Clarity,
Office 17622,
PO Box 6945,
London.
W1A 6US
United Kingdom
Phone/ Voicemail:
+44 (0)20 3287 3053 (UK)
+1 (561) 459-4758 (US).
A nice take on 44,like that one. But it's also the relation between the father and the eldest daughter.
On trigram is metal and the other is wood. The inside the daughter and the outside the father. Feelings on the outside and the continuaty of growht on the inside.
And a changing line on the 4 the line of the heart.
Like the father who is giving the fertility to the daughter. As being the idea that the daughter is the dream of the father and especially the eldest one as being the only daughter who is female on earth and in heaven.
I think theres just no fish
lol.. nope, just no fish. Frank and I are just playing in the pond.
Hi,
Can you, Frank, or everyone "play" a little more on the father-daughter aspect of 44.4 ?
maria
Is this what you mean, or do you mean only regard heaven/wind?
Hi,
Can you, Frank, or everyone "play" a little more on the father-daughter aspect of 44.4 ?
maria
What if the story had an awful father, who subjected his oldest daughter to abuse, like the story which Rinda wrote?
Hi, María:... I had a feeling that the fish is not the impotrant issue here but the tank. Why we don't open the bag and let the fish enter. To protect ourselfs from the damage the fish can do ?
If you love me, don't love me. I have a tank but sorry "fish" I can let you come in.
"be fertile or not" is the desicion should be taken.
To eat the apple or not? To loss "paradise" or not ? ...
It’s very strange. According to Freud fish is a phallic symbol as a snake, so it, must be yang not yin.If you read line two of 44 in the commentary of Wilhelm he states 'the fish likewise belongs to the yin principle.'
It’s very strange. According to Freud fish is a phallic symbol as a snake, so it, must be yang not yin.
Then again, I wouldn't place too much importance on Freud. If he could find something phallic in a pair of slippers, he would.
If you read his “Introduction to Psychoanalysis” you know how logical he was deriving conclusions. I think widespread neglecting of Freud comes from simplification and distortion of his ideas. The simple fact is that a few read his books and most people just reproduce cliché. Of course, from 1900 many aspects of collective unconscious have changed but it was Freud who discovered for us that the unconscious exists.Then again, I wouldn't place too much importance on Freud. If he could find something phallic in a pair of slippers, he would.
If you read his “Introduction to Psychoanalysis” you know how logical he was deriving conclusions. I think widespread neglecting of Freud comes from simplification and distortion of his ideas. The simple fact is that a few read his books and most people just reproduce cliché. Of course, from 1900 many aspects of collective unconscious have changed but it was Freud who discovered for us that the unconscious exists.
I know this is an old thread but recently got 44.4 when asking "how do I deal with my anger appropriately?"44 as being the instincts give the woman not enough protection so the heart can be damaged and the result can be infertility.
From the father the daughter can learn how to use her instincts which man can be trusted or not. So she can learn how to open her heart and to whom be fertile.
I have received both lines in separate readings recently. for 57.4 line 6 was also involved, leading to 28 (too much)I just read this thread. It's a little late to jump in, I suppose, but I'm curious about the practical experiences others have had with these lines. I've always had a sense of these two lines in the context of food:
44.4: When there's no fish in the wrapping, there's nothing here that will feed you
but...
57.4 In the fields you will find three kinds of game.
So, it's advantageous to look beyond your immediate situation and have an expectation of sustenance from other sources.
Has anyone had any experiences with these lines?
Miakoda
I know you wrote this a few months ago, but I recently posted a reading where I got this hexagram and I’ve been trying to understand it better. Just wanted to say that this was such a treat to read, so well written and insightful, thank you.Loved this thread, Thanks. My two cents,
IMHO, hex 44´s essence is really about the meeting of two parties. One is a wild undomesticated cunning yin line, empowered and in command of her sexuality, unlike her more docile sisters. This "temptation" made flesh, will meet with every single yang line above, until she manages to stripped away all masculinity when she becomes hex 2, after kicking the last yang line, position 6 (the sage) of hex 23 out of his position, replacing him with the newborn royal heir. She begins postrating herself very humbly before the 5 yang lines, and here comes the cunning part, she has no intention to keep still as a yin line should, because of her position 1, masculine, which compels her to move.
We have a natural tendency to focus on her, but the name of the hex is very precise. Its a meeting and its about the relationship she creates with yang lines 2 to 6. The second line, 44.2 as it changes to yin, will lead to hex 33, Retreat. In 44.2, the young querent has sex with her and tries to keep it on the hush. But he gets her pregnant. He tries to flee from his responsibilites but can´t and becomes yin. The other 4 yang lines (the guests) are waiting anxious for their turn.
When she arrives to the next yang line 3, who is unable to restrain his lust, and will try to take her by force with no success, things are looking grimm for maledom. To the point that line 3 feels deeply ashamed for not being the one who got her pregnant. He also turns into yin. From here, hex 12, things will get worse for yang. Yin has taken over the trigram below, turning the unmovable macho dominant tradition (mountain) into something feminine and fertile, like earth.
She will now move to engage with line 4, but as she checks him out, she can see that he has no intention to honor her, treating her as inferior, through indiference. Her response will be hex 20, no more sex, she is already pregnant, and her belly is showing off. After subduing him and turning line 4 into yin, she will now try to topple the King, the alpha male on pos 5, by asking him to accept her as bride, as she is bringing to life a possible heir. The King will accept her and after line 5 changes to yin, her status becomes close to hex 44.5 and her influence is now very powerful, she becomes a Queen.
When she intents to get to the top of the hexgram 23, which will turn into hex 2, she encounters the sage, who will also fall into her hands, but will also educate her, so she has manners and can dignify her post as Queen. A good example would be the movie "My fair lady". The end of pregnancy is seen in line 6 of hexagram 23, where the superior man rides over evil (temptation or untamed yin), turning our once wild undomesticated female into a queen, and she has now transport and a comfortable place to nourish her child. The strongwilled female becomes a mare, following the laws of Hex 1. From there, in hex 24, masculinity recovers its poise and returns to the correct path.
So, in a nutshell. 44.2 is pleasant sex, where the young male intent is to hide the female from other males, trying to keep her for himself. But he has neither the experience nor the skills to tame her or respect her power, less to confront stronger males. She on the other hand, has sex as tool for seduction and gaining influence, and pregnancy to establish her position in high society. 44.4 is an older man, with power, but full of contempt for her freedom in sexuality. He won´t get any and she will offer herself to the highest of them all (line 5) to bring her child to safety.
I am sure, many will disagree with my story, but thats ok, its fiction, don't worry, you can make what you want from it. But maybe you can also shift your view of hex 44 from this dangerous femme fatale into something more organic, less dogmatic and more human. It is my opinion that SHE lives in each and every woman on Earth, ready to wield her power to counteract excessive masculinity and to secure her children´s safety from uncontrolled male or female violence against infancy. She is the beautiful and fearless peasant girl, able to manipulate and use men´s vicious lust and her reward is becoming a Queen on her own right.
I would hazard a guess that she resides deep in every man on earth too.It is my opinion that SHE lives in each and every woman on Earth, ready to wield her power to counteract excessive masculinity and to secure her children´s safety from uncontrolled male or female violence against infancy.
Clarity,
Office 17622,
PO Box 6945,
London.
W1A 6US
United Kingdom
Phone/ Voicemail:
+44 (0)20 3287 3053 (UK)
+1 (561) 459-4758 (US).