43.1.2.3.4>8 and emotions

[wind]

Hello friends. I have an interesting situation that shouldn't take any of my attention, but it does none the less.

I have a long time male friend that has been in touch with me for many years. In the event of my husband and I separating, as most friends do, he took up being there for me. I, myself, have sort of steered clear of not discussing the situation because honestly, I hate it being the focus of our friendship. I prefer our normal conversation where we speak of each other, offer an ear, some friendly advise and catch up with each other.

Lately, he has driven the conversation back to my divorce over and over again, even after being told I don't feel like getting into it. The worst part of it all is that he is hot and cold about it. One day he'll tell me how my husband will come back and work things out and then on another day, he'll tell me how I'm better off and this is for the best. To say the least, this friendship is emotionally mind boggling. Honestly, I'd rather not speculate on anything and just work on living my life.

While I do cherish the friendship and the insight, I have this niggling feeling in my gut that he's playing with my emotions. I asked the Yi for insight to whether my emotions were being played upon and received more confusion.

43.1.2.3.4>8

With so many moving lines, I am unbelievably confused. Would anyone care to take a crack at this?

 

[goddessliss]

Hey wind, Nice you have a guy friend to bounce things off and hang out with sometimes.
Without the reading it sounds to me like he has feelings for you but wonders if you got together whether your exhusband would come back into the picture thereby leaving him hurt or even broken hearted.

With the reading, it sounds to me like he has feelings for you but wonders if it is too soon to tell you, which is when he speaks about you better off without your husband. When he thinks about if he has a relationship with you, he may appear a little short when he speaks about you and your husband working things out.
He is just trying to decide what to do about his feeling Hex 43 and what sort of relationship he wants Hex 8. - Liss

 

[wind]

Good day Liss! I hope this message finds you well.

Yes. It is very nice to have a friend that has been a part of my life since I was 13! I'm 39 now and to have kept this friendship for so long and through so much is a blessing.

I am a bit freaked out by the implication that he may want more for many reasons. For starters, I am no where near ready for anyone to enter my life now. I have the kids that need me more than anyone and honestly, I am not ready to trust again.

The see-saw of his thoughts makes me have a rough go of what I am feeling inside. Just when I am determined to move on and fight for everything I can get for my babies, he throws this false hope at me and it literally rocks me to the core. Of course I want my family back and together. This is the reason we moved from NY- to be a family. Sadly, my ex does keep giving strong hints of wanting to come back. However, I have yet to see him move out and break up with his girlfriend. That would be the first step to me considering anything... and I am certainly not holding my breath for it to happen.

I suppose the right thing to do here is just take his thoughts on the situation with a grain of salt and stick to guns. As far as a relationship with him, I will not even entertain the thought as of now. I'll have to see where this path takes me.

I was super confused by so many lines and what they meant. I thank you as always. <3

 

[goddessliss]

Good day Liss! I hope this message finds you well.

Yes. It is very nice to have a friend that has been a part of my life since I was 13! I'm 39 now and to have kept this friendship for so long and through so much is a blessing.

I am a bit freaked out by the implication that he may want more for many reasons. For starters, I am no where near ready for anyone to enter my life now. I have the kids that need me more than anyone and honestly, I am not ready to trust again.

The see-saw of his thoughts makes me have a rough go of what I am feeling inside. Just when I am determined to move on and fight for everything I can get for my babies, he throws this false hope at me and it literally rocks me to the core. Of course I want my family back and together. This is the reason we moved from NY- to be a family. Sadly, my ex does keep giving strong hints of wanting to come back. However, I have yet to see him move out and break up with his girlfriend. That would be the first step to me considering anything... and I am certainly not holding my breath for it to happen.

I suppose the right thing to do here is just take his thoughts on the situation with a grain of salt and stick to guns. As far as a relationship with him, I will not even entertain the thought as of now. I'll have to see where this path takes me.

I was super confused by so many lines and what they meant. I thank you as always. <3

Hmm...well my thoughts on anyone wanting to come back are probably the same as yours. Prove It To Me First! But if he leaves her and then you don't want him then that leaves him with noone - a typical male in these situations. It takes courage to be on your own without anyone maybe in the sidelines and until the male in these scenarios can do that, I personally don't think they're worth the upheaval in emotions.
I have wondered many times, if my exhusband were to be living life on his own would we ever be able to become at least friends??? A question that remains unanswered and one that is of little importance these days.
As for your friend - you know in your own heart what you want and it sounds like you are being strong and courageous and responsible in putting you and your children first. The best love you can give to you and them. - Liss

 

[wind]

Thank you. The only love I have left right now it completely focused on my kids. They have always been #1 for me. Never a doubt there.

