17 again

[klann]

Ok, so here I am: a few weeks ago, I asked about reconnecting with someone whom I’ve “lost” several months ago. I’ve followed IC advice (59>17), made contact, got the reply.
Now I’m in a vacuum, without patience, a bit restless, curious about what the future holds. I asked how the things will develop and got 18 > 17

As I see 18, it completely fits the situation: I’ve let things decay, I did not nurture the connection and it got “lost”. Now I’ve decided to “get back on track” to mend what has decayed, to try to focus again, to get back on the path.

However, the hex 18 is completely changing to 17 (which indicates future, as I see it) and then I am not sure what it is all about.
The way I see it is that though I am back on the right (?) path I cannot expect to make the other person to just follow me in whatever I want (or how fast I want it to be) but I have to wait for “the following” to come naturally on its own. I have to be firm in patience and adapt to the circumstances/time/tempo, to pace myself.

Am I anywhere close to the proper reading? And, does this 17 imply positive development or does it just say “sit and wait it out, and just accept whatever happens”?

Thank you very much for your help.

 

[angels_goldenrose]

A suggestion.......

I think you hit the nail on the head here with this and answered your own question

As I see 18, it completely fits the situation: I’ve let things decay, I did not nurture the connection and it got “lost”. Now I’ve decided to “get back on track” to mend what has decayed, to try to focus again, to get back on the path.

Perhaps 18--17 is just what you said here- to repair what is spoiled(18) follow your natural instincts (17) in order to repair it? Follow what you think is the best course in order to nurture the connection! Following could be actually following and trusting what is natural to you, afterall nurturing comes from our natural response to ease our pain, people close to us and of course ourselves!

Follow your natural instincts to repair the connection!!

Hope all goes well with this!!

 

[angels_goldenrose]

haha Tired- another thought....

Tired I just realised you asked how things would develop! the future! To me it says that repairing what is spoiled will lead to naturally following or nurturing your connection. Do you feel that repairng what is spoiled is the natural progression for your connection? If that feels right to you, then perhaps this is how you should allow things to develop. I don't believe the future is set in stone, I think our choices are whats important! Perhaps this is confirming the best course.

 

[klann]

Thank you very much for the comment (both of them)

Actually, I felt like repairing the connection after such a long time (seven months) and I followed my instincts. I did that and got the answer which, however, struck me as a... polite, nice and well-mannered but aloof, and it kind of dampened down my initial enthusiasm. I don't know what I expected, maybe to get an impression that the other person is happy to have the contact (since we actually could not have had it by now, we didn't have each other's emails, phones, etc. I've gone through trouble to find it)... and I didn't feel that.

So, that's why I've asked about the development, and got 17 as the resulting hex. Yes, maybe you do have the point: by repairing the connection I got some feeble development, but then I guess that's it...

The problem is that I am not even sure how I should formulate the question in order to get a proper answer.

 

[angels_goldenrose]

Hi klann, sorry about that I think I misread your post!

I asked how the things will develop and got 18 > 17

I think its simply saying that by you repairing what is spoiled is allowing for a natural development. I'm only new to I-ching so this is just my idea on it.

Following to me means following your natural feelings with this situation/connection.

FOLLOWING has supreme success. Perseverance furthers. No blame.

I don't think that the following you get after repairing is feeble from this perhaps it means quite the contrary.

The translation I have here also says "following without resistance" so this to me says going with what you feel is right.

A suggestion maybe you could ask- where you want to go next with this connection- where do you naturally feel drawn (17) with it?

Maybe others will have some ideas on questions.

Where do I really want to go next with this?
What do I want from this connection?
What do I really need from this connection?
What step can I take to get what I need from it?

I hope thats helpful.

 

[angels_goldenrose]

ps.

Some more ideas for you....

The trigram Tui, the Joyous, whose attribute is gladness, is above; Chên, the
Arousing, which has the attribute of movement, is below. Joy in movement
induces following. The Joyous is the youngest daughter, while the Arousing
is the eldest son. An older man defers to a young girl and shows her
consideration. By this he moves her to follow him.

You said that you felt "dampened down" perhaps this is the answer to this feeling. "Joy in movement induces following" maybe by being more joyful you could take steps to secure your 'someones' trust/affections? By being positive and joyful this often motivates other people to join in with you- people that are joyful/fun are wonderful to have in your life (perhaps you could be a positive influence in your "someones" life?)

So find your own joy in taking this connection further? perhaps you could show your 'someone' consideration in an uplifting way.

I think this relating hexagram is saying that you could get something very positive from this connection- is there a way you could bring joy into it?

Have fun
Trish x

 

[klann]

A suggestion maybe you could ask- where you want to go next with this connection- where do you naturally feel drawn (17) with it?

Maybe others will have some ideas on questions.

I hope thats helpful.

Oh, I do know where I want to go It's just that I do not see that neither from the IC answer nor from the tone of the person's reply...

