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7 unchanging

sinbaru

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If you received 7 unchanging in reponse to "What is the current state of this relationship" would it make sense to possibly interpret that as the two parties being in a state of war? 7 refers to a disciplined campaign to win something which is basically a war. If this is the case why would 6 come up instead? What's the difference between the two? Is 7 the actual fighting that comes after the initial disagreement?
 
L

lightofreason

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7 covers uniformity -with containment comes devotion to another/other - put on the uniform and do as your told unconditionally.

6 covers issues of compromise - going half way, no more, no less. The Army reflects a potential, 6 is the actualisation where the last resort is to call in the Army (or threaten to and so focus on compromise through containment etc - 06 shares space with 47; on the other hand 07 shares space with 04 and so the generic focus on socialisation dynamics.)

06 - with containment comes singlemindedness (aka devotion to self)
07 - with containment comes dualmindedness (aka devotion to another/other)

In the traditional sequence 06 pairs with 05 for an overall sense of compromise (wait for the right moment in 05), 07 pairs with 08 for an overall focus on uniformity (the massing aspect)

07 infrastructure is described by:

010000 (07)
100001 (27)
--------
110001 = 41 a generic focus on concentrating, distilling and that develops into 'uniformity', concentration of 'force' etc., etc.

06 has an infrastructure described by:

010111 (06)
100001 (27)
--------
110110 = 58 = intensity in expression (self-reflection, mirroring etc , doubled) - manifest in court issues etc

Chris.
 

autumn

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I have gotten 7 unchanging when asking 'relationship' kinds of questions, and for me, it has turned out to be a neutral type of response. Things proceed as the already are. No change.
 

sinbaru

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lightofreason said:
the last resort is to call in the Army
Chris.

After the "conflict" we call in the Army? This would make it seem like the conflict is a conflict of escalating tensions involving words only because when that doesn't work we resort to stronger measures.

7 has always baffled me for some reason and when I got it regarding the state of a relationship I was thrown for a loop. I read it as a possible "war" because all the other reponses surrounding this particular issue have been very negative involving 33, 29, 47 etc.

I had it in mind to read 6.6 but then I realized that the lines don't always reflect a progression through the hexagram.
 

sinbaru

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autumn said:
I have gotten 7 unchanging when asking 'relationship' kinds of questions, and for me, it has turned out to be a neutral type of response. Things proceed as the already are. No change.

That would mean that in this case it didn't answer my question because that was the first time I asked that particular question. I want to assume that the Yi answered my question.
 

autumn

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"7 refers to a disciplined campaign"

Marching in the same direction. Vigilance. Preparedness.

That's just been my experience. I am not an expert, like some people on the board. My experience has just been 7 unchanging doesn't include the concepts of "to win something" or "war", as much as marching forward under organized, prepared vigilance.

You are right. It isn't describing conflict. You would get 2.6 or 6 or something of the like if it was describing a war. It's vigilance; and I think the vigilance and perhaps fear of what may happen is coming through a little bit.

Maybe think of it as a train instead of an army. Where is the train heading?
 
J

jesed

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Hi Sinbaru

Just a quick commment in case it could be useful

The time for Organize the relationship is just starting by now (between June 17 and July 31) and will last until March 16, 2007

Is not a war situation, but a time for organize, get discipline. Determine the goal of the relationship, the resources that you bhave (and those resources that you need to achieve), the way of relation.

Think in the diference between a mass and an army. Your relationship is closer to a mass or closer to an army? What do you need to became an army instead of a unorganized mass?

Now, to this first general question, I would suggest 2 next questions:
a) Qualification of my position within the relation
b) Qualification of X's position within the relation.

That would give you more elements about what the relation need to work fine like an expert army.

Best wishes
 
A

active8

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Hi Chis

Why Did you OR (union) with hex 27?

That's really 2 questions. Why OR and Why 27?

TIA
Mike
 

frank

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The Tacticus

Hi Sinbaru,

As you look to the hexagram itself, you would then see that it is based on water below and earth above. By no changing lines the Yi puts more demand on looking at the actual hexagram then to the text in the lines, as there is no change... Reading the actual Chinese character of hexagram 7, I read nothing of an Army, but I do of a kind of militairy tacticus. Zhuge Liang, among others, was one of the most famous generals or militiair campaignleaders in the past of Chinese history because of his tactical insights. The Yi is telling you that there is a time of uncertainty (water below), as therefor you ask the question, which you have to give it a thought by using the mind (earth, soberness, balance, above) for ideas to get answers. It´s time for a strategic way of handling, in a militairy discipline, by connecting forces inside (your own army!) to get a good grip on the situation. By getting 6 you would have had doubts inside and by receiving 8 you would have found the connection... You are exactly inbetween them...
Do not hestitate or doubt to much, and do not want a connection between you two already before you used straight and balanced thought and vision about what you two want in this relationship. That has to be done before moving on, and as the answer was a static hexagram, I guess that´s what you have not done before. You should before you can move on. If the situation was that accepted that you could then you would have received changing lines anyway... Now you didn´t so stand stil and be brave.