I know how you feel. For now, yes, there is no reason to be friends, other than for the kids. However, the kids grow up and graduate and get married and then come the grandkids. For the sake of the kids and grandkids, you'd hope that a friendship could in the very least be established. My parents had a nasty, drag-out divorce when I was 11. My father had two other kids with his girlfriend, while married to my mother. I had lived with my father from 15. He died when I was 19. When I got married, I had to hide my wedding from my stepmother because my mother and siblings refused to allow her there. It was a terrible experience for me; having to lie and feel like a part of my family was not there for the most important day of my life.

Then when I had the twins, I had to worry and schedule visits so no one bumped into each other. It was horrible and I never want my kids to experience that. I was very close to my father. Now after having the same thing done to me (no illegitimate children in my case), I actually hate him for what he did to us all. I hate my stepmother for being stupid and tearing a family apart. Her need to say, "But he came home to me", was childish and no different than the game my ex's girlfriend plays. No thoughts for the children involved.

Sometimes I wonder if the active mind a woman, such as ourselves, are born with, is a curse. We can't stop the rush of thoughts and "what ifs" even when we try. So what option do we have other than submerging ourselves deeper and deeper into everything around us for distraction? I wish that I could be heartless and shut down the way my ex has.... then again, I would never do that because my kids need me and I need them.

It's a no win situation. All we can both do is stay strong and be courageous!

 

[meng]

I actually hate him for what he did to us all. I hate my stepmother for being stupid and tearing a family apart. Her need to say.... etc

Thought I should mention: speaking out from 43 includes ones inner dialogue. I've found this to be especially true when 43 has several lines. On one hand, it's important to say it to just get it out of our system, but if it becomes part of our thinking, it doesn't hold us together; not with others, not with ourselves.

As a guy, my view is that guys process things differently than women, but it doesn't mean we love any less. It doesn't mean we hurt any less. Women speak of their unmet needs, but a guy isn't supposed to bring that up. Women complain if her guy gets out of shape, and sometimes smells like an ape; man, it's hormones, baby! What of the man who no longer matters, whose kids receive his first love's care, and is now nothing more than a beast of burden?

Now, I know that some guys are just bums, and I also know that some chicks are just sluts. But I don't classify either gender as such.

 

[wind]

Oh Meng. Thank you for the further explanation of 43. I hope I am not out spoken in the following, but it's a belief I have about men and women.

I believe that women occupy their minds with outcomes and consequences of actions/ lack of actions. I feel that men do not concern themselves as much with ramifications or the outcome of impulse behavior.

Now separately, we sound like horrible species based on gender. However, when these two forces are brought together, beautiful stuff happens. I have learned, through my husband, how to be brave and take a leap of faith. I have shown him the merit of restraint and thinking through. We learned new aspects of life through each other's point of view. Simply bliss!

My situation has taken a huge turn. He has been unfaithful. I have become indignant over the years of never having my needs met. He has suffered trauma in his childhood. So have I, apparently. Issues we never dealt with or knew how to comfort one another with. We are both acknowledging this now.

What was done to me has indeed made an impact of what happened in my childhood. I had two amazing parents. Together they were explosive. I never condemned my father for his adulterous ways. He was my idle. Nor did I ever stop and see the impact on my mother... that is, until it happened to me. I understand now. And i never want my kids to feel the way i do.

Men of course have feelings. Of course they love. That very reason is why I love men. All types. We just have a different way of projecting ourselves.

Thanks for the insight. I do appreciate it greatly!

 

[goddessliss]

Please try not to hate anyone, wind. If you do, it means you live with anger inside and that gets passed down to the next generation from the behaviour and patterns it creates for us. Forgiving doesn't mean forgetting nor doesn't exonerate the wrong doing but it does free our heart and our soul and allows us to move forward with more love in our hearts and our spirit moves towards Heaven with more peace.

I believe that whom ever we meet, it's on a soul level to learn our soul lessons, particularly our lovers and it's all about working out how we can get along on the earthly plane. If we allow ourselves to be distracted by the mundaness of blame and who did what and wrongs and rights, well it's all really just a waste of our time and causes more pain and hurt within. - Liss

 

[meng]

I believe that women occupy their minds with outcomes and consequences of actions/ lack of actions. I feel that men do not concern themselves as much with ramifications or the outcome of impulse behavior.

