1 & 2

[yellowblue]

To me, it seems that when we receive hex 1 no changing lines that the creative power is there but it remains sterile.

With hex 2 it seems to indicate that the ground is willing to conceive if it is germinated....


So, hex 1 no changing lines is powerful, but doesn't come to fruition. It dies.

Hex 2, always open. Ready to bring forth fruit.

I realise that 2 without 1 is barren, but still open. 2 seems to give without care of growth, 1 to receive with the objective of growth.

Very basic here in my expressions. Help please?

Thoughts?

Deb

 

[yellowblue]

Ooopps....Sorry, I didn't state that quite right...


1 seems to give without care of whether or not it grows, 2 receives with the objective of growth.


Deb

 

[hilary]

'Basic' I can relate to!

For Qian (1) unchanging I've done a few readings that suggest 'inspiration unrealised'. Projects that are intrinsically great ideas, but where circumstances aren't right for them to become manifest. But the idea/spirit most definitely continues, and has this massive drive to find concrete expression - so the opportunities may well keep coming up. It can create a great sense of excitement, or suppressed energy, or just plain frustration.

Does that generalisation tie in with anyone else's experience? And does anyone have any good experiences of Hexagram 2, unchanging, that illustrate what it's about?

 

[davidl]

How about a surfing analogy. (1) is like the ocean sending waves to the shore.
(2) is the wave rider.
We can sit out the back of the break and let all the waves go by, (1, unchanging) or chose to ride one to the shore(2). When riding, its best to relax and follow the energy of the wave. let it take you there.

 

[candid]

#1 unchanging -

* all dressed up and nowhere to go
* unattached energy

#2 unchanging -

* awaiting direction
* non-energy

Change lines in these are activators to switch polarity within that specific line, which bring about movement or focused energy. With no change lines there is only the potential, no focus, and therefore, no affect.

One can still read all six lines in either hex. and choose which example to activate. Or, one can choose to, as David put it, ride the wave.

Sometimes I think ?Book of Choices? is more fitting than ?Book of Changes.?

 

[clove]

Yellowblue, Hilary, Davidl and Candid;

This is so interesting. Confirms my intuition interpreting these unchanging hexagrams.

Candid, interesting, what you say, "Book of Choices". While the book of Changes has always provided me with sound practical advice, it has also spoken to particular stubborn states of mind. Areas where I am quite stubborn, or have a fixed belief, and therefore, cannot change. When I realize a hexagram or changing line is speaking to me in this way, I have always experinced a kind of epiphany. Then, I have been able to become aware of a limiting perspective, and find the bound energy is released.

Perhaps in this way the book can make an opening for choice?

Clove

 

[hilary]

Wow! all round. Clove, you're brilliant, making openings is exactly what it does. Moving lines are definite 'openings' - a small hole where Yi can insert the end of a long lever, and prise apart our ideas. Have you read the introduction to Wu Jing Nuan's Yijing? Nicely mind-rearranging stuff.

I also get the feeling these are 'unfocussed' without change lines. 2 unchanging feels as if it can and will get things done when they present themselves to be done - or it'll ride the wave if/when it comes (thank you, David) - but there seems to be a fine line between this and mere reactivity.

Still, I'm basing this on only a very few readings - I might have got the wrong end of the stick.

(Brilliant Freudian typo there: 'got the wrong end of the stuck'.

)

 

[candid]

Greetings, Clove. A pleasure.

Out of curiosity I searched the word, Epiphany, in MSN Dictionary, and was surprised to find this (I feel limited) definition:

?A Christian festival observed on January 6, celebrating the divine manifestation of Jesus Christ through the Three Wise Men?s visit, or, in the Eastern Orthodox Church, the baptism of Jesus Christ.?

What I find interesting in this ?interpretation? of the word is that salvation came through the visit of wise men. Your definition may be more on target that either of us realized: Emissaries of heaven, not unlike Yi, through whom arises the manifestation of the Great Man, or, God-Man.