Regards,
Frank
 

dobro p

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"If you received 7 unchanging in reponse to "What is the current state of this relationship" would it make sense to possibly interpret that as the two parties being in a state of war?"

Nope. I would read it this way: the Yi's telling you how to handle the current state of the relationship. Hex 7 isn't about going to war, it's about mature management of a powerful force. In other words, you should approach this relationship with well-controlled personal force. Armies often aren't for war, remember. They're often for maintaining territorial integrity in the face of threats, real or imagined, from parties that might not respect that integrity. For avoiding war, in other words. When you're the strongest organized force in the immediate vicinity, there's much less chance of having to deal with attacks or violence.
 
L

lightofreason

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sinbaru said:
After the "conflict" we call in the Army? This would make it seem like the conflict is a conflict of escalating tensions involving words only because when that doesn't work we resort to stronger measures..

As compromise fails we escalate and that can include threats of increasing force etc. The 'conflict' label of Wilhelm is extremely misleading in that the hexagram of 06 covers:

"SUNG : dispute, plead in court, contend before a ruler, demand justice; wrangles, quarrels, litigation. The ideogram: words and public, public disputation."ERANOS p142

The intensity in the hexagram is reflected in heaven in upper = singlemindedness and water in lower = containment. And so with/from containment comes singlemindedness with the analogy to court etc.

OTOH uniformity is covered in what Wilhelm labels 'the Army':

"SHIH : troops; an organized unit, a metropolis; leader, general, model, master; organize, make functional; take as a model, imitate. The ideogram: heap and whole, organize confusion into functional units." ERANOS p151

In 07 we have with/from containment (water in lower) comes absolute trust in another/others (earth in upper) as one does in Armies, you obey orders unconditionally.

The only differences between 07 and 04 is the top line. 07 is unconditional in its 'uniforming', 04 is conditional. As such both reflect issues of socialisation etc and structuring (04 I label as 'masking', 07 as 'uniforming'. thus 49 is 'unmasking' etc)

Chris.
 
L

lightofreason

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active8 said:
Hi Chis

Why Did you OR (union) with hex 27?

That's really 2 questions. Why OR and Why 27?

TIA
Mike

It is a discovery I made when considering the properties of the methodology of self-referencing - see my pages (in order of best/current to 'old') such as:

http://members.iimetro.com.au/~lofting/myweb/introXOR.html
http://members.iimetro.com.au/~lofting/myweb/properties.html
http://members.iimetro.com.au/~lofting/myweb/linemean.html

I first came across it in my research into the derivation of meaning as we use dichotomies. IOW we are dealing with a property applicable to ANY self-referencing where, for each row, all of the elements are linked together.

Most traditional IC people dont get it or dont like it etc but that is their 'problem' in that they choose to ignore 21st century AD research in favour of 10th century BC mysticism ;-)

Many have 'played' with using logic operators on the IC but no one asked the 'right' question re what it all meant. My work on analysis of brain dynamics in deriving meaning gave me the 'clue' as to what XOR-ing ment.

The particular use of 27 is in extracting the '27-ness' of as hexagram where the XOR-ing will give you a description of the basic infrastructure of a hexagram (also see my page http://members.iimetro.com.au/~lofting/myweb/27Ness.html) 27 deals with the 'new', enlightening, sudden etc (base trigram of thunder) and quality control (discernment, mountain in upper).

Also see the developing webpage on IC spectrums:

http://members.iimetro.com.au/~lofting/myweb/icspectrums.html

SInce the IC is derived from self-referencing so it can be interrogated using XOR to describe itself. This dynamic is a property of self-referencing and is related to what our brains do - and where it can cause paradox at times : http://members.iimetro.com.au/~lofting/myweb/paradox.html THIS is associated with my main 'work' and that is with IDM - http://members.iimetro.com.au/~lofting/myweb/introIDM.html

Chris.
 
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