Very interesting comment. Will have to give it more thought.

Thanks for the insight. I do appreciate it greatly!

Likewise. :bows:

 

[wind]

You're right Liss. And I was hasty in saying such. When this all started, I contacted my stepmother and forgave her. When you forgive, you lift a weight off of your soul. None of us are perfect.

I do have things I need to work through... and interestingly enough, this post and talking through thing has been an epiphany of sorts. I was on the edge of seeing what went wrong in my marriage and within the last few weeks and more recently, last few days, great progress has been made in my relationship.

We both have issues from childhood that went unresolved and it effected our adulthood. Add in the transitions we have been through in the last few years and here we are on the brink of fully reconciling!

Of course there will be a lot that needs to be worked out, but the hardest part for me will be moving past the infidelity. He had hugged me the other night and my mother asked me if I thought about the other women he was with.... honestly, I did not. I thought about the only man I ever fell in love with and how him holding me will never be second to none. It felt right.

Hoping for the best... ofc.

Meng, I would love a full on conversation about men and women... heck, about people in general. All on all, every single person has something beautiful about them.

 

[meng]

Meng, I would love a full on conversation about men and women... heck, about people in general. All on all, every single person has something beautiful about them.

That's a big apple to bite into, lol. But if you'd like to open the topic for general discussion - if using the IC as the model of man and woman, it would fit in the Divination area; if opened to general discussion, other than using an IC model, it would fit in Open Space. I wouldn't do it, but please, be our guest.

My mind uses bird models a lot for the past year, because I can easily observe the sublime order that works in their world, which is also like peeking into the ages of the dinosaur mind. There are species that spend practically all their time on the ground, really tough birds, they run like raptors, act like raptors, and make their own mark in the pecking order. There is rarely a fight because each species knows where they fit in, and when their turn to eat will come, if it does at all. But that's life.

Yesterday I sensed energy from a small wash that runs through the neighbor's property, just over the fence. I kept staring, as in a dream trance observer, waiting for something to happen. A rabbit ran down the sandy wash among the threatening thorns, a coyote with nose to the ground following not far behind. The rabbit escaped by finding its way inside this fence; the coyote instinctively knew he was being watched, though I was still as a post, and had the wind in my favor. We looked at each other for a few seconds, he hid his head behind a chola... it was comical, as they're known to be; he or she was clearly caught in the game of see but don't be seen, eat but don't be eaten, day after day in the natural world - that is my model at this time. The coyote existed as 36-ish as it could, and faded back down the sandy path through the chola slew; when from out of the thorny thicket flew a seriously big cat, when he found himself in the path of the coyote, running for its life up the hill to some big pines, it could easily climb, on the neighbor's property. Three lives, and the coyote was clearly the alpha predator, but that big cat would have given that coyote serious flesh wounds, that could become infected and die. So again the natural respect of the hierarchy, which is based entirely on survival. To eat but not be eaten, each and every day. Fortunately, most predators usually place humans higher in that order than themselves. Those who are bitten by local rattle snakes are usually messing with them, and they're not very good playmates.

As we know, the bird hierarchy is quite different from most human hierarchies, and is species specific. But their is a natural respect that they all have of the order, created by the hierarchy, is impressive. They seldom fight outside their own species, but within it, they are more aggressive: fanciful displays, fanned tail feathers, sharp and long beak wide open. In the bird world, size matters. But what really matters is respect of the order. I hear angry birds fighting and even warring birds, but nearly always within their own specific species. Each other species stays out of the way until the coast is clear of the alpha carnivore. These big cats next to a sparrow really is of dinosaur proportion to all but some big carnivorous birds. One of the names carved by finger into the wet and set cement on the back patio says "FLUFFY". Turns out Fluffy was the original owner's indoor cat, except for this day when they sat outside, and the cat was picked up and carried off by a local owl.

The male/female roles in that order are fairly simple and well defined. Humans? I honestly don't know where to begin a discussion of the much more complex gender models of humans, where yesterday's adult kink is today's kids' fads.

I'll keep an eye out for the thread, should you decide to create it.

 

[deusa]

It always surprises me why it is so easy to hate the other woman instead of accepting that it is the man's responsability.
Do you know what he told her? Do you know how he described you to her? Probably, as all cheaters do, he told her she is the love of his life. And now he is hurting her too, getting near you...
You both, women, are being cheated...