Also interesting is the baptism connection. To be immersed into the collective Universal mind, and to arise and be born again, all things new and fresh.

How 'bout "Book of Epiphany"?

 

[cal val]

Did someone say "wise men"? Were they wearing greyish robes by any chance?

Sorry...couldn't resist...*face-aching grin*

Clove,

High five! I have done some complete about-faces in my belief system since joining this forum and opening myself up to the Yi. The difference between the Yi and LSD is the mind-altering experiences are sustained with the Yi...and there are no flashbacks.

Candid,

Reading your thoughts on epiphany, I tried to look for synonyms on thesaurus.com. Good point. There aren't any synonyms. It's a unique experience.

So I looked up synonyms for revelation ("Book of Revelations"? Wait...I think that title's been taken):

adumbration, announcement, apocalypse, beat, betrayal, break, broadcasting, catch, chip, clue, communication, cue, disclosure, discovery, display, divination, divulgement, dope, earful, exhibition, expose, exposition, exposure, eye-opener, foreshadowing, giveaway, inspiration, joker, kicker, leak, manifestation, news, oracle, page-oner, poop, proclamation, prophecy, publication, scoop, showing, sign, the latest, tip, uncovering, unearthing, unveiling, vision

Look! Divination is in the list...and so is oracle...and prophesy, too! I think we're onto something!

Love,

Val

 

[candid]

Val, I actually did think of you and the wise men in robes when I typed that. Only mine wear lab coats.

Gray also! Or maybe they're more like lab robes?

And doesn't it sometimes appear that our answers from Yi come from more than one personality or source? Like, there's a gentle one, a brutal one, an indifferent one, a dramatic one. hmmm. Sort of like the different personalities here on this board. Or, the different personality traits within ourselves. All 64 of them.

Candid

 

[davidl]

Clove,
I truly believe in a benevolent universe. Its sending me messages all the time. You and I, and everyone else, is being literally bombarded with light.This light is the creative force. Everything else then, is derivative of this force. (1) becomes (2).
How we chose to manifest the creative force I feel is purely random. We can meditate on it, read about it, follow it, do it. No one is excluded. All are welcome to create their own worlds. This is its power. The force is pure and formless.
The mare is not penned in. We can manifest all things from this light .
With all lines open I would say that you are at a point where your open to a random life changing 'event'. Something that you 'divine' for yourself. You can choose to change the way you manifest the light on all levels. There are no barriers to the influence.

 

[hilary]

Wow! Copying and pasting furiously into my Yi notes.doc. Thank you.

 

[clove]

Davidl,

Thank you. Quite wonderful, what you write. All open lines is the open channel. A conductor. The idea of a random life changing 'event' is most welcome! Always! I long for such a thing! Maybe this is one reason why I am so drawn to the I Ching? Spent my whole life looking for such things. Now, however, at this age and stage of my life, I wonder if this event could also be an inspiring thought, (ephiphany, thank you Candid, for uncovering the wise men), and what happens if this epiphany is put into practice.

Candid, Val, Hilary, connecting to your inspiring and warm words here.

Candid, how true, the many personalities! Sometimes days pass before I realise it has given a reading to have a good laugh on me! Candid, you have a very articulate understanding of the ways and means of the oracle. I genuinely look forward to hearing more.

Hilary, I will most certainly be looking for the book you mention. Kind of you to say brilliant, above, (blush) and funny that you do for that is exactly what I think about you!

Clove

 

[heylise]

Where is my mail??? I posted a very long mail here, and I cannot find anything back.
GRRRR!!!
LiSe

 

[heylise]

When a line is old yang (or yin), it is out of balance. A young yang has enough yin in it to be strong and stable, and young yin enough yang. That is why there are line texts for "old" lines, because there are the points one should take care of.

