Thank you for your patience, this post is a bit long, but I tried to explains things as briefly as I could.

I am desperately trying to let go of someone I would characterise as the love of my life, and I do not say that lightly. The bond, in all respects, was profound, growing and taking root over time, and he recognised it as well. From one day to the next, a few months ago, the relationship just... stopped. It made no sense. I reached out several times in different ways to no avail, so I stopped. Can't force someone to communicate with you and I do have my self-respect... I went concave, the pain seething through me in a way I'd never experienced. When I'd ask the Yi about this, I'd get a lot of 62s, 64s, 32s, 2s and variations thereof.

Each time I felt like I was barely able to get my head above water, I'd get a one-off email, which invariably, although short, would include some reference to missing me, devotion and what not. I'd respond, but very reservedly, sometimes noting that his behaviour contradicted his warmer expressions. Each time, it would put my head back under water. It's as if he sensed precisely the moment to give sign of life intuitively. It happened enough times that this is not just coincidence. While it would remind me of the uncanny connection, it would also make me angry - be with me or let go, but don't keep me on a string.

I had hope for understanding and closure to help me make peace with this (moving on is a bit too much to ask, I don't get involved easily...), but it's not been forthcoming.
My brain says: "let go, forget about it, give up illusions". My gut says "this story isn't over, but it may take a long time to sort it out; the connection was/is about as deep as it can get." My heart just bleeds. All this makes it tough to take the rest of life as it comes, everything else is kind of shrouded in fog or in a dark veil, I'm not good at compartementalising things.

Anywhoo... odd set of readings this morning...
I'm starting to work on my holiday cards, thinking about sending him one or not...
So I asked "what is the one memory of me that I need to leave behind me with him?"
And the Yi replied 52.5>53: context is really really really slow progress (how slow is slow?) and that for right now, keep still, it's not the time to settle unfinished business. I take it as, yeah, you can send the card, but just keep it neutral. I've been in enforced 52 mode (stilling) for months....

And then, I know I shouldn't but heck.. I asked "what are his feelings about us as a couple at this time?"
I've never had this happen in readings so I was surprised, i get the mirror image of mine: 53.5>52. Wilhelm mentions that with this changing line, mistrust is being created by someone outside the relationship -- but we have no common friends, so I have no clue if someone is doing that or who it could be or if the issue is altogether different. Generally though, is there some significance in having mirror image readings when asking about two people and their relationship?

Finally, I asked how should I ask for my belongings back? He has some of my things, that have great sentimental value to me and that I don't want to be gone forever. The Yi answered 2 unchanging, and that I don't get at all given the question.

Thank you for any insights you might have that would help me make sense of this.. and perhaps to get my gut to let go somehow.

Dear flashlight,

flashlight said:

I'm starting to work on my holiday cards, thinking about sending him one or not... So I asked "what is the one memory of me that I need to leave behind me with him?"
And the Yi replied 52.5>53.... I take it as, yeah, you can send the card, but just keep it neutral.

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this is exactly what it means. Keep it neutral.

Ahead of that, you talk to yourself all the time (thoughts): why is this, i should, he should.. i wished.. how unfair, why not etc.. usually it is the ego bugging your self with all those questions. Mountain points to meditation and to stilling the ego which constantly wants something. Your ego besets you but also your friend. The bigger the ego gets, the smaller the space gets where things can develop naturally.

53.5 to me is the reflection of what you feel and not what he is feeling. You feel lonely and unable to get connected. 53.5 is connected to line 2 which is inside the lower Trigram Mountain, coming to peace somehow. And again it is the Mountain which points to stilling your ego´s desires. Noone ever comes to peace by wanting/needing emotionally something from somebody else.
(x55.2x typo) 53.2 you can open-heartedly share your friends beeing as it is.

sorry, double posting, technic trouble - delted it.

Lilly, I think you meant 53.2.
It is said of the wild goose that it calls to its comrades whenever it finds food; this is the symbol of peace and concord in good fortune. A man does not want to keep his good luck for himself only, but is ready to share it with others.


My browser warns me everytime about double posting, i think there is some problem with the site.

Thanks ashteroid,
typo from my side - best to you

ashteroid said:

Lilly, I think you meant 53.2.

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Dear Lilly,

Thank you for your gentle answer. Well, I'm glad I got the core message in 52.5 right about keeping it neutral (if I do send a holiday card), makes me feel like I am on the right track in my learning

lilly said:

Ahead of that, you talk to yourself all the time (thoughts): why is this, i should, he should.. i wished.. how unfair, why not etc.. usually it is the ego bugging your self with all those questions. Mountain points to meditation and to stilling the ego which constantly wants something. Your ego besets you but also your friend.

