Antidepressants? 34.3>54 TWICE

[Serafena]

I asked the iching "what happens if I take antidepressants?"
I am conflicted about taking antidepressants, part of me thinks that I am strong enough to make the changes I need to make in order to have better mental health (meditation, physical activity, diet) and that I am making a big compromise to take pills. The other part of me feels I need help.
the first hexagram 34, Great Power, sounds promising. But the relating hexagram, the marrying maiden - well, I always interpret this as a negative hexagram, one of settling for less than one ought to....thoughts?

okay...I just asked "what happens if I don't take antidepressants?"....threw the coins got 34.3 to 54, the exact same thing...so, is this just about me taking control of my life? spooky to get the same thing two times in a row

 

[mandarin_23]

Hi EllyKaye, "Do and don't" questions ... a very special chapter in my experience with the Yi.

'Small people use power, Noble one uses a net.
Constancy: danger.The ram butts a hedge,
Entangles his horns.'

Basically, with medical questions, it will also always be good to take medical advice. Apart from that, the Yi gives quite a clear answer here on your question:

that I am strong enough to make the changes I need to make in order to have better mental health (meditation, physical activity, diet)

You are strong, with a 34 as an answer, you are very strong indeed, however, there should not be such a straightforward approach doing meditation, physical activity, diet - that's a lot, and a bit too purposeful, too pushy. Of course, all fine with sports and diet and meditation, this is all useful - but - mental health is more might be more like a tender state of balance. The relating hexagram 54 gives a hint to this, I think, and also to the need to come back to inner joy - as the hexagram dui, which represents joy, is the lower hexagram in 54.

Without some joy, if you just "go for it" all day long with sports and diets and discipline and so on, you won't improve your mental state that much.

So the Yi advises here to "use a net". If it will be antidepressants - or whatever else a net can be - hm. Don't push too hard, that's all I'd understand.

All the best, health and happiness to you,
Mandarine_23

 

[Lavalamp]

"What happens if I take antidepressants?"
"What happens if I do not take antidepressants?"
34.3>54

34.3 -
Legge: The third line, dynamic, shows, in the case of an inferior man, one
using all his strength; and in the case of a superior man, one whose rule is not to do so. Even with firm correctness the position would be perilous. The exercise of strength in it might be compared to the case of a ram butting against a fence, and getting his horns entangled.

Interesting, The line explains about doing, and not doing.
And you got the same answer twice because you asked first about doing, and second time about not doing.
The Yi had already answered your second question in the first question's answer I think.

Legge: Line three is dynamic, and in his proper place at the top of the trigram of Strength. An inferior man so placed will use all of his strength to the utmost. Not so the superior man. For him the position is beyond the safe middle, and he will be cautious not to injure himself like the ram by exerting all of his strength.

The reading indicates you can try to power through, use all your strength, or you can try to find a balance in the middle which is a better way. So how does this relate to antidepresssants?
Well in Chinese medicine tonic herbs are considered to be a fifth food group, "superfoods."
Without tonic herbs you will not have inner balance and they believe you will become ill. And some tonic herbs are in fact anti-depressants. It's all about what your body needs for balance.

So I think you might try tonic herbs, for a middle way, a healthy balance that does not have you pushing yourself to exhaustion to fight your depression - like a goat stuck in a fence.
In Germany St. John's Wort, a natural antidepressant herb is the first thing they try before prescription meds. Not expensive, over the counter in the herbal section of the store, a 300 mg capsule 3 times a day is typical as per the labeling.
You can discuss this with your doctor, most of them know about St. John's Wort. Good luck.

- LL

 

[diamanda]

What happens if I take antidepressants? 34.3 > 54
What happens if I do not take antidepressants? 34.3 > 54
34 is good health. Here this has changed, and 54 shows something secondary. I believe that the real problem is not depression, depression is just a symptom of something else. Taking antidepressants will not make any difference. The real problem is either your partner is making you sad by cheating on you, or you have another secondary illness/condition which also affects your chemical mood/balance.

 

[Lavalamp]

I believe that the real problem is not depression, depression is just a symptom of something else. Taking antidepressants will not make any difference.