I got hex.1 all lines changing once. My question was how to carry out a plan, and when I got this, it felt immediately as a warning. Later it became clear that it indeed was, the plan was a disaster, even the small part I had done already. The Yi (or Yi's?) was saying "DON'T, STOP, WRONG TIME, WRONG PLAN, STOP, STOP!"
I think if one really wants to ride to heaven on 6 dragons, one has to keep them absolutely in check.
I know from someone, that he also got this hex. 1 to 2, when asking about the girl he wanted to marry, and as far as I know, they had a good life together. So it is not necessarily always a warning of disaster.

An unchanging hexagram is IMO not at all a sign that the situation is stagnant, or without success. I read it as "now is the time of hex. X, use it, be open to every possibility it presents, there is no particular area where things will go wrong".

For hex. 1 the advice to make use of a time of great creativity, heaven giving it to me, or me able to give it to others or to projects. To keep my eyes open for signs if and when it is the right moment for plans, or for the start of some enterprise.

For hex. 2 to be open to receive, because this is a time when growth is in the air, when opportunities can expand.

Both hexes have to do with sowing. Hex.1 with the moment to sow the seeds, hex.2 with the possibility of seeds to germinate. Like Hilary said: "these are 'unfocussed' without change lines. 2 unchanging feels as if it can and will get things done when they present themselves to be done".

LiSe

 

[cheiron]

Well I had the flu when all (thread above)was going on and thought I had better let my head clear before contributing. I valued the thread a lot - thanks.

Now the thread is quiescant I hope it will not interfere to put a very long post in here.

The following comments were written in my own note book for me and might appear to lack humility - or the tentativeness one might use to write to others - believe me it is tentative - But I do hope there is something in here that someone might find valuable.

The Receptive; Field; Yielding; Responding; Responsiveness; Earth

Overview
This Hx. is associated with November and December.

Whereas 'The Creative' is the generative principal, but it needs a womb in which those creative things might gestate. Or put another way, soil in which they might sprout and grow. This is the nature of K'un.

The Hexagram is about being, not about action. Here one ?does? by ?being? (not by action). It is important to limit action which does not accord with the Dao of the time. But lack of activity does not mean passivity. See line one of the Transforming lines.

Seeds find the soil not the other way around. So there can be a some feelings of ?waiting around ' with this Hx. But once the seeds start to take hold, heheheh? and then it is doubly important not to get active with the excitement!

Sometimes the Dao of this time feels like being passive. It is not. The way to be in this time is to concentrate on being open and {Receptive / warm / supportive / listening / quiet - saying just enough and always focussed on the others agenda) / and steady or imperturbable.} So that others can grow? and they will do the actions.

When one is like this others come and grow in the loam that one is. - Symbiotically. Because there is a great feedback mechanism as every parent or gardener knows.

The energy that one can generate around one in this time is astonishing - I think of Spring and seeds sprouting everywhere from an apparently inactive earth. Like a ?mothers love that allows the child to grow by providing the environment and the opportunities for it to learn within it.

There is something else that happens in time?. One becomes bombarded with pigs; fishes and melons? all manner of things - if one gets it right? And as the Chinese say? wealth brings greater wealth? You will find that others will become even more drawn at this stage and they will benefit from the melons pigs fishes etc? a veritable market place of activity and development! - But beware the temptation of the 6th line.

And still one does little but concentrates on being.

There is a thread of ?responsiveness to the environment in here too? adapting passively so that the ?being ' one is ?doing? is adapted to the time.

A footnote on Action and doing - Of course one has to act in this world. For me this Hx. means not developing projects oneself. However I have mooted ideas and let others bounce them around and have helped them grow. But others did the key action. So metaphorically one can also be a Gardener but others do the actual sprouting and growing actions - as seeds should.

A further note: It is interesting to contrast this Hx. with The Well? and Ting? The first is perhaps more about sustaining others in a status quo as well as providing the infrastructure they need and the latter about growing things of our own ?inside ourselves?.

In the first and last lines we see the two problems associated with this Hx. In the First line it is that of not being receptive, adaptive and nurturing. The danger is that of not letting the energy in by failing to do these things. Such a person will soon become like icy ground' unable to nurture or grow others.

