22 uc for a bad relationship ending

[summermoon]

Hello everyone, I am hoping for some insights on 22 uc. My relationship ended this year and things got gradually worse between me and my now ex. Last two conversations involved a lot of insults and belittling of me and there has been no apology or remorse shown for any of it. It got ugly so to speak. I am very heartbroken and in disbelief how can they speak to me with so much hatred and disdain. So I asked the Yi whether it’s over for good between us and got 22 unchanged. I’m really baffled as to how to translate this to the situation. My ex is someone involved in the arts and also quite narcissistic so I can see how it could be a reflection on them but not the question I asked.
Any insights? Thank you in advance!

 

[moss elk]

I think Yi is talking to you.

 

[summermoon]

I think Yi is talking to you.

Reflect on what this guy is singing about.
Some truths are ugly. Some people are ugly when they drop their veneer.

Many of us have this mechanism to overlook the bad, and tell ourselves things are better than they are. It is very common. I've done it too, more times than I care to admit, and suffered for doing it each time.

Thank you for your response.
I have not overlooked the bad. It’s a thorn in my face if anything right not because I am beyond belief that the person who claimed to love me so much would talk to me with so much hatred and contempt. I asked if we are over for good ; I got 22uc . I hope for an apology at the very least so it doesn’t make any sense to me at all. In any case , I am not deluded or looking through rose coloured glasses.

 

[moss elk]

I am beyond..

Can you be surprised by someone you truly know?

 

[steve]

Hi,
22 "can" be about facades, in the sense you can be advised to get real about things. Many times, you are dealing with the ego or lower self. The advice you have is not condescending, although I know what you mean. Basically, are things really what they seem? Why tolerate someone being rude to you if you do not have to take it? You would not take that from a stranger.

The above advice is correct I believe. Its just how you take it, its not unsual for ex partners to become complete strangers.

I have had quite a lot of relationships and break ups. Relationships to me even a marriage, are only intense friendships. Marriages are more like intense friendships mixed with business. In any friendship, people find oneday, sometimes, that they have nothing in common with that person or dont anymore or possibly never did. Or other people have different ideas about what a friendship/relationship means.

Do not be shocked on how humans act, they will never cease to amaze you on how awful they can be at times. Let your ex yell at someone else, whoever that unfortunate person will be, at the moment its you.

Be well,

 

[summermoon]

Hi,
22 "can" be about facades, in the sense you can be advised to get real about things. Many times, you are dealing with the ego or lower self. The advice you have is not condescending, although I know what you mean. Basically, are things really what they seem? Why tolerate someone being rude to you if you do not have to take it? You would not take that from a stranger.

The above advice is correct I believe. Its just how you take it, its not unsual for ex partners to become complete strangers.

I have had quite a lot of relationships and break ups. Relationships to me even a marriage, are only intense friendships. Marriages are more like intense friendships mixed with business. In any friendship, people find oneday, sometimes, that they have nothing in common with that person or dont anymore or possibly never did. Or other people have different ideas about what a friendship/relationship means.

Do not be shocked on how humans act, they will never cease to amaze you on how awful they can be at times. Let your ex yell at someone else, whoever that unfortunate person will be, at the moment its you.

Be well,

Thank you for your comment. Pretty on the outside, not so much on the inside, that was my major take from this. It’s still unclear if I’ll get that apology or was this the final end.

 

[Trojina]

Hello everyone, I am hoping for some insights on 22 uc. My relationship ended this year and things got gradually worse between me and my now ex. Last two conversations involved a lot of insults and belittling of me and there has been no apology or remorse shown for any of it. It got ugly so to speak. I am very heartbroken and in disbelief how can they speak to me with so much hatred and disdain. So I asked the Yi whether it’s over for good between us and got 22 unchanged. I’m really baffled as to how to translate this to the situation. My ex is someone involved in the arts and also quite narcissistic so I can see how it could be a reflection on them but not the question I asked.
Any insights? Thank you in advance!

22 can often be a baffling answer when it just doesn't seem to fit at all. Have you seen this thread

Your Experiences with Unchanging Castings - Hexagram 22

There was a long thread on 22 here http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?14838-Question-on-22 in CC where I got some good feedback discussing my bizarre 22 answers, and 22uc in particular. I had noticed 22 uc coming up for pretty odd, almost 'tableaux' type scenarios where...

www.onlineclarity.co.uk

One I didn't write about there, it's pretty distant in my memory but I recall getting it for a similarish situation where what was romantic became dark and I couldn't figure it. I couldn't figure it because I was too close to see it. I think your 22 here might be saying something similar maybe.

