Clarity,
Office 17622,
PO Box 6945,
London.
W1A 6US
United Kingdom
Phone/ Voicemail:
+44 (0)20 3287 3053 (UK)
+1 (561) 459-4758 (US).
I get several changing lines.
Do I read their characteristics as something that is NOT there - because they are changing into something else?
Or I read them as Pointing out at the actual cause of things?
So do i answer to my question by looking at these lines which say this that and that.
OR I look at these lines as something that IS NOT THERE - because they change...
OR I look at these lines as some sort of guidance or advice - addressing my problem - for example as if Yi is saying : DO THIS, DO THAT AND THAT.
My question is how to read your casting.
I am usually throwing coins, so my energy is there
It was equally important to read changed lines in the second hexagram. They seemed to supplement or give direct advice
with regard to reading.
Trojina,
I am sorry I meant we are reading moving lines right but also those in the second hexagram that correspond to these moving lines (in the 1st hexagram) - to get a clear picture right?
Like you and others were saying when it's only one moving line - it is enough to read it only. But when there are several - you look both to what has changed and what has been produced.
That is what I meant
I meant if for example you get 1.2.3 (two lines changing in hexagram 1) - you need to look at the produced hexagram - same lines - 2 and 3 as well.????
You can see from this thread there are numerous ways to handle interpreting change lines but I don't think any of them involve divining from the corresponding lines in the second hexagram.
you can always explore more complex options later.
My question is how to read your casting.
No innertruth where did you get that idea from ? If you have 2 changing lines in the primary hexagram those are the ones relevant to you. You do not need to look at the corresponding lines in the second hexagram.
No. If you got 1.2.3>25 that is hexagram 1 with lines 2 and 3 changing to 25 you would look at hexagram one, lines 2 and 3, which you cast and also the second/relating hexagram of 25. No need to look at corresponding lines in 25 unless out of interest.
You can see from this thread there are numerous ways to handle interpreting change lines but I don't think any of them involve divining from the corresponding lines in the second hexagram. If you look at the fan yao for each line anyway you would get a different hexagram. So the fan yao of 1.2 is 13.2, but the fan yao of 1.3 is 10.3...see what I mean. If you use the fan yao you can only do it one line at a time.
But personally at the stage you are at I would advise you to completely forget any lines in the second hexagram.
NOTE: On a personal note, when using text-based methods, I don't use individual lines for the changed hexagram. My technical reason is that the full text for any yaoci (individual line) is "6 in the first...." or "9 in the top..." "6 in the second...", etc. When the 6 in the original hexagram is changed to the changed hexagram, it becomes a 7 not a 9; and when a 9 in the original hexagram is changed to the changed hexagram, it becomes an 8 not a 6; therefore, the text for the 6 or the 9 in the changed hexagram doesn't fit for a 7 or an 8 in the changed hexagram. But well, that's just me.
Best wishes
Of course you're right, there are many ways. But we differ about the best answer to the question, 'How to read a casting?' Well... it depends how you take the question. If it's really, 'Please give me a historical survey of the available ways to read a casting,' that's one thing, and if it's 'What do I do with my readings so I can understand and benefit from them?' that's something else.Hi Hilary
Just to be clear. My comment was directed to this question
And it was to point one BASIC thing about Yijing, something that every beginner should be told at the very start: there is not a straightforward answer to that. One of the first things to say in any beginner's introduction to Yijing is: there have been and still are quite different schools and methods, the one I teach here is just one among many others.My question is how to read your casting
The faster you drop the idea of one right way to read your answers, the more solid foundation you will have for a serious study of the Yijing. The longer you have the idea of one right way to read your answers, the greater is the risk for a dogmatic relation with the Yijing.
I have no problem with a practical advise on any particular method for a beginner, given from own's experience. I have no problem with someone saying, start with the one taught by Whilelm's; actually, that was the way I started. But from my experience, the best thing to do when someone ask how to read your answer is to show that there is not one answer, there are different ways.
Just my experience, anyway.
Yes, you have a point - there are so many traditions that 'traditional' is probably a meaningless word for me to use. We can't hope to reconstruct what the original users did with their oracle, after all - the Zuozhuan is already far, far away from them.ps--- I do have problem whit labbeling the method tought by Lau Nai Süan to Whilhelm as the traditional reading. It may be the one most common in the West, but it is a Qing method (as long as I know, maybe a Ming one); any Han method has an older stance in terms of tradition. Even Wang Bi's and Zhu Xi's has an older stance in terms of tradition
Well... in terms of method, the simplest thing is to read the moving lines you cast - all of them, and only them. Maybe if you start at the lowest line and read upward, you'll find they tell a story.Yep, i think i read these guide online and was very confused with so much ways to interpret multiple moving lines!! my head spinned...well...I would prefer some basic method.
I really would love to research now what meaning does a CHANGED HEXAGRAM really carry.
I'm going to just read Hilary's notes here more carefully!
Well... it depends how you take the question. If it's really, 'Please give me a historical survey of the available ways to read a casting,' that's one thing, and if it's 'What do I do with my readings so I can understand and benefit from them?' that's something else.
For me, there can't be any serious study of the Yijing without a working relationship with it (aka, practical use of it, or conversations with it); so, when I'm saying "The faster you drop the idea of one right way to read your answers, the more solid foundation you will have for a serious study of the Yijing" I'm not talking academic studies disconnected from a working relationship with the Yi, but having a actual practice with the Yi.There's 'serious study of the Yijing' and there's 'working relationship with the Yijing': two practices that work together and nourish one another, but are not necessarily the same thing.
So what can we do? Get to know Yi, come to love and respect it, build experience, and listen to the voice of intuition that emerges from all these things.
Confusing? indeed. What to do?. In my case, have an open mind, try every school or method and decide if it works for me or not.
Clarity,
Office 17622,
PO Box 6945,
London.
W1A 6US
United Kingdom
Phone/ Voicemail:
+44 (0)20 3287 3053 (UK)
+1 (561) 459-4758 (US).