The second error is in the 6th line where the now conscious person of the time overreaches themselves and attempts to actively use the abundant energy now welling up into them from line two.

Judgment The Judgement makes it clear that if one in this time tries to lead then he goes astray. Leading involves the generative principal and here we might add other generative things such as developing projects and instigating and pushing forward ideas. We can see what happens if one tries to use this energy in this way when we consider the 6th line.

The Judgement goes on to say that we should find friends in the South and West and forgo those in the North and East. In King Wen's arrangement the North and East are male trigrams and the South and West are the female trigrams... thus K'un cleaves to its own whilst interacting with Chi'en.

Lastly it reminds us that a key principle in this Hexagram is quiet perseverance. Just as the Earth perseveres in its cycles of rest and activity through out the seasons. With time and perseverance even mountains are raised low - but time did nothing but persevere with doing time - It is the nature of things that mountains become low.

K'un is receptive in nature... not discriminating. Some will come and find fertile ground and grow... others might come and not find the moment and miss the chance... but the one who is in the moment of K'un receives them all and lets each grow in their own way to the limit of their ability, great or small. This is one of the secrets to raising the energy of K'un... openness an receptivity... the greater the flow of nurturing out then the more that will come in. Wilhelm's Book iii commentary on the Judgement refers to this.

Wilhelm goes on to say that whereas the nature of Chi'en is movement and rest the nature of K'un is opening out and closing. for me this carries the idea of a vast womb... in its closed state it gestates and the open state it both receives fresh Chi'en energy and releases the gestated Chi?en energy into the world as ideas and things - or grown people. Note that it releases it does not 'do' or 'act upon '. (Seen that line six yet?). Thus it is not passive neither does permit creative action upon... yet it is active and adaptive in accord to the time.


Image (or Symbol Tradition)
The image merely notes that the person in this moment becomes as the Earth... through receptivity and devotion he may carry the outer world.

It may be worth noting that devotion may, in a more modern parlance, be substituted with the word focus. Perseverance, receptivity and focus.


Constituting Ruler:
Line two - which is the key to the whole hexagram in showing the nature of the time. It is both the Constituting and the Governing Ruler - See Line 5 below for comments on this.

6 in the 1st Place This is the 'before the beginning' of the Dao of this time known as K'un. Here the person or the time has not yet reached that point where they are sustaining of germinating others or things. There is a danger of such ground freezing up because of the lack of energy being allowed to flow into it. We know beginnings are a tricky time where one can go wrong. For me this line is a warning that it is important that the ?Loam? is appropriate. Thus adaption, by the person, is necessary and the right way of being is adhered to by the person. Thus the person who is the loam becomes ready to nurture others properly. So here is a warning to 'Yield' to 'adapt' and ?be?. Thus I disagree with Balkin who warns that one should ?deal with problems - This is action and to me it is inappropriate. (Oh, how we love action in the West!). More appropriately the 'problems' will melt of their own accord or be dealt with by the time or others that one nurtures into being.

6 in the 2nd Place Yin in a central Yin place in a Yin Hx. - This is still an early time in the development. However it is the key to understanding the fifth line. This is the ruler as it represent the fullest expression of the ?Earth? That which nurtures all growth. It is in the inner trigram and is ?less conscious than the fifth line. However it is the energy on which the conscious fifth line draws and it is therefore the ?source?.
The straight and square may be a reference to the Earth Alter which were built square sided. An alter to Heaven was round. It is interesting to note that in Western Astrology the things of the Earth is given the symbol of a square and the infinite that of a circle. Thus it is appropriate for things here to be 'straight and square'.
Wilhelm notes that "the earth has no need of purpose. Everything becomes spontaneously what it should be..." p.390