In 22 one can only see the immediate, the shapes of the fire on the mountain, trigrams mountain over fire. Think of looking up and seeing the flames casting shadows, flickering on the mountain. That image doesn't necessarily tell one about the nature of the mountain nor the nature of the fire but coming together they make an image of the reality of that moment.

Oracle
'Beauty. Creating success.
Small harvest in having a direction to go.'

Image

'Below the mountain is fire. Beauty.
The noble one brings light to the many standards, but does not venture to judge legal cases.'

That last line of the Image stands out here, the Image is generally advising ideal action particularly with no change lines IMO.

It's like you can see some of this, you can see some of what was between you in the way someone might see the shadows of fire dancing on the mountain. Yes I see the mountain and yes I see the fire but I cannot make clear mental assessments of either of these as elements in themselves via this image. I won't know from looking at this a mountain is hard and fire is hot. Think of a baby watching sun shadows playing on the walls. The baby only sees the fluid patterns it makes it cannot know from that that the wall is hard and the sun is at a particular angle, what it sees is the 22 of it. Beautiful and expressing something but not the whole reality of the thing.

So as others have said it is likely Yi is highlighting just like an infant seeing the sun playing on the wall that is what you see in the relationship. What you see of him isn't necessarily a good guide to who he is or what he's doing. It depends of course on how long you've been together. That's going to be harder to apply as an interpretation if you have been together 5 years and easier to apply if you have been together 2 years.

You are asking if it is over and I think Yi is sidestepping the question a little. This isn't a matter of whether it's over but what you see when you see him. What was there? It may be when you do see him with more distance it's automatically over because he isn't who you think he is. What was grand theatre on the night when the fire flickered on the mountain and made a spectacle is not so in the morning. Then it would be as if one asked of that night with the spectacle of the shadows on the mountain 'is it over?'. You see what I mean, if someone said 'is it over' one might say well the image of the fire on the mountain is created by certain factors, it's not always there, it's not there in daylight with no fire.

A good thread on 22 is this one, lots of good ideas from Bradford I think

The Angels of Grace, A Spiritual Take on Hexagram 22 as an expression of grace…

This is my own take on Hexagram 22- I’m only new to the I-ching but this is what I’ve come up with so far!! To me grace is something real and very tangible. Grace is the energy of blessings/gifts from the Universe/god/the Earth and of course the angels! I work with angels and other energy...

www.onlineclarity.co.uk

I'm not sure how much the ideas I've outlined above will apply in your situation but it's something to think about anyway. Also if he is your ex why is he still insulting you and so on, he's meant to be gone rather than still engaging isn't he ? Don't spend time with those who insult you. In time you may see him as entirely different to how you see him now, you may not really see him well at all now. That is why the Image says

The noble one brings light to the many standards, but does not venture to judge legal cases.'

It's saying you cannot really hope to make a clear judgement on this at the moment. You're looking at behaviours and so on but as yet you maybe cannot make a 'clear case' for yourself on what is happening to you.


How long had you been together ?

 

[summermoon]

22 can often be a baffling answer when it just doesn't seem to fit at all. Have you seen this thread

Your Experiences with Unchanging Castings - Hexagram 22

There was a long thread on 22 here http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?14838-Question-on-22 in CC where I got some good feedback discussing my bizarre 22 answers, and 22uc in particular. I had noticed 22 uc coming up for pretty odd, almost 'tableaux' type scenarios where...

www.onlineclarity.co.uk

One I didn't write about there, it's pretty distant in my memory but I recall getting it for a similarish situation where what was romantic became dark and I couldn't figure it. I couldn't figure it because I was too close to see it. I think your 22 here might be saying something similar maybe.

In 22 one can only see the immediate, the shapes of the fire on the mountain, trigrams mountain over fire. Think of looking up and seeing the flames casting shadows, flickering on the mountain. That image doesn't necessarily tell one about the nature of the mountain nor the nature of the fire but coming together they make an image of the reality of that moment.

Oracle
'Beauty. Creating success.
Small harvest in having a direction to go.'

Image

'Below the mountain is fire. Beauty.
The noble one brings light to the many standards, but does not venture to judge legal cases.'

That last line of the Image stands out here, the Image is generally advising ideal action particularly with no change lines IMO.

It's like you can see some of this, you can see some of what was between you in the way someone might see the shadows of fire dancing on the mountain. Yes I see the mountain and yes I see the fire but I cannot make clear mental assessments of either of these as elements in themselves via this image. I won't know from looking at this a mountain is hard and fire is hot. Think of a baby watching sun shadows playing on the walls. The baby only sees the fluid patterns it makes it cannot know from that that the wall is hard and the sun is at a particular angle, what it sees is the 22 of it. Beautiful and expressing something but not the whole reality of the thing.