Diamanda don't know what you are thinking, but symptoms damage and can even kill people, that is why doctors treat symptoms. It's called a therapy. With asthma the symptom of inflammation can scar and damage your lungs, with COVID19 symptoms kill people.
The Chinese consider tonic herbs an absolutely necessity for good health, they include herbs from around the world, and one of the qualities of such a "superior herb" is that it MUST be believed to affect your mood and psyche, for the sake of your spiritual and emotional well being and happiness.

There is certainly nothing weak or morally wrong about treating your crappy mood with a tonic herb as a therapy. It isn't going to solve your thyroid having crashed, or your woman having done left you, but it might keep you from kicking your dog.

The Superior Herbalism

Dragon Herbs is a provider of health promoting herbs and complimentary services, including education and educational materials.

www.dragonherbs.com

Quote > "Only herbs that meet specific qualifications are considered “tonic” in nature. For an herb to be recognized as a tonic (a Superior Herb), it must have been found over many centuries to have profound general health-promoting actions that result in a long and healthy life.
Secondly, the tonics must have no negative side-effects when used reasonably, so they may be taken continuously over a long period of time if desired, yielding cumulative, long-term benefits. This emphasis on safety is in accordance with the first law of Chinese herbalism — “Do no harm.”
Thirdly, a tonic must be believed to affect the psyche so as to help improve one’s state of spiritual and emotional wellbeing and happiness." <

- LL

 

[diamanda]

My comment was referring directly to these specific readings. I was not referring to treating symptoms in general.

 

[rosada]

34. 3 Seems to say you don't need to try to do it all yourself but then

54. The Marrying Maiden
Undertakings bring misfortune.
Nothing that would further.

seems to say if f you unquestioningly go along with your doctor's advice that wont be helpful either.

Perhaps the message here is to consider taking meds but to ask questions and know what results to expect so you can judge for yourself if they sound like they are right for you, don't just take the doc's recommendation.

 

[Trojina]

I asked the iching "what happens if I take antidepressants?"
I am conflicted about taking antidepressants, part of me thinks that I am strong enough to make the changes I need to make in order to have better mental health (meditation, physical activity, diet) and that I am making a big compromise to take pills. The other part of me feels I need help.
the first hexagram 34, Great Power, sounds promising. But the relating hexagram, the marrying maiden - well, I always interpret this as a negative hexagram, one of settling for less than one ought to....thoughts?

okay...I just asked "what happens if I don't take antidepressants?"....threw the coins got 34.3 to 54, the exact same thing...so, is this just about me taking control of my life? spooky to get the same thing two times in a row

Isn't the mistake the idea that taking the medication is a 'big compromise' ? It isn't. You can just try them to see how you get on and then stop them if it doesn't work for you. Fortunately these days such medications run far less risk of addiction and besides you would taper off gradually if you stopped to avoid any withdrawal side effects.

However as you got 34.3 >54 for both questions I'd imagine Yi is pointing to a particular area of your life where you are hurting yourself by being too forceful about doing something or getting something. I mean the line does say the ram gets entangled by charging again and again at the obstacle.


So think about it. What is it in your life that you are insisting will work even though it doesn't actually work ? Is it your job or your studies ? Is it to do with where you live or your relationships ? Yi is seriously telling you to stop butting your head against a brick wall with this and you may find you don't need antidepressants because you aren't depressed you are hurting yourself by struggling too hard against or for something that's not available to you this way. I feel the 54 is you having to accept a current reality is not as you like it and there's not much you can do about it. That's frustrating but stop fighting it, just chill out a bit, take the pressure off and then maybe a solution will present itself.


Meantime if you feel very low there really is no big compromise in using the medication for a period. It's not like once you start you have to go on forever. Many people use antidepressants for a while and then stop, it's not such a big deal. What is a big deal is how you are hurting yourself in your life in some way by being too persistent.