6 in the 3rd Place Here we have a little ?action?. But not doing action. Wilhelm, "Seek not works but bring to completion." Again this injunction on action. But it must be subservient to the time and those who are the key protagonists in the drama. Again the metaphor of the gardener is good here. A little weeding and watering or whatever. However this line carries another more subtle idea. The person of this time has progressed past line two. In line two they effectively 'met' the Earth energy and learned its ways... for that is the lesson of that place in the Hexagram... Here the person of this time has begun to move on. this line has gestation hidden within it. but this time it is something gestating within the person themselves. They have met with the earth energy and now the injunction... 'bring things to completion'. Does this mean bring this phase t completion within oneself? Or perhaps bring those things one was growing as a gardener to completion? Perhaps both. This is the butterflies last task before it becomes a chrysalis in line four. The end of a cycle of the inner world leading to the beginning of the outer world octave in line four.

6 in the 4th Place Here we move into the second phase of the development. Not yet well established at this level though. We have been through the first three movements of beginning, of meeting the source and 'being' it in line two - that is, being very appropriate as a growth medium and then moved on to the 'hidden line' at three where matters were completed and considered... Now replete with the energy and empowerment of all of these developments we move into the outer part of the Hx. - Energised and fecund. So here we have a danger. It is all to easy to burst forth into action and to try to protagonate. (Did I invent that word - sorry). So here we are counselled to remain silent and adjust still further to the time which has changed us - we gestate ourselves within the time. Note that this is quietly nurturing ourselves now rather than others. We are Chrysalis. Tied up in a sack indeed!

6 in the 5th Place Now here we have the Earth Shaman we have become - The Woman Shaman - (Who might of course be male ) She wears the Yellow Ox hide garment of the Shaman. Wilhelm glossed this line pretty well?! It can be confusing given that it is in the fifth place and not a ruler. But line two is the earth source, hidden below and inside... of course it can not be ruled by this one who is without.
This line is the ?conscious expression of that earth energy seated as it is in the outer trigram. This, for me is the person who is in sync. With the whole earth energy bit. They are a conduit. Having found the source within themselves in two they are now a wellspring of it for themselves and others. But the earth energy located in two is still the source and they are nothing without it. Here is one who appropriately 'nurtures' and ?empowers the actions of others in accordance with the time.
This one who knows that there is not just growing but a time of autumn and winter and who thus appropriately, by the nature of who they are, guides others in those other phases too - helping them to keep their actions appropriate to decay and endings as well. She is the disinterested nurturing conduit. Severe in that she can offer great support and fertility for others to grow in and act from; and then with just as much stillness and separateness she will knowingly allow them to fade and end as appropriate to the time. Karcher (2003) Captures some of it for me - His description of the line is ?sort of written for the ?newbie? fifth liner - I don't mean this as an arrogant put down... There is a lot more to being in this space than the author has had room to say... Thus his comments here are openers... once there most folk will find that as long as they stay on that wave they will plumb great and wonderful depths. There is great energy and knowing for one, who can, by merely being, reside in the energy of this line.

6 in the 6th Place Ahh well, every moment has its end. Here the fifth line Shaman has moved away from her relationship with the source as represented by the second line. She has lost the source and in her fullness of empowerment she overreaches herself. What we have here is the potential phase which must be avoided. Where the Female Shaman overreaches herself and moves from a highly charged state of being into wilful action. Here she meets the real (and appropriate) action forces in the form of a Heaven Dragon (presumably of Chi'en). She applied the earth/ receptive energy inappropriately to do action instead letting it be the wellspring she could draw out for others to use for their growth and action.
All Six lines Transforming. Now this is interesting. In most hexagram's line six is the end development... where the 'flow' of the progression through the lines naturally take the movement as it winds down and leads to the next movement as shown in the sequence.
Here however line six represents a Grand Error... an error so great that the Dragon of Heaven will come down to the field and fight with the Phoenix of K'an who misuses its energy as if a Dragon. Here is an idea of evil... Earth energy misused as if creative energy... Thus it is a challenge to the order of things and is wrong...
However when all six lines transform we have a concert where all levels become so charged they burst forth and become Yang, Chi'en the Creative... The revolving door of Creativity and Nurture; of Action and Receptivity; of Brightness in the open and Darkness of the gestation... This is the true exit point for this Hx. Its correct culmination.
So how does that differ from the will full mis use of Earth / Receptive energy in line six? Here the person becomes Yang... their energy transmutes so their new found Yang is real Yang... But here I am guessing for this is an energy transmutation I have not yet experienced.