So as others have said it is likely Yi is highlighting just like an infant seeing the sun playing on the wall that is what you see in the relationship. What you see of him isn't necessarily a good guide to who he is or what he's doing. It depends of course on how long you've been together. That's going to be harder to apply as an interpretation if you have been together 5 years and easier to apply if you have been together 2 years.

You are asking if it is over and I think Yi is sidestepping the question a little. This isn't a matter of whether it's over but what you see when you see him. What was there? It may be when you do see him with more distance it's automatically over because he isn't who you think he is. What was grand theatre on the night when the fire flickered on the mountain and made a spectacle is not so in the morning. Then it would be as if one asked of that night with the spectacle of the shadows on the mountain 'is it over?'. You see what I mean, if someone said 'is it over' one might say well the image of the fire on the mountain is created by certain factors, it's not always there, it's not there in daylight with no fire.

A good thread on 22 is this one, lots of good ideas from Bradford I think

The Angels of Grace, A Spiritual Take on Hexagram 22 as an expression of grace…

This is my own take on Hexagram 22- I’m only new to the I-ching but this is what I’ve come up with so far!! To me grace is something real and very tangible. Grace is the energy of blessings/gifts from the Universe/god/the Earth and of course the angels! I work with angels and other energy...

www.onlineclarity.co.uk

I'm not sure how much the ideas I've outlined above will apply in your situation but it's something to think about anyway. Also if he is your ex why is he still insulting you and so on, he's meant to be gone rather than still engaging isn't he ? Don't spend time with those who insult you. In time you may see him as entirely different to how you see him now, you may not really see him well at all now. That is why the Image says


It's saying you cannot really hope to make a clear judgement on this at the moment. You're looking at behaviours and so on but as yet you maybe cannot make a 'clear case' for yourself on what is happening to you.


How long had you been together ?

Hi Trojina,
Thanks for taking the time to respond. We were together for four years, lots of drama and broken up twice before. It was never a peaceful relationship, long distance made it even harder. This time … they broke up with me at a bad time for my mental health and I spiralled. They didn’t want to deal with any of this, no support whatsoever. But my mental health spiralled badly as a result of how they were speaking to me, berating me, telling me how they didn’t want me but also insulting me. Very harsh words that totally ruined the little self esteem I had left and so I spiralled. I got some help for my mental health and was hoping to continue the connection. They used to call me family and soulmate. I thought, despite relationship status we can still maintain some connection and friendship. They turned extremely cold and stopped all communication for a month and last time we exchanged messages they were extremely rude and spoke with hatred. I can’t make any sense of this, especially remembering the last month we spent together over Christmas as a family. The day I got 22 was also a day where I saw a picture of them on social media, all dressed up nicely and performing. They are an artist and somewhat popular in their community, they perform as a musician and a comedian. Partly the reason why they ended the relationship with me was because of being a minor celebrity and getting attention from a lot of people. So I can see how 22 can be applied to this and the picture I saw that day but it didn’t really answer my question. I can see the pretty facade of them but I know what’s truly underneath all this and maybe this is what the Yi was telling me. All I want however is an apology and a face to face conversation as I deserve respect and I have been denied this.

 

[Trojina]

On the one hand you say in the title the relationship ended but go on to say all the spiteful ways he is continuing the relationship with you. Giving insults is in a sense, if ongoing, still having some kind of relationship.

But my mental health spiralled badly as a result of how they were speaking to me, berating me, telling me how they didn’t want me but also insulting me. Very harsh words that totally ruined the little self esteem I had left and so I spiralled. I got some help for my mental health and was hoping to continue the connection.

A question a detached observer might ask 'why ?' You say he has totally ruined your self esteem, rejected you and insulted you but you still want to continue the connection ? What for? He has nothing at all to offer you and is indeed injurious to you.

I can’t make any sense of this, especially remembering the last month we spent together over Christmas as a family.

Yes, quite, you aren't meant to be able to make any sense of it that way you stay hooked, not understanding, waiting for the next morsel of affection to be thrown your way. If he acted consistently one way or the other he wouldn't have you hooked on his total lack of anything real to offer at all.

I can see the pretty facade of them but I know what’s truly underneath all this and maybe this is what the Yi was telling me. All I want however is an apology and a face to face conversation as I deserve respect and I have been denied this.