As far as this is concerned:

is there a way you could bring joy into it?

I guess I could send another mail but I really do not feel I should.

Still, thank you for the suggestions regarding formulation of the questions, I will definitely try some of these.

And, yes, it would be helpful to read ideas of more experienced people, since I am rather new in this myself, but I deeply appreaciate your ideas and find them very helpful.

klann, xx

 

[klann]

All roads lead to 17

Dear angels_goldenrose,

I followed your kind advice and formulated the question thus: "What step can I take to get what I need from the connection?"
And got 64 > 17

17 yet again. Every time I get the same resulting hexagram, and now I really don't know what to think of it. I have read all the threads here that are in any way connected to 17, and now I'm afraid that it all got mixed up. Especially since all the hexagrams I got (59, 18 and 64) have many changing lines so I shifted my attention to the resulting one, i.e. 17.

If you have any ideas, or if anyone could clue me in, in any way, regarding the reading, it would me more than helpful, since the question concerns my DOING something about the whole situation and I am not able to discern any concrete direction implied by the hex.

The way I see it, 64.1 and 64.2. talk about being patient, keeping things under planned control. 64.5 talks about success that has "justified the deed" and 64.6 warns against being over-confident and ruining everything achieved until then.
BUT then comes 17 which is about following and adapting to the demands of the time. Since the line 17.3. is the first unchanging line, I have paid close attention to that. It states "When the right connection with distinguished people has been found, a
certain loss naturally ensues. A man must part company with the inferior
and superficial. But in his heart he will feel satisfied, because he seeks and
needs for the development of his personality. The important thing is to
remain firm. He must know what he wants and not be led astray by
momentary inclinations."
And that is where I get lost. For, separately, I do understand both 64 and 17, but one AFTER the other I just feel baffled.
Or, I'm reading it in a completely wrong way...

Please help.

 

[sollina]

Hi, klann,

This all seems to be pointing at the same, I can see no contradiction.

64 points out to rejuvenation after stagnation. That is what happened to you: you had a period of passiveness and then you tried to move things ahead (which is the same that 18 talked about). The change is prepared but not there yet: you made the contact but that is not everything you wanted. However, you’ve set things in motion.
At the same time, though, it reminds you of the fact that the aim has yet not been reached and to be careful not to “mess it up”. There is some opposition (here, obviously, it’s the two of you since the other person is not responding in the way you’ve expected) but also a hope to bring them together by the same goal (you’d know better than me what that common goal might be).

Lines 64.1 and 64.2 talk about necessity to be patient, to move with the times. You feel the need to push things to move forward, but that would be very wrong because the time is not yet right. By doing so, you will not only spare yourself the humiliation but also preserve the energy needed to move forward when the time comes.

Line 64.5 speaks of the success which will come if the previous conditions are fulfilled. The road to it was hard but it was worthwhile.
Line 64.6 however, reminds one not to lose perspective.

The ensuing hex 17 is about adapting oneself, about following another person but ONLY when the time is right.

Line 17.3 is the lowest non changing line and I see it – and I would like to hear a word from a more experienced member, too – is about getting what you want but coming thus in a position to lose something else over it. I cannot know this but ask yourself: if you got this something that you’d want, is there something else you would have to let go of?

 

[klann]

Thank you Sollina,

following your interpretation which points out at being patient, waiting for the right moment instead of pushing things ahead before the time is right, I asked the IC a more precise question:
"How can I expect things to develop between us if I remain passive for the time being?" and I got (again) 17, changing to 26.

The way I see it is that passive attitude is still suggsted, not only by hex 17 as a whole but by all the changing lines.
Furthemore, line 26.1 (the only non-changing one) gives the same advice saying: "A man wishes to make vigorous advance, but circumstances present an obstacle. He sees himself held back firmly. If he should attempt to fore an advance, it would lead him into misfortune. Therefore it is better for him to compose himself and to wait until an outlet is offered for release of his stored-up energies."

That part is clear.

But, as far as the general answer is concerned (the overal outlook for the things between us) I am not so sure. So, ok, I remain passive and... what happens?

So, please, if anyone could help, I'd appreciate that. Thank you.

 

[sollina]

17>26

"How can I expect things to develop between us if I remain passive for the time being?" and I got (again) 17, changing to 26.

17 > 26

This time you got 17 as the first not as the sexond hex, which, in my opinion, only reinforces your previous readings.
Earlier, the surpressed energy (59) gave way and you made the contact, continuing thus what had stopped, working on what had been spoiled (18). That led to success in the way that you have managed to rejuvenate the connection (64).

All of these, however, kept warning you that the time "for more" has not yet come, advising you to hold your horses and wait for the favourable times (17).

Now you are in this state - waiting for the opportunity, "following" the advice. What it will lead to is 26, The taming power of the great, or Potential energy, which means: restraint, resolution and readiness to act in the right moment.

That is how I see that. But, I am being in optimistic state of mind, so...