NOTE There is no reason why the movements of these lines should be in the time order I have described. Thus were line two to become too passive and with it enter into stillness then we have the beginnings of barrenness as it moves backward toward ice.
Thus too the sixth line is a warning to the one who resides in the fifth about the appropriateness of their way of being.

Similarly the fifth might find it appropriate to withdraw in to the state of the fourth line as the moment of the Dao might dictate. A sort of ?hiding ones light scenario.

This raises an interesting point. Often many of us use the Yi Jing to remain in tune with the time. Here we have a glimpse of anther way... that of managing our Dao to remain in tune not just with the time, but to stay on the wave as a surfer might... and the beauty of this is that this is all Dark Passive Yin... I don't think so.

Warmly

--Kevin

 

[yellowblue]

LiSe and Kevin--

LiSe explained, and Kevin also and elaborated.

I think you are both my 50.6 regarding hex 1 & 2 : )


Thanks for the tasty and nourishing banquet,

Deb

 

[hilary]

Kevin - wow.

Do you have another 63 like that in a notebook somewhere?
(Note to self: install an emoticon for pure greed...)

 

[joang]

Kevin, your post knocked my socks off. It's a keeper. Thank you for sharing that. Don't recall seeing an interpretation with a female shauman in it before, but I like it very much. Is it your own?

Namaste,
Joan

 

[cal val]

Kevin...

Thank you for this. I think, though, I'm getting a slightly different picture from your notes than you are, and, no doubt, a little more input from you will help.

When I read your explanations I get the feeling that there is room for some action in the beginning line and that window of opportunity gradually disappears as you move up the lines to the sixth place.

It seems that one must act quickly before the ice comes in the first line and the receptivity has gone on too long in the last. Your thoughts?

Love,

Val

 

[cheiron]

Hi

Many thanks for your kind words ? and more than that for the encouragement you give me.

Hilary, If I had 63 more like this I would have a serious headache? But I am working on it (chuckles).

Hi Val ? Lovely questions / statements ? makes me think ? thanks?

First I should say where I got this ? I have just been through a very long period of Hx.2 ? It has scared me stiff and challenged many of my instincts. So many times my mind has shouted ?Just Do It? and ?You know where you want to go with this ? why not just get cracking?? Each time the Yi has said ? Hx.2.x? Little by little I watched projects develop and ideas take form and problems that got solved ? all by others who I supported or who just came for a chat and went away and ?did the business?.

More than that I saw a major change in those with whom I work as they too caught the bug and started caring and nurturing those in the team I work in.

So here I am, a ?doing fire type guy? learning to nurture and sit still! Yet the influence is more than I have ever seen. So, Yup, I am a ?born again Hx.2? I admit it? (Is there a Hex.2 Twelve Step prog.?)

So to line one? I am sloppy with the Yi Jing? I use it to get a focus on what I feel inside. So, especially at beginnings when one might be arriving from any one of a minimum of six different spaces (depending on which line(s) changed to make Hx.2) then at this ?before the beginning? line one there may well have the tail end of situations which require action as one starts to slip into this new time/space/Dao.

But looking at the words for line 1:

Different commentators have very different ideas about this line? I think it is a line with traps for those commentators who have not ?felt it?. It is set at the beginning of the Yin cycle? November December? a time when the cold and ice comes? but also the time when the yin energy becomes more strongly manifest (Wen Cycle). This time is also, traditionally (in ancient China), a time where the marriage process begins.