Edited to add maybe the 34.3 is about the pressure you put on yourself about the decision to take the pills or not. It doesn't matter, it's not a big compromise, it's not like they will make you a different person. For the first few days you may notice you are more sleepy or something but that will wear off if you want to continue but it isn't a big lifestyle change and I'm not sure why you'd see it as a compromise, not unless you think being mentally well is a virtue or an achievement or something. Maybe you feel you should be able to help yourself by diet and exercise and all that and sadly there is this whole almost moral religion of health around as if it were a virtue rather than a temporary gift of God/nature to be well. If you feel you will fail by taking the pills that might be the 34.3, your attitude you should be able to do it all by yourself.

 

[Gmulii]

I asked the iching "what happens if I take antidepressants?"
I am conflicted about taking antidepressants, part of me thinks that I am strong enough to make the changes I need to make in order to have better mental health (meditation, physical activity, diet) and that I am making a big compromise to take pills. The other part of me feels I need help.
the first hexagram 34, Great Power, sounds promising. But the relating hexagram, the marrying maiden - well, I always interpret this as a negative hexagram, one of settling for less than one ought to....thoughts?

okay...I just asked "what happens if I don't take antidepressants?"....threw the coins got 34.3 to 54, the exact same thing...so, is this just about me taking control of my life? spooky to get the same thing two times in a row

Well... If you are getting the same result when asking if you take them and when asking if you don't, then it doesn't seem much will change either way, does it? : )

Yet on question like this its unusual to have the result not matter...
Are you asking in some way that will limit it to one changing line, or something like that(throwing 6 coins at once or something)?

 

[Lavalamp]

Well... If you are getting the same result when asking if you take them and when asking if you don't, then it doesn't seem much will change either way, does it? : )

Gmulii, it's NOT that it makes no difference, read the line.
The reason she got the same answer for "if I do take" and "If I don't take"
is because the line 34.3 itself answers both questions, "if you do take" or"if you don't take."
It answered both questions in one line. So she got the line twice.

- LL

 

[Trojina]

Gmulii, it's NOT that it makes no difference, read the line.
The reason she got the same answer for "if I do take" and "If I don't take"
is because the line 34.3 itself answers both questions, "if you do take" or"if you don't take."
It answered both questions in one line. So she got the line twice.

He knows she got the line twice that's why he's saying it doesn't matter either way which is a valid take on it, as valid as yours in fact more valid than yours as you come out with this

The reading indicates you can try to power through, use all your strength, or you can try to find a balance in the middle which is a better way. So how does this relate to antidepresssants?
Well in Chinese medicine tonic herbs are considered to be a fifth food group, "superfoods."
Without tonic herbs you will not have inner balance and they believe you will become ill. And some tonic herbs are in fact anti-depressants. It's all about what your body needs for balance.

So I think you might try tonic herbs, for a middle way, a healthy balance that does not have you pushing yourself to exhaustion to fight your depression - like a goat stuck in a fence.
In Germany St. John's Wort, a natural antidepressant herb is the first thing they try before prescription meds. Not expensive, over the counter in the herbal section of the store, a 300 mg capsule 3 times a day is typical as per the labeling.
You can discuss this with your doctor, most of them know about St. John's Wort. Good luck.

She's asking whether to take pills or not and you start shoving your pet health theories at her yet you have the gall to tell someone else their take on it is wrong ?


What you could do to understand is that a person's interpretation of an answer is just their interpretation of an answer Not THE interpretation which you seem to think yours is.

 

[Gmulii]

Gmulii, it's NOT that it makes no difference, read the line.
The reason she got the same answer for "if I do take" and "If I don't take"
is because the line 34.3 itself answers both questions, "if you do take" or"if you don't take."
It answered both questions in one line. So she got the line twice.

- LL

Thats not how it works in my experience.
If someone gets something like this I would either expect a problem in the process of asking(like having underlying question that is so strong that it influences anything else they asked about) or a problem in creating the hexagram.

As the same hexagram with same changing line on same day can't point out to 2 opposite outcomes unless the answer is irrelevant(same result anyway) and in this case that doesn't seem likely.

 

[Trojina]

It's not that uncommon to get the same answer two or three times to different questions. It can indicate all the issues have a common basis the querent needs to address. It can also mean it makes no difference what they do in regard to the question they posed, there's something else going on that affects the decision.
And sometimes it remains a mystery or indicates something else I haven't thought of.