Click to expand...

Of course this is on my mind a lot. My heart hurts and my head says "this does not compute". How does one go, literally from one day to the next, from a solid, growing, loving, trusting and creative relationship that is recognised as such and enjoyed as such by both, to ... nothing. No, I'm not asking the "it's unfair/why not/he should/I wish" types of questions. Rather, "what the H--l happened" and "what kind of person would behave that way toward another human (on top of that a loved partner)" type questions. It's incomprehensible, inelegant, cowardly. And those adjectives don't fit the person I have known for quite some time.

I recognise situations where it is clearly my ego yammering "me, me, why me, me me", but I really do not feel this is one of them. Pride and self-respect have kept me quiet and reserved. Clingy needy whiny is just not me. I have a life (even if it has not been a piece of cake of late) and saving face is part of my DNA. I'm private. This is why normally I don't post such personal readings here. But my brain needs to understand. There is nothing worse than what's unsaid. I'm walking around with a question mark above my head. What I want and need is an explanation. But I remain stilled (52), silent, reserved in my behaviour.

53.5 to me is the reflection of what you feel and not what he is feeling. You feel lonely and unable to get connected. 53.5 is connected to line 2 which is inside the lower Trigram Mountain, coming to peace somehow. And again it is the Mountain which points to stilling your ego´s desires. Noone ever comes to peace by wanting/needing emotionally something from somebody else.

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Don't know, not sure the 53.5 refers to just me. I'm still puzzled by Wilhem's reference to distrust caused by an outside source and by what is expressed in his periodic emails (they have no reason for being, unless he either wants to keep me on a string - which sucks - or I am missing part of the equation, which in any event I clearly am).

How does 53.5 connect to 53.2? My learning sure hasn't gotten that far! But again, I really don't think I am working from a place of ego. I'm an analytical sort. I need to understand, even if what I hear I don't like, I'd still need to hear it. That would help get peace. I am not lonely, per se, I miss a very specific person (and people are not interchangeable) for reasons I have no clue about. It's like one evening, the house was there, the next morning it wasn't, and no earthquake was reported.

(x55.2x typo) 53.2 you can open-heartedly share your friends beeing as it is.

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As I mentioned, I don't know how you connected to 53.2 and I'm not understanding your sentence above. If you have the time, could you explain it to me Lilly? (thanks )

I'm still stumbling over Yi's unchanging 2 on how to ask for some of my belongings back. Among all the stuff, there are a few items that have poignant meaning to me (and I've had them for decades) I can't leave behind...

@ashteroid

It is said of the wild goose that it calls to its comrades whenever it finds food; this is the symbol of peace and concord in good fortune. A man does not want to keep his good luck for himself only, but is ready to share it with others.

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That is a beautiful quote, ashteroid, and you connect it to 53.2, but I'm lost as to how it relates to my situation, questions or the Yi's answers or who it is talking about....

Well, at least I have a plateful of work... being in demand and productive does stroke my ego
And this virtual community of wise ones is a blessing :bows: Thank you for helping me learn.

I was just pointing out Lilly's typo. I too don't know how she connected 53.5 to 53.2 )

ashteroid said:

I was just pointing out Lilly's typo. I too don't know how she connected 53.5 to 53.2 )

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Oh good, nice to not be the only one!

Dear flashlight,

i would like to answer in full length but have to go to work soon. My ego would like to give the perfect!! answer so you do understand and like me. The expression Ego has a bad connotation. No one wants one but we all have one. (There is only one person i know, who def. has none. That is Eckhardt Tolle. There might be some more but i did not come across them yet.)

The Ego is this part of my person which wants me and others to be different or act differently and which makes me suffer (anger , frustration, ...) or it blames me to be not nice or kind or perfect or....whatever...enough . Then i suffer. My ego produces and at the same time likes to avoid suffering and so i start manipulating either myself or the other by f. e. writing reserved emails , beeing extra nice, beeing extra brilliant, blaming, ..there are hundreds of ways to manipulate and usually we are not even aware of how far we (me def. included ) go.

You might like to hear a story by him which makes sense to you. Something like: i am gay or i am not ready for a close relationship yet or i have some deep psyschological problems or you do not look the way i prefer or or or ..... once you know this 'true' story you resp. your ego tries to adapt. You will start manipulating. You will try hard to get the house back!

As Katie Byron (thework.com) says (and i fully agree): there is no authentic story. The only authentic story there is, is, he does not reply the way you think you need it.