To the contrary your words show you really don't know what's underneath all this, you can't see him for what he is at all by the sound of it. To an onlooker it's clear he's a complete twat and the best thing you could possibly do is drop him. If you did of course he'd likely come running back and be nice again for a while and then just when you thought it was okay he'd destroy you again. The reason he would do that is he'd still want the power to screw up your emotions.

There is a great deal of stuff online about this pattern you are in here. I know it's hard when you are in it, you can't see clearly but the first step is to realise you can't see this with enough distance to have any clarity about it at all

Neither an apology nor a face to face will bring you resolution, he will do it again and again. That's pretty much a given. So do you want to spend the next years in this tortuous cycle?

The day I got 22 was also a day where I saw a picture of them on social media, all dressed up nicely and performing. They are an artist and somewhat popular in their community, they perform as a musician and a comedian. Partly the reason why they ended the relationship with me was because of being a minor celebrity and getting attention from a lot of people. So I can see how 22 can be applied to this and the picture I saw that day but it didn’t really answer my question.

Personally I don't think the 22uc here has anything to do with him being a performer at all. The 22 here is about your range of perception in this. I do think you may have missed the point of the replies here.

 

[summermoon]

On the one hand you say in the title the relationship ended but go on to say all the spiteful ways he is continuing the relationship with you. Giving insults is in a sense, if ongoing, still having some kind of relationship.


A question a detached observer might ask 'why ?' You say he has totally ruined your self esteem, rejected you and insulted you but you still want to continue the connection ? What for? He has nothing at all to offer you and is indeed injurious to you.


Yes, quite, you aren't meant to be able to make any sense of it that way you stay hooked, not understanding, waiting for the next morsel of affection to be thrown your way. If he acted consistently one way or the other he wouldn't have you hooked on his total lack of anything real to offer at all.


To the contrary your words show you really don't know what's underneath all this, you can't see him for what he is at all by the sound of it. To an onlooker it's clear he's a complete twat and the best thing you could possibly do is drop him. If you did of course he'd likely come running back and be nice again for a while and then just when you thought it was okay he'd destroy you again. The reason he would do that is he'd still want the power to screw up your emotions.

There is a great deal of stuff online about this pattern you are in here. I know it's hard when you are in it, you can't see clearly but the first step is to realise you can't see this with enough distance to have any clarity about it at all

Neither an apology nor a face to face will bring you resolution, he will do it again and again. That's pretty much a given. So do you want to spend the next years in this tortuous cycle?



Personally I don't think the 22uc here has anything to do with him being a performer at all. The 22 here is about your range of perception in this. I do think you may have missed the point of the replies here.

Thank you for your response. There’s a lot to consider in all this and I am taking what everyone said on board. You are right in that there has been a pattern here and I have enabled a lot of it. Always hoping they’d be better as they are great with all their friends and everyone loves them pretty much. I have responsibility for my own reaction in all this and it has not been something I am proud of. Why I am hoping for a conversation so I feel that my humanity is restored as right now I don’t seem human in their eyes, especially one they’ve claimed to love.

 

[Trojina]

Always hoping they’d be better as they are great with all their friends and everyone loves them pretty much.

Just wondering whose story that is? The story that everyone loves them and so there must be something wrong with you if there are problems in the relationship. I can't tell from here other than it seems a common story. You are the 'wrong' one begging for a chance from this demi god to have another chance to be human.

Why I am hoping for a conversation so I feel that my humanity is restored as right now I don’t seem human in their eyes, especially one they’ve claimed to love.

It's understandable to think that way given the amount of power over you he has, understandable that you might think you will be an alright person again if he will talk again and make you a human. Truth is though he doesn't even remotely have any claim or right to any such power he just duped you into thinking he had and you didn't see it. I doubt everyone who knows him loves him either.

An antidote might a good dose of insulting from you to him, doesn't need to be to his face of course that might only make matters worse and give more ammunition to his narrative of you as the one that is currently less than human. But in your head can you try to see him as a bit of a prat? That might help and sounds like he probably is anyway. It can be childish I know but needs must, this man needs demotion from the pedestal in your head. Currently it is as if you are in the position of a beggar, begging to be accepted, to be made into a decent person. But truth is you already are, you don't have to beg at all. Try thinking of the times you have secretly thought him a bit of a dick and get him off that pedestal.

The question isn't really if he will come back to you because he will the minute he sees you don't need him probably. But that doesn't mean it's a good idea to take him back as he will rerun the whole rollercoaster again, compromising your mental health again. The above isn't especially from 22uc btw and of course I don't know the whole story but believing him talking to you will restore your humanity is a very common kind of trap one can get into when somehow one has made another person far elevated above oneself.