For myself it generally indicates the questions I'm posing are the surface of the pond, go a bit deeper and there's a connection I'm not spotting.

Fretting about using medication because one thinks one 'ought' to be stronger can be quite a 34.3 attitude. One doesn't have to charge forward with no return, one can try the medication and stop it if needs be. 34.3 can well be insistence there's the one 'right' way to follow and everything else is weakness or compromise. Line 3 tells you don't have that mindset, slacken off the reins. Here it could well be also that the 34.3 refers to a situation in the person's life she's going too full on with.

 

[Trojina]

Also bear in mind many mental health issues such as depression are fed into by a very harsh self evaluation system such as 'if I take anti depressants I am a failure I should be able to deal with this through meditation and exercise'. That's a 34.3 thing, harsh self evaluation. Of course in serious depression a person may barely be able to meditate or exercise and needs the medication to be well enough to do either.

 

[Gmulii]

It's not that uncommon to get the same answer two or three times to different questions. It can indicate all the issues have a common basis the querent needs to address. It can also mean it makes no difference what they do in regard to the question they posed, there's something else going on that affects the decision.

I agree, yet I've seen cases when the way the casting is made can lead to that as well, even when there is a problem. Suggests the cycles were intersected, we can't follow where it leads from that.

For health related question, if I get that hexagram and line on that day, I would read it as "the person is fine anyway, so very little of these matters".

So it makes it a curious situation, is the reading related to the idea that the person will be fine no matter if they take medication or something in the way the hexagram is made or the place they ask from is messing up the result...

 

[Lavalamp]

Ya'll are pretty far from the actual text.
"If I take antidepressants?" "If I don't?"

34.3 - The answer to both questions given by the Yi.
Legge: The third line, dynamic, shows, in the case of (A) an inferior man, one
(A) using all his strength; and in the case of a (B) superior man, one whose rule is (B) not to do so. Even with firm correctness the position would be perilous. The exercise of strength in it might be compared to the case of a ram butting against a fence, and getting his horns entangled.

Two questions here: 1. Is it is (A) the inferior man taking antidepressants or (B) the superior man, and 2. What is "the Middle" in this scenario the subject who could take either path is past?
The Yi says exercising all your strength when you are past the middle is perilous, you just struggle like a ram caught in a hedge. I read the middle to mean health which is balance and no excess.

She's asking whether to take pills or not and you start shoving your pet health theories at her yet you have the gall to tell someone else their take on it is wrong ?

Trojina, Traditional Chinese Medicine is not my " pet health theory" rather they are holistic concepts as old as the Yi. I do realize many Western people are uninformed when it comes to Traditional Chinese Medical practices like acupuncture and tonic herbs, which is why I provided a reference. The cultural context of the iChing is Chinese, and if you don't understand the context you can't read the Yi well, for example in the "5 Skills Rat" line you have to know what that means to the Chinese.
I know herbalists and acupuncturists, my martial arts teacher was a health practitioner and I've known several, I'm into this stuff. I have been studying the Yi since I was 13 years old, my youngest takes Tai Chi as a fighting Art from a noted Master. His Sifu was surprised he already had been taught so much about the Yi, they all frequent a Chinese Tea shop.

In Traditional Chinese Medicine they believe tonic herbs are simply food like rice and vegetables, a "fifth food group." And in order to meet the definition of a "Superior Herb" an herb must be long proven to do no harm, and it must improve your mood and affect your psyche positively.
All tonic herbs are mood altering - antidepressants to some degree in some cases - and they believe without them you cannot maintain a healthy balance.
And they are certainly a far better alternative than Big Pharma prescription drugs that have no centuries old track record and have many dangerous side effects.

- LL

 

[Gmulii]

Ya'll are pretty far from the actual text.
"If I take antidepressants?" "If I don't?"

34.3 - The answer to both questions given by the Yi.
Legge: The third line, dynamic, shows, in the case of (A) an inferior man, one
(A) using all his strength; and in the case of a (B) superior man, one whose rule is (B) not to do so. Even with firm correctness the position would be perilous. The exercise of strength in it might be compared to the case of a ram butting against a fence, and getting his horns entangled.