For 53: let (lonely) time work for you, it will work for you. In II Book by Wilhelm it is said 53.5 refers to line 53.2. I have the feeling this is the case here. You will get connected again.

keep up faith , lilly

Lilly,
I really like the way you write (and you'd told me you did not think your English was good? Nonsense!), it's like I can hear your voice and it makes me think you should write (short stories, novels..).

lilly said:

i would like to answer in full length but have to go to work soon.

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Yeah, funny how work can get in the way of things sometimes (joke)!

My ego would like to give the perfect!! answer so you do understand and like me. The expression Ego has a bad connotation. No one wants one but we all have one. (There is only one person i know, who def. has none. That is Eckhardt Tolle. There might be some more but i did not come across them yet.)

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Please tell your Ego for me you are terrific
Of course we all have one - and I acknowledge mine and am lucid on things like that - but I'm not sure mine is driving things in this particular instance.

My ego produces and at the same time likes to avoid suffering and so i start manipulating either myself or the other by f. e. writing reserved emails , beeing extra nice, beeing extra brilliant, blaming, ..there are hundreds of ways to manipulate and usually we are not even aware of how far we (me def. included ) go.

Click to expand...

Interesting thought, I'll ponder. But, to make clear, I did not initiate the emails. I'd receive sporadic ones with mixed messages. I had several choices: not answer at all (which my upbringing would consider rude); spill my guts (either expressing emotions,hurt, or anger - but my self-respect/pride/ego? would not let me do that), or respond courteously and reservedly, which is what I did. Is that manipulative? Are all possible manners to respond then manipulative? Had I been initiating the exchanges, I would agree with you - that even a reserved note could be manipulative. I feel his emails have been so, quite game playing, but I did not want to fall into that, it serves no purpose.

You might like to hear a story by him which makes sense to you. Something like: i am gay or i am not ready for a close relationship yet or i have some deep psyschological problems or you do not look the way i prefer or or or ..... once you know this 'true' story you resp. your ego tries to adapt. You will start manipulating. You will try hard to get the house back!
As Katie Byron (thework.com) says (and i fully agree): there is no authentic story. The only authentic story there is, is, he does not reply the way you think you need it.

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He sure isnt' gay ! Nope, all I want is an explanation. Whether it makes sense or not. Whether I like it or not. Whether I believe it or not. He's a grown up (supposedly) and thus accountable for his choices and actions. I accept his choice, but reject the gutless wonder manner in which he implemented it. I am not even sure I "want the house back" at this point as it would take a heck of a long time to rebuild trust and respect of someone who could pull a 180° overnight without a word for months, while at the same time not having the courage to fully own his choice (parts of his emails having no other purpose but to keep me on a string). You can respect someone without loving them, but you can't love someone without respect.

I'll agree, but with an edit, that the only authentic story is that he "did not act in an adult and forthright manner" (or, other angle, that without consideration, the sincerity of the love he professed merits being put in question).

For 53: let (lonely) time work for you, it will work for you. In II Book by Wilhelm it is said 53.5 refers to line 53.2. I have the feeling this is the case here. You will get connected again.

keep up faith , lilly

Click to expand...

Ah so that's how you connected 53.5 to 53.2, but does Wilhelm explain how or why they relate? I'm still trying to figure out (among a lot of other things!) the meaning of the line positions themselves (1 to 6); I'm getting a better sense of individual triagrams that make up a hex, but haven't yet refined that point.
The alone time is working for me - perhaps that's even how I was able to start this thread. So who am i
supposed to reconnect with? Me? My ex? A new person?
These are indeed times to keep the faith (in general)!
to you too, Lilly

Just ask him why things have changed, and may you please have your stuff back.

I did, initially, try to reach out to understand. Never got a response. And the occasional missives since do not speak to that. My ego says "I ain't askin' again!".

Dear Flashlight,

flashlight said:

I really like the way you write..

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thank you very much for your kind words. I feel delighted. I love the english language and would love to master it at proficient level ... but it seems, it´ll be a task for my next life :bows:.

In my previous posting i did present examples we all know from our own lives. Who did not write a reserved/strange/silly email or letter or made a strange call or some other funny things in his/her life? I have a whole bunch of them collected .

flashlight said:

Are all possible manners to respond then manipulative?

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If the ego (or egos, the Yi often talks of the common man / men in this case) is in the way, yes. Without you would respond freely without any hesitation. You´d love receiving his emails even if they are a bit strange. And you would love him even if not receiving any emails from him.

I did rewrite a paragraph of your posting. What is realy truer? Your version or this one?