LiSe picks up nicely on the two themes? the arrival of Yin and marriage decisions by the season? http://www.anton-heyboer.org/i_ching/hex_1-16/hex_e_02.htm . This marriage time is made plain in Marshall?s book (S. Marshall ? The Mandate of Heaven)? p. 116 ? ?Stepping on Hoarfrost is associated with marriage?.

So what does it mean? Forgetting the Western symbolism of ice and feelings (as I failed to do in my posting above) we clearly have the indication of the beginning of the yin cycle? there is a thread of marriage choices too? Staying with LiSe ( as well as others like Alfred Huang) First comes the hoar frost and later comes the ice? both commentators point out, ?Hey? when there is hoarfrost then ice will come later? Look at the signs and know what I coming? this is a lesson of the Dao? - This is a time of the beginning of Yin and these two particularly say? ?Get Ready? its coming?


So as I ?blether? on here (sorry)? If there is action from the previous space, then fine? but ?get ready, get into the space - ?cos here it comes?


BTW - I don?t go for all of that, ?emotions / water solidifying and becoming real? that some commentators go for ? just my taste ? too convenient and trite ? Yin is not about solids and concrete to my mind?

Also looking at the change resulting from line one we see that this ?exit point? leads to Hx.24 ? Return (of the Yang / bright)? So if there is a 'cathartic emphasis' on this line or energy point then the whole thing flips into the beginning of the yang cycle rather than progressing up through the Yin Hx.2 development? ?Doing? again comes into season. Tricky things beginnings where each can, with pressure, flip to their opposites! - So I wonder wether doing rather than being here might move one into a Hx.24 space - Intereting concept - no?

As for Line 6?Does the translated line say fight? Or Struggle? - I wondered whether this could be struggle/copulating? Ritsema/Karcher say fight/terrified? So does Wu Jing Nuan. Marshall, P.196 comments, ??on this basis Wilhelm identified Yellow with the false earthly Dragon and Black with the true Heavenly Dragon. When Dragons did battle it was an omen portending disorder??

Elsewhere we have Yin as a Phoenix and definitely not a Dragon? no, for me this line is definitely a case of Yin going too far? trying to be a Dragon (Yang) and thus creative (action)? which it is not? thus the fight with the true Yang Dragon? in the Field? (of Earth) as the line says? this is surely not a time of appropriate action but one where the correct movement is one of retreat; back into the real realm of Yin. So for me no ?action/doing? here.

Having said all of that Val? I respect your deep knowledge of the Yi and your instincts? so all my head stuff above might be so much cyber wind? Such is being human I guess? but what a journey!

Warmly

Kevin

 

[cheiron]

Help Requested:

I am having some difficulty with Hx.2 line 3

Especially with Wilhelm's trans. b)"Hidden Lines..."

What is that about... what do folk make of this line?

Thanks

--Kevin

PS - Sorry Val - Love to hear your view on lines one and six... I was in a flow there...oops.

 

[candid]

Hi Kevin,

I read 2 line 3 as speaking of changes forthcoming which you do not yet know about. Imagine a positive turn of fate being in the wings, and then imagine how what you say or do right now might possibly mess up this hidden plan or change. (Doh!) At this stage its better not to draw attention to yourself or ideas regarding your question. Better to wait until your words and ideas are summoned. The fruit will fall when the time is right. No need to pick them prematurely.

Happy sailing!

Candid

 

[tashiiij]

Hi Kevin,

Have you read Huang's version? he says

"this line indicates that the duke of Zhou and King Wu were preparing an expedition against the tyrant of the Shang dynasty..." ... "they realized the importance of hiding one's excellence and firmly maintaining it. Their strategy was to serve the tyrant with humility while bringing their plan to completion. Confucius praises their wisdom"

sorry if you have it, this is just in case you don't...

 

[tashiiij]

cross posts, Candid, your reading of it is very interesting.

 

[candid]

Kevin,

"Tricky things beginnings where each can, with pressure, flip to their opposites!