Two questions here: 1. Is it is (A) the inferior man taking antidepressants or (B) the superior man, and 2. What is "the Middle" in this scenario the subject who could take either path is past?
The Yi says exercising all your strength when you are past the middle is perilous, you just struggle like a ram caught in a hedge. I read the middle to mean health which is balance and no excess.



Trojina, Traditional Chinese Medicine is not my " pet health theory" rather they are holistic concepts as old as the Yi. I do realize many Western people are uninformed when it comes to Traditional Chinese Medical practices like acupuncture and tonic herbs, which is why I provided a reference. The cultural context of the iChing is Chinese, and if you don't understand the context you can't read the Yi well, for example in the "5 Skills Rat" line you have to know what that means to the Chinese.
I know herbalists and acupuncturists, my martial arts teacher was a health practitioner and I've known several, I'm into this stuff. I have been studying the Yi since I was 13 years old, my youngest takes Tai Chi as a fighting Art from a noted Master. His Sifu was surprised he already had been taught so much about the Yi, they all frequent a Chinese Tea shop.

In Traditional Chinese Medicine they believe tonic herbs are simply food like rice and vegetables, a "fifth food group." And in order to meet the definition of a "Superior Herb" an herb must be long proven to do no harm, and it must improve your mood and affect your psyche positively.
All tonic herbs are mood altering - antidepressants to some degree - and they believe without them you cannot maintain a healthy balance.
And they are certainly a far better alternative than Big Pharma prescription drugs that have no centuries old track record and have many dangerous side effects.

- LL

I very rarely use the text, even more rarely use it for health questions and even more rarely use it translated by Legge. : )

 

[Lavalamp]

I very rarely use the text, even more rarely use it for health questions and even more rarely use it translated by Legge. : )

I use six or seven translations of the judgment, image, lines and commentaries side by side.
I don't think you can really claim to be an intepreter of the Yi if you aren't reading anything it says.

- LL

 

[Gmulii]

I use six or seven translations of the judgment, image, lines and commentaries side by side.
I don't think you can really claim to be an intepreter of the Yi if you aren't reading anything it says.

- LL

If you have studied Yi Jing for long enough, will eventually figure out that in China and most of the east, people that do this professionally very rarely use the text. Almost all good practitionersI know in the East view it as a waste of time to consult the text in a reading, as the info it can provide is way too general and not flexible enough to fit to any situation we ask about. And by "good" I mean capable of getting accuracy in details that I would guess you wouldn't even think is possible.
I don't agree with that idea, that the text is not useful at all, one of the reason I'm here, yet is a very strong point of view in many of the schools and even individual practitioners there(at least most of the good ones worth looking at).

There are many systems that are used to study ways of reading hexagrams or other types of Qi Maps and while the text is the most known one in the west it isn't even close to being the most used one in the east.

Systems like Da Liu Ren大六壬 , Qi Men Dun Jia奇門遁甲 for example, doesn't use creation of Hexagrams at all, we study ways of divination that can be done only looking at someones house build date and directions in 玄空飛星 or 玄空大卦 and the accuracy that can be reached by someone that has been practicing that for some time with good enough school, master or sources can be staggering at times.

And this is just scratching the surface, as the actual reading of Hexagrams can also be accomplished in many other ways and while I'm usually using 六爻 there are many, many other ways to do it as well and very few of them involve any type of premade text.

That doesn't mean translations and text with the lines aren't valid, of course, they are still used even in China, it just means that if you think that:

I don't think you can really claim to be an intepreter of the Yi if you aren't reading anything it says

You seem to think that studing the text of the zhouyi with the wings is the only way to study the changes. And what the text "says" is what the changes are. And that is a very sad misunderstanding .

If we look at other systems of the Five Arts, we can see similar texts coming with lines, or stars or other parts of the systems and there are hundreds of them . While most of them aren't as old as the zhouyi some are very old.