Nope, all I want is his love. Whether it makes sense or not. Whether he likes me or not. Whether he believes me or not. I am not a grown up and thus not accountable for my choices and actions. I don´t accept his choice and reject the gutless wonder manner in which he implemented it. I am sure I "want the house back" at this point as it would take a heck of a short..

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You wrote:
I'll agree, but with an edit, that the only authentic story is that he "did not act in an adult and forthright manner"

Is this so?

Or is this so: I'll agree, but with an edit, that the only authentic story is that I did not act in an adult and forthright manner.

___________________________

For Hex. 53: the goose is taken higher and higher by the wind (Trigram sun above), gradual development.

53.6 The path rises high toward heaven, like the flight of wild geese when they have left the earth far behind. There they fly, keeping to the order of their flight in strict formation.
This is possible once the goose has found her true self. Then her feathers can be used for the sacred dance. She got part of something much bigger. The one goose is all the other geese and all the other geese is the one goose.

53.5 has to unite with 53.2 where she is safe and can nourish herself (in the middle of the mountain, self).

53.3 (top of the mountain next to the wind) the robbers: false ideas, emotional manipulation, no child will be born -> wrong way. Correct way for now: 53.2. Time will lift you to 53.6.

53.5 robbers are still there, line 4 (the often manipulating line of Sun) close to line 5. You should not manipulate yourself (see as well judgement). Flying high will come ompom: . Perhaps even another guy.

This is the way, i see it.... and now i go to cheers for now and all the best lilly

Dear Lilly,

You are a wise and sensitive soul, I respect your views, hear your questions and I am grateful for the generosity of your time in these exchanges.

I think I am pretty lucid and know myself well, warts and all; friends who have known me over four decades at least seem to think so. I don't recognize myself in your rewrites of my paragraph and sentence, it does not ring true to me. I chose to be in this relationship with all my heart (love is a risk, but it's a risk worth taking. I did not choose for it to vanish in a blink. I chose to react with dignity, while not deluding myself of the hurt that event caused. I honor the love and what was shared. And no, there is no house to be taken back "just like that" because, for me, a critical ingredient in the foundation of any house (relationship), trust, has been damaged, quite a bit of time has passed, drift has made that window close. Reconstruction would be long and hard, both would have to want it, and in light of how he chose to handle his exit, even if he wanted to get back what we had, it would be surprising if he'd have the wherewithall to rebuild/re-earn my trust. One shouldn't use words such as "always" or "never", because the only thing one can count on is change. I'm not closed to it, but I'm no longer pining away and I'll admit I'd be a tough mountain to climb at this point.

Hmm... Maybe I'm closer to letting go than I thought at the start of this thread. Thank you, Lilly. Hope you are having a good sleep snuggling under warm goose feathers (well, if it is cold where you are!)

flashlight said:

all I want is an explanation... without a word for months

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I think you need to ask him how it happened that he stopped communicating with you for months at a time. I think you owe it to yourself to come right out with that question.

It sounds to me that in the area of communications, he is quite unreliable, to leave you in the lurch like that. That really hurts. He is not reliable and consistent, the way you want him to be. I have a girlfriend like this, and the friendship can sometimes make me very frustrated with her. Yet we are still friends. You could say that I see her more clearly now for who she is -- she is a lousy communicator.

flashlight said:

My ego says "I ain't askin' again!".

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But, the thing is, you MUST ask again. Repetition will overcome the obstacle. Stick to your guns.

ginnie said:

But, the thing is, you MUST ask again. Repetition will overcome the obstacle. Stick to your guns.

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Yeah, but both me and my ego would feel like dog poop if I still never got even the flimsiest of answers... There's the rub... Can't force someone to respond.
As Lilly would put it, the only real story is that I may well have to digest that question mark (or let the wind - hurricane!- at some point blow it away from above my head).

yes, to what Ginnie said, I don't want to get involved with this thread but it's gotten way too complicated IMO.

they were clear simple answers...52.5 you will be able to communicate well, it's not complex , send the card and ask for your stuff back.

52.5 is a very reassuring answer that words will come out right....IMO this has absolutely nothing to do with ego issues. I think Lilly is fond of Carol Anthony's 'version' of the I Ching....in which she, Carol Anthony, makes every single answer about the ego and this is not really the I Ching but Carol Anthony's views plastered over the IC, (no offence Lily but I don't share your view on Anthony)

So nice simple answer.....just communicate

53.5>52 makes me wonder if it really is over or not...but I don't have time to read the whole thread or get involved in it, I just think it has gotten too complicated when you had a really simple answer.

flashlight said:

Yeah, but both me and my ego would feel like dog poop if I still never got even the flimsiest of answers... There's the rub... Can't force someone to respond.
As Lilly would put it, the only real story is that I may well have to digest that question mark (or let the wind - hurricane!- at some point blow it away from above my head).