I love it! I also like how you speak of tension in an early lines never giving opportunity to the unfolding of a particular hexagram. Some, we'd like to unfold completely, and then there are others we'd just as soon change as soon as possible. For example, hex# 6. Ut oh! Better change something. But with #1 changing to #2, its a beautifully slow process - her unfolding.

I hope you keep writing, Kevin. You've always had a lot to contribute.

Candid

 

[candid]

Tash,

Thanks, and thanks for sharing Huang's version.

I like "hiding one's excellence" as its meaning. The historic reference differs from what I wrote in that it is more strategical, and more of a conscious effort rather than waiting for natural changes, fate, or even providence. It has a goal. And it is cunning.

Interesting.

 

[tashiiij]

yes, that the kings knew the fate they were to make gave them all the more power i suppose. how many have the same command, vision, purpose. i guess this is what the 'superior man' is all about. master of destiny. personally, i do and don't, it is not a signed and sealed package. room for fudging and doubt and struggle. in tune with your reading, above, i do wonder about a different kind of purpose, hooked to some invisible unknowable but present raincloud of purpose. the wonderful hex 2 line 2.

 

[candid]

right.. without purpose of its own but in receiving there develops lines to squares, squares to cubes. Straight, square, without purpose, yet nothing remains unfurthered.

 

[cal val]

Hi there Kevin...

"Having said all of that Val? I respect your deep knowledge of the Yi..."

When I read that I said, "Huh???" And then I grinned...you big kidder you. Hey don't tease...you know how sensitive I can be...*grin* I'm trying...really I am. It's my instincts that get me by...that is, if you see instincts and intuition as synonymous.

I don't know why I find 2.1 so interesting...but...now that you mention it being the line of marriage...hmmmmmm....*shakes coins hard*...Come on 2.1...come to mama...*grin*

Shelley, the above paragraph may sound odd to you if you've only been quietly reading this forum for a few weeks. I've been on the most incredible, phenomenal journey guided by the Yi and my dreams to the root of a very strong fear of marriage that has kept me single for the past...well...awhile anyway...*grin* I never would have said such a thing just six months ago.

Back to you Kevin...I really am trying to understand the lines in all the hexagrams. And, after reading your notes on 2, I thought about it a lot today...still thinking about it actually.

The lines are about change after all, so the question is "What can receptivity change into?" Action, non-action and states of being. Also...it appears to me the changing lines correlate with the hexagrams they change into individually.

2.1 has a time element to it...that "approaching Winter" feel... hoarfrost and ice. 24 has a time element as well. It's the first month of Winter. Is 24 an action hexagram? Is Winter an action time of year? No...thunder rests in the earth, and the kings close the passes so that no one can travel abroad. So 2.1 can mean having harvested your crops, canned your fruits and vegetables and made your trades with your neighbors, hurry home with your winter provisions to rest before the gates are closed. It could also mean get that last minute Christmas shopping done now. At any rate, why would 2.1 tell one to take non-action and wait for a time of...non-action? I need help...this is where I get stuck on the possibility it's a non-action line.

2.2 is, of course, the essence of hexagram 2. 7 is about the army lying hidden, receptive to the signs, ready to spring to action. In 7, the best action is non-action. So they basically correlate. 2.2 just seems a lot more gentle than 7.

2.3...I like what both Candid and Tash say about this line, and both interpretations segue quite nicely into 15.

2.4...I like your rendition of the line...I'm going to study it some more to try to get a better understanding of 16.

2.5...Reserve...discretion. Well it's the perfect state of being for moving into 8 isn't it? Where one makes oneself available for union. One doesn't initiate union mind you, but opens one's arms receptively to it.

2.6 becomes 23...collapse. Dragons are fighting. One represents action. One represents non-action. It's like "I should take the action...or I should not take the action...well should I? or should I not? If I do...if I don't..." bzzzzz bzzzzz "ooohhh so sorry Mr. Querent...your time is up...you lose...COLLAPSE! But here's Don Fardo to tell you all about your lovely consolation prize."

Again...I'd love your thoughts.

Love,

Val