Zhouyi and the wings got popular in the west because this is how the events turned out, even today if you look at eastern divination forum, you will have hundreds more posts in the parts where people are using 六爻, then the part using the zhouyi.

So text with premade interpretations for many of the systems do exists, some are made almost entirely of that like the very popular in Asia 鐵板神數 holding 13 thousand lines for every number that can come from stems and branches in the 4 pillars.
Yet if you go into it it starts to seem that even this 13 thousand lines are actually selected, trimmed and shaped by the knowledge of the master of the rules of the systems behind it.

In short - the text with the lines is interesting, but if you studied Yi Jing from 13 year old and you aren't even aware the premade text is more or less nothing from the actual study of Yi and the Five Arts, even more so if you aren't even aware what the Five Arts are, then there is something missing and that is much more important problem then my use of the zhouyi or the wings or any combination of them. : )

 

[Lavalamp]

So you are here to study the text. But then again there are so many other ways to read, so why bother when you are reading for someone about a serious issue?
Ok what does the line 34.3 mean? You don't need text, you do not need a translation, you know better than Legge - fine, what does the line mean?
Please explain your methadology of reading and how you are arriving at your interpetation,
and reveal what 34.3 means.
And how this applies to the two questions. Please.
If you are offering advice to people in a Yi forum, and use a nonstandard methodology, you really should explain what it is upfront.

- LL

 

[Gmulii]

Please explain your methadology of reading and how you are arriving at your interpetation,
and reveal what 34.3 means.
And how this applies to the two questions. Please.

If you are offering advice to people in a Yi forum, and use a nonstandard methodology, you really should explain what it is upfront.

- LL

I haven't offered any advice yet, nor am I planning to.
And in the forums I do offer advice I do explain in as much detail as the people asking need. : )
As I avoid using other styles here as practice shows members can get confused.
Yet the other reason is that we are reading examples with other styles everyday in other forums using 六爻 and other similar systems, so it seems good that here is more focused on the text.

Since you are learning Yi for so long and it seems you haven't even heard of 六爻 will make an exception here.

First thing we need to know is the date of asking, as the person posting said they "I just asked " means hexagram was made at the same day and likely same branch hour as the post.

The Self line(holding the person asking) is very strong in the day of Wood(as Wood produces Fire). Its also very strong in the Fire season when the question is asked.
Suggests any problems with health won't be fatal and its likely they may not be very troublesome as well(the "not troublesome" aspect could change because of the clash, in some situations, however, more on that below).

The line of what they are asking about is Zi Water Rat holding asset and flying spirit. Its clashed by the month.
What asset suggests is it could be with a material posesion, yet on this specific line its much more likely its related to food or to blood(more likely both).
That happens because the line of the person asking is clashing the line of the "Others" showing the outcome or advice and because Zi attacks Wu , as water attacks fire.

For health we would look at Officer line and the line attacking the self line.
Officer is the second line of Yin Tirger Wood. That line is strong in the day and month, but it isn't moving, suggesting whatever problems there may be(liver, gallbladder and eyes) aren't active now, there have been there for a while and doesn't seem to be moving or disappearing now or anytime soon. And they are also potentially stronger because of a food the person eats or the problem with blood(the Water producing Wood).

The line attacking the self line in this case is the Others line(as water attacks fire) and that line as we mention seems to be related to food and digestion and / or blood and the effect that has on the persons head(Qian trigrma showing head, eradic thoughts etc, Curved Array showing digestion and Asset showing food). That may explain much of what is going on and could suggest that wherever the activity connected to Zi continues the problem will stay there no matter if the person takes the medicine they ask about.

So if someone asked in another forum that is more related to 六爻 I would ask about the food the person eats or if there are problems with blood(as both Zi and Asset can show blood as well).
Yet in there we would also have the 4 pillars of the person, so we will know a lot before even start the reading.

In both cases the line of the medicine(that is the monkey shen metal line at 5) is in void, suggesting at least for the present time(until tomorrow actually), the remedy won't matter anyway.