Does she know he shows you he would like to get back together?

Kids are more happy when there is no hate, wether the parents are together or separated. Being careful to not denigrate the other, having a polite or even friendly relationship, is very important.
Being together and feeling unhappy is terrible for the kids, it shows them a way of living that is depressing.

You have to be happy YOURSELF. Alone. With the kids.
And then things will unfold. I whatever way.

 

[meng]

It always surprises me why it is so easy to hate the other woman instead of accepting that it is the man's responsability.

To keep Jerry Springer on the air.

 

[wind]

Sure it is. Misguided anger topped with envy. What I really needed to do all along was think about was why he was faithful for all of those years. What dynamic changed between us and what part of itvwas my responsibility. That doesn't mean the punishment fit the crime... by far ot did not.

I needed to find me again. The strong, driven, flirty, intelligent, witty and enthusiastic me. He needed to do the same. He also needed to realize that when I became a full time mother, I was now wearing more than one hat. I didn't have the same availability to be spontaneous, spunky and just go out on a whim. The wall began being built.

Not going to act like these last few weeks have been sunshine and flowers. Its been difficult, trying, awkward, painful and yet I have faced it bravely. I personally am in a better state of mind.... and not because of him. He needs to find the same for himself.

 

[precision grace]

Sure it is. Misguided anger topped with envy. What I really needed to do all along was think about was why he was faithful for all of those years. What dynamic changed between us and what part of itvwas my responsibility. That doesn't mean the punishment fit the crime... by far ot did not.

I needed to find me again. The strong, driven, flirty, intelligent, witty and enthusiastic me. He needed to do the same. He also needed to realize that when I became a full time mother, I was now wearing more than one hat. I didn't have the same availability to be spontaneous, spunky and just go out on a whim. The wall began being built.

Not going to act like these last few weeks have been sunshine and flowers. Its been difficult, trying, awkward, painful and yet I have faced it bravely. I personally am in a better state of mind.... and not because of him. He needs to find the same for himself.

shucks, sounds like middle age crisis? Hope you re-discover your dao.

 

[wind]

Your guess is as good as mine. It's a work in progress...

I feel as if I am doing great. This is the best state of mind I have been in for myself in ages. Him- not so good. Too much stored up wrath for himself. Just tyring to lead by example. He needs to learn how to forgive himself.

 

[precision grace]

We all tend to hold ourselves and our dearest to impossible standards. If only we were as strict with our enemies..

 

[wind]

Ain't that the truth. The world would be less complicated if it were all that simple. The ups and downs are killing me- Not on my behalf. Upon his.

 

[littlebuddha]

Hello friends. I have an interesting situation that shouldn't take any of my attention, but it does none the less.

I have a long time male friend that has been in touch with me for many years. In the event of my husband and I separating, as most friends do, he took up being there for me. I, myself, have sort of steered clear of not discussing the situation because honestly, I hate it being the focus of our friendship. I prefer our normal conversation where we speak of each other, offer an ear, some friendly advise and catch up with each other.

Lately, he has driven the conversation back to my divorce over and over again, even after being told I don't feel like getting into it. The worst part of it all is that he is hot and cold about it. One day he'll tell me how my husband will come back and work things out and then on another day, he'll tell me how I'm better off and this is for the best. To say the least, this friendship is emotionally mind boggling. Honestly, I'd rather not speculate on anything and just work on living my life.

While I do cherish the friendship and the insight, I have this niggling feeling in my gut that he's playing with my emotions. I asked the Yi for insight to whether my emotions were being played upon and received more confusion.

43.1.2.3.4>8

I agree with godessliss that he has feelings for you and is confused what to do next (when to do it and whether to do it in the first place.)

Sometimes I wonder if the active mind a woman, such as ourselves, are born with, is a curse. We can't stop the rush of thoughts and "what ifs" even when we try. So what option do we have other than submerging ourselves deeper and deeper into everything around us for distraction? I wish that I could be heartless and shut down the way my ex has.... then again, I would never do that because my kids need me and I need them.

I don't think we are born with 'rushes of thought', i believe it's a by-product of socialization; anyway it is - it's not a curse, but it does not leave the room for Dao; we can indeed control our thoughts - and our emotions from there, shut down the "mind monkey" and see where the flow takes us.
Btw, i think there are several questions that you might ask, besides the opening one, among else about the prospects of reconciliation with the ex and the potential for relationship with the friend.
Hope everything pans out in the best possible way for everyone included!