Anti-Oedipus, Incest, #47 .2 to #45

[petrosianii]

Last night I had perhaps the most disturbing dream I've had since the terrifying recurring nightmares I used to get as a child. In the dream, my mother and I were arguing fiercely. she got so mad that she slammed her middle toe in the kitchen cabinet, breaking it. The injury was so bad that her toe stood straight up from the instep. Then, the toe tranformed into the heel of a stiletto pump. I said something else to her, which I cannot now remember. And she replied, "Well, I wanted to **** you, too!"

...Then the dream ended.

As with all numinous dreams, I do I Ching work to see if I can uncover hidden meanings. As I wrote about the dream, I did some free association on it. Some of the thoughts, images and emotions that sprang up were sexual desire, authority, fear, shame; an episode of "Friends" were Chandler lost his toe and Monica's mother exclaimed, "Oh no! There's a toe somewhere in my kitchen!"; my foot fetish, jealousy, "The queen's sway is ending", incest, castration anxiety, penis.

But the most enlightening image I associated with the dream was the <em>Oedipus Complex</em>.

We all know Freud's Oedipus Complex theme. It runs throughout is writings in depth psychology. Though many think of it now as an antiquated, obsolete idea that has little or no merit, I disagree.

According to Freud, a boy has hidden desires to kill his father and have sex with his mother. (This idea was popularized by the late rock artist, Jim Morrison, in his hit song "Riders on the Storm"). Freud postulated the Oedipus complex because he felt the theory helped explain psychosexual development.

I think my dream involves the Oedipus complex, with one eerie twist: The dream was not about <em>my</em> Oedipus Complex, but <em>my mother's.</em>

In this sense, what I'm saying is that both mother and son have their own respective Oedipus complexes. Just as the son wants to kill the father and marry the mother, the mother wants to kill the "man" inside the boy - that is, the man who has individuated successfully and no longer sees his mother as the object of sexual deasire - and have sex with the "boy." This interplay of Oedipal complexes helps explain Freud's notion of "castration anxiety": the fear a man has of having his balls (an archetypal symbol of his strength, power, creativity, procreativity, and authority) cut off; he fears castration, not only because of his father's envy, but <em>also</em> because his unconscious knows the mother will try to emasculate him as he individuates, so as to retain him as the object of her sexual desire.

hmm...

OK. Let's back up a bit. Freud said that the boy's first object of sexual desire is his mother. OK. This makes sense. Not too hard to understand.

But I think now - in light of this dream - that it is equally true that the mother's supreme, ultimate, deepest and most powerful object of sexual desire is her son. For example, we all know that suckling, while painful, is also an extremely pleasurable experience for a mother. The nipples, as we all know, are erotogeneous zones. In addition, most married couples say that after the child is born, the mother's level of sexual desire for her husband decreases. we all know that, if forced to make a choice between her child and her husband, a mother (at least a good mother) will always choose her child. And rightly so.

These and other considerations lead me to believe that through the process of childrearing, the mother develops her own Oedipal complex alongside the child's. (Not to sound sexist, but I do believe that this complex is stronger between a mother and a son than it is between a mother and a daughter.) If true, it would easily explain why mothers tend to be so aloof and cold to the girlfriends their "little men" bring home. (This was true in my case, as my mother never liked <em>any</em> of the girls I introduced her to!).

I think that my dream has something very much to do with this "reverse Oedipal complex".

So, I did some I Ching work on it. The hexagram I got was #47 Adversity, with a change in line 2, resulting in #45 Assembling. Although I'm not altogether certain I know what line 2 represents, I will say that I have received #45 as much if not more than any other hexagram. And it's always perplexed me. I'm fairly sure it has something to do with my family, particularly my mother. However, my spiritual advisor strongle believes #45, in my case at least, has to do with an "assembling" of my true Self: i.e., Jungian individuation.

Any answers out there?

Any comments or interpretations on how these two hexagrams play into my dream and the Oedipus complex would be greatly appreciated.<em></em>

 

[martin]

Have to keep it short, not much time, but here are some free associations from the Freudian couch, well, (western) astrological ones mostly ..

The bottom trigram of hex 47 is Water - moon - mother. The bottom trigram of 45, Earth, is mother earth or the 'mystic mother' perhaps. I relate it to Neptune, astrologically.
And the top trigram of both hexagrams, Lake, to Venus: sensuality, sensual love. Neptune is also love but 'higher', something like agape.

If you look at it in this way 47 symbolizes mother + (sensual) love, which seems to fit your view of the dream very well. In 45 the sensual aspect is still there (Lake) but the mother of 47 is replaced by the mystic mother. A transformation?

I think there is a deeper truth behind this, some of it I experienced myself, and that is that for a man the search for his mother (the oedipal theme) in other women and the search for the mystic mother are closely related.
It's like the inner image of the earthly mother guides a man in the 'right' direction (of the mystic mother) but he also has to go beyond that image, ultimately. If he clings to it (and again and again chases its reflection in other women) it may become an obstacle.
Perhaps it's the same for a woman. The inner image of her father acts as a guide but sooner or later she has to go beyond it.
Hmm, I'm going Jung now, anima, animus, and his 'Electra complex', but ... no time for that now.

Makes sense?

Btw, I have read a lot of Freud but that is decades ago and I don't remember now if he mentioned this 'reversed' Oedipal complex. I will try to find it.

 

[martin]

Forgot to say that the second line, in any hexagram, may refer to the belly. Uterus?

 

[RindaR]

I think my dream involves the Oedipus complex, with one eerie twist: The dream was not about <em>my</em> Oedipus Complex, but <em>my mother's.</em>
<em></em>

Sorry, but I don't see how *your* dream can be about someone else's complex.... ...though I suppose it could be about your experience of her behavior, as related to a complex she may have had.

 

[mudpie]

My first thought was like Rinda's...

But it seems as though you ARE seeking emotional justice. and perhaps you did experience your mother as someone who inappropriately sexualized you. You are arguing with her heatedly, that is the struggle for the justice. The toe stands up like a penis, but then becomes a stiletto heel (my image of that is of a seductive woman, maybe a prostitute) You want her to take responsibility, and in the dream, she does.

I would say it is rather difficult for a boy to work thru his oedipus complex if his mother is not emotionally healthy enough for him to do this successfully. (47.2 ...you have been oppressed by a sustenance which was supposed to be nurturing but instead was too much of the wrong kind) hence the anger in the dream. And I think your advisor is correct about 45. you are getting your stuff together, becoming an individual

 

[laylab]

I would advice moving away from the Freudian, Free Association and rely on Jungian theory for this one!

 

[daithi]

Hi Petrosianii,
I was searching the threads for #47.2 to #45 and found your post from Oct '07. I'm new here and wonder if this is too old to comment on or whether it's worth reviving as I had a very interesting response from the Yi and can relate strongly to your situation.
dhahi