Summary of the reading.
The person doesn't seem to have big enough problem in both cases if the reading was done right, that aren't connected to the Zi water and that I already covered.
Yet since it shows in both cases worth asking if the way they made the hexagram was accurate, as there are some indications that may no be the case(long to go into, but some stuff shows up when hexagram isn't made right, we mentioned some in higher posts).


Summary of the post - there are many ways to read a hexagram. And there are many ways to make a divination without even reading a hexagram, some of them are also thought in Yi Jing universities in China, yet even though they use Trigrams and they are making very complex maps of battlefields instead of a hexagram they are making it basing on stuff that most western people studying Yi Jing haven't even heard of in my experience.

 

[Lavalamp]

I have seen this method.
But you *did* offer advice.
You said if you get the same line for both questions it mean it doesn't matter which you do.
You did not say I use this other method and I think you don't need them.

- LL

 

[Gmulii]

Well... If you are getting the same result when asking if you take them and when asking if you don't, then it doesn't seem much will change either way, does it? : )

Yet on question like this its unusual to have the result not matter...
Are you asking in some way that will limit it to one changing line, or something like that(throwing 6 coins at once or something)?

It seems to me what I said was that I think its unlikely the hexagram was made to reflect the situation correctly?
Can read the following posts to see that in some detail.

And I could show how I arrived at that conclusion as well, but it seems a waste of time. : )

 

[Lavalamp]

The way you just quoted makes it look like I said something you said, and I did not. Could you fix that please?

-LL

 

[Trojina]

Trojina, Traditional Chinese Medicine is not my " pet health theory" rather they are holistic concepts as old as the Yi. I do realize many Western people are uninformed when it comes to Traditional Chinese Medical practices like acupuncture and tonic herbs, which is why I provided a reference

But why go on about it when it's not relevant to the question asked ! The question was about whether to take antidepressant pills or not, nothing to do with TCM. The last several posts on discussion of methods etc don't even belong here but in Exploring Divination on a separate thread.

Ya'll are pretty far from the actual text.
"If I take antidepressants?" "If I don't?"

Which I take to mean you think you are right and everyone else is wrong.

I think you've gone off topic. Gmulli has a link in his signature to explain his method - why should he do it here


Also it is a perfectly valid point of view to say the same answer to two different questions, as happened here, could indicate it really makes no difference, this isn't what it all hinges on. If you can't understand that that's your limitation

 

[Lavalamp]

But why go on about it when it's not relevant to the question asked ! The question was about whether to take antidepressant pills or not, nothing to do with TCM. The last several posts on discussion of methods etc don't even belong here but in Exploring Divination on a separate thread.

The Yi's answer was it is wise not to just struggle, the superior man does not do that when he is past the middle/in bad health.
That is a yes, take something for your depression. You are past the middle.
But if you are not eating and that is causing the imbalance of bad health, then you need to eat something.
In China tonic herbs are considered plain old food necessary for health - being in the middle - which improve mood and emotional well being.
I also said the querent could speak to their doctor, which none of you suggested, on a medical, mental health question.
It is quite possible ElleKaye actually needs something a lot stronger than tonic herbs to find her middle. You have no way of knowing, and being argumentative when a person's life could literally be at stake is not being a thoughtful, responsible reader.

- LL

 

[Gmulii]

I think we should either move on or make a topic about the amazing readings, tonics and suggestions of Querent777 and continue there.
But I think its better for everyone if we move on instead.I'm sure we will read more about the tonics and suggestions in the near future anyway.

 

[Lavalamp]

I think we should either move on or make a topic about the amazing readings, tonics and suggestions of Querent777 and continue there.

You have yet to fix misquoting me in a previous post. Could you please not put words in my mouth I did not say, and fix the misquote? They were not my words. Thank you.
And I read pretty traditionally.

- LL

 

[Gmulii]

You have yet to fix misquoting me in a previous post. Could you please not put words in my mouth I did not say, and fix the misquote? They were not my words. Thank you.
And I read pretty traditionally.

- LL

Ctrl+F5 to refresh the browsers cache, scroll up and enjoy! : )

 

[Lavalamp]

I did not refresh my brower cache, having run my maintanance program recently it doesn't need it.
But thank you for correcting the quote.

- LL