a predictor for the future...or don't look at what has happened, look what can happen

AND I THINK THAT IS WHERE HEXAGRAM 1 comes in...


And since it changes to 1:

I noticed that when I asked originally about her and how he sees her, it ended in a 1 would suggest that the energy is STILL WORKING in this situation so don't give up. Perhaps, the Universe is not wanting me to know an outcome just yet. I had mentioned earlier that when I asked "would he go through with the marriage?"...I got a repeat of the question "how does he see her?" in my earlier post, i thought perhaps because i was using a computer and the cookies did not clear.

It would be really interesting if the Yi was withholding the outcome.

But one also suggests that there is time and not to give up. to continue to pursue the matter, but with propriety and firmness and to wait it out.

Any thoughts?

on further thinking:

the yi would suggest that if both situations go to hexagram 1:

both of us end up in new beginnings which means that he will go through with the marriage.

I don't know now because am too upset to read it all!

I would ask why he is going along with his family's request and what he wants from you at this point.

How does he see this woman?

14.5
He whose truth is accessible, yet dignified,
Has good fortune.

It is interesting that you mention how difficult it has been for you to be able to communicate with your friend and that when you have he comes across as being very confused - thus he is neither accessible nor dignified. This leads me to believe he does not see this woman as "good fortune."
-

Will he go through with the marriage?

6.1
If one does not perpetuate the affair,
There is a little gossip.
In the end, good fortune comes.

This reads to me that it is not too late for him to get out of the arrangement, but it could also be read that he decides not to fight it, not to perpetuate the conflict. If he does go along with the plan it may be that it is not such a bad thing for him after all.
-

How does he see you?

45.1
If you are sincere but not to the end,
There will sometimes be confusion, sometimes gathering together.
If you call out,
Then one grasp of the hand and you can laugh again.
Regret not. Going is without blame.

Hmm..who is the "you" in this? Was he the one who was sincere, but not to the end, or are you the one who left him? Either way it reads as if to say that if he really cared, just hearing your voice would remind him and you two could be together again.

45.2
Letting oneself be drawn
Brings good fortune and remains blameless.
If one is sincere,
It furthers one to bring even a small offering.

If he were truly drawn to you, he would follow his inner feeling and be blameless.
No huge dowery would be necessary.

Here again I think the I Ching is not so much telling you how he feels, but rather telling you how someone who truly loved you would act. If he really cared the confusion and separation that caused you to part would be quickly forgotten when he heard your voice and he would also be able to convince his family that you are drawn to each other as soul mates so they would understand and not blame him.

So far it reads to me as if to say that he's not truly sold on this arranged marriage and he could get out of it if he wanted to stand up for himself. However, it doesn't sound to me as if he is going to do that. 45.1 suggests he would have turned things around immediately, at the sound of your voice, if that were going to happen.

As for what you should do to get the out come you would prefer, I think 63. is telling you to act as if as far as you are concerned it is over. Don't call, don't look back. Perhaps that is what he needs to cause him to grow strong enough to stand up to his family, but that is not your concern. You must go forward.
-rosada

This is an old thread I had started, but I want to report that he did (or his family did) breakthe engagement.