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what's ego got to do with anything...you want your stuff back...52.5 says you are quite capable of clear communication with him, ie you won't go wrong or get upset or angry with him. there is no warning here. In my experience 52.5 always has shown a good communication.

No you can't force someone to respond but actually if they hold your belongings they should return them to you. Nothing to do with egos....Hence you should keep communicating with him clearly that you want your stuff....and you will come and get your stuff...and if no reply then keep on because he should give you your things back.

This thread is already too long isn't it....you need to be communicating with him now, not us

And if he doesn't answer then maybe send your brother round to get your stuff, your dad, your mate....you know he can't just keep your stuff and ignore you like this. Rather than do ego bashing I think you should hold your head up high and take back what is yours !

52.5 shows you are able to do this in a balanced manner.....and that the response may be good too.


ps please don't explain to me why this isn't possible.....these are suggestions, take them or leave them, I don't know your situation like you do so just use what fits.

Ah! Trojan, when you fire off messages one after the other like an M16 (i've seen it on other threads too), it makes me chuckle cause it reminds me of a grad school friend of mine with a big heart who could get all riled up on issues or sticking up for folks.
Don't know Carol Anthony, but point noted. And although the thread has been useful to me (sorry it went long), it did vear off from the initial reading question.
It's a beautiful day, at last, and I'm going to bundle up and take the dog on a good hike. We both need to move our butts!

Just give me his number and I'll call him !

I don't mind how long a thread is...I just love 52.5, it's a great auspice for communicating with someone...

trojan said:

Just give me his number and I'll call him !

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Now there's a thought that made me laugh til I got the hicups! Yup, I think you'd probably make a good stand-in for a hulk of a bro' I don't have! (dang, why isn't there the emoticon where the laughing smilie also taps on the floor for chuckling so hard??)

I just love 52.5, it's a great auspice for communicating with someone...

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The message I thought was keep it light and neutral. Real communication, to me, has a lot more substance....We'll see.

Totally unrelatedly, but linked to my silly shopping question -- Dog and I ended up in a store - without asking the Yi's blessing . Got the darn tablet -- definitely a want more than an absolute need. Decent deal. Wallet is a lot lighter, but contrary to when that happens because of the taxman, I got me a Christmas and Bday present YAY!

52.5 doesn't have to mean in depth discussion it's more like the right words come easily and so any potential upsets are avoided. I have known 52.5 to manifest as that time and time again.

The words 'light and neutral' aren't in 52.5....but the whole point of 52.5 is you don't have to manufacture the right response, it just comes. You seem to get hooked up quickly on an idea associated with a line and kind of hold to it literally. Someone suggested to keep it light and neutral...which is fine but it's just a suggestion you don't have to hang on that as the meaning

But what does the I Ching itself actually say ...let's see from Hilary's book

"Stilling your jaws,
Words have order,
Regrets vanish."

For me this has meant...er that words have order and regrets vanish. I needed no advice on how to 'play it'....the right words came at the right time. What I thought might be difficult wasn't.

ETA possibly fewer words are needed than anticipated...but it is in any case a smooth communication. Maybe that is as much as is needed for now.

Totally unrelatedly, but linked to my silly shopping question -- Dog and I ended up in a store - without asking the Yi's blessing . Got the darn tablet -- definitely a want more than an absolute need. Decent deal. Wallet is a lot lighter, but contrary to when that happens because of the taxman, I got me a Christmas and Bday present YAY!

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you take your dog shopping ? Doesn't he get bored ? Might I humbly suggest you update the shopping thread with this tale of you and the dog.

I just have this image of the dog holding carrier bags, looking through merchandise...like that dog on Family Guy

trojan said:

you take your dog shopping ? Doesn't he get bored ? Might I humbly suggest you update the shopping thread with this tale of you and the dog.

I just have this image of the dog holding carrier bags, looking through merchandise...like that dog on Family Guy

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Normally, no, though he will try to walk into stores. He likes people . A lot, and folks take to him. He has a blast when school lets out; a dozen + kids look for him. Today, the store was not the destination....it just happened to cross our path on the way back. Worry not, he had fun
Caused a small family squabble... daddy, 1 want a d og for Christmas 00ps... Ok, I will update the other thread (not sure it's relevant save for s splurging !