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Found a useful tool for determining time( unless it is explictly expressed)

Topher

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I was looking for a correct time for 63.2 since it talks about waiting... turns out at the time of the casting I got 63.2 and it told me the time ended in 3days from the reading(monday) and on Monday I found that it was the right time (I found said person because well ,timing?)

now I wonder does every hexagram defines timing? we should use this method instead?
 

Gmulii

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That countdown is until the end of "void". Void is one of the symbolic stars, however its different then other symbolic stars as its made in very different way. Most of the other symbolic stars are relation of branches or stems(as there are many in bazi too). Void is made in different way more directly related to how the calendar is counted. We can see it in almost all systems of chinese metaphysics with few exceptions.

In questions where an important line is in void, we do use it as timing, that is why the countdown shows there, as it is often used. But it depends on other factors, as in many questions there may not be a line in void, in that case there are other ways to tell time(complex to go into details on that also it needs different way of viewing the second hexagram to understand that then what is usually approached around here).

AK has video about void here:

The sad idea here is that I would guess for that specific question it just happened that void was position on important enough line that you could tell timing by the end of it. In general, it won't work every time only when something important to the event is what is in void and even then not every time.

Example: Trouble in relationship - boyfriend line in void. Girlfriend will be unable to get in contact with him in almost all cases that happens. And we can guess that when boyfriend line is out of void they will be able to connect. We have dozens example with that through the years in the Chinese Metaphysics forums... Yet there are many other factors, only thing we could guess is that when void ends they will get in contact with each other, but if the question is about the whole relationship as it usually is, the timing of when they get in contact matters very little... As the relationship may still fall apart, because of the way they relate to each other and/or other factors.

Then it will show timing again, but not of anything that you would actually want to know.

Short answer - this is a tool that comes together with many other tools. If we use it alone we may attune to it with time and figure out what kind of "lack" from something in the situation actually gets fill with time, then it will work for prediction in some cases. But it won't work for any type of question or hexagram, from experience i would say 15-20% at most.
 

dfreed

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I was looking for a correct time for 63.2 ...
Correct time for what?

What you are looking at is a Wen Wang Gua calculator, which is used in systems of what we might think of as fortune-telling, or horoscopes, or astrology .... These are all related to, or make use of the I Ching, but they are different than just casting to get a response to a query.

I don't think that this generates particular times or time frames for each of the 4,096 possible combinations of Yi responses (someone here can perhaps confirm that). And I know that for at least some of these systems, like Heluo Lishu (sometimes mislabeled as 'I Ching Astrology'), it applies to a person - and not necessarily to a particular question or query - and you need additional info, like the time and place of their birth.

(With Heluo Lishu you can generate hexagrams for a particular day, month or year of a person's life, but it is still based on the 'bazi' or life hexagrams for that person - and on the specific time and place of their birth; it is not 'just casting a question' - as most of this site is dedicated to.)

Also, I'm not sure why you'd want or need to know this? I think the Yi responds to our situations, and I assume it gives us a sense of time or timing in its response - if that's important for us to know. You might be onto something here, but it feels like you're trying to mate aardvarks with hamburgers (or moon beams), and the resultant offspring are not at all pretty - or useful!
 
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dfreed

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I got 63.2 and it told me the time ended in 3days from the reading (monday) and on Monday I found that it was the right time
My sense is that the time periods and time frames in the Yi's are meant to be general: about three days or about ten days, or three days before and three days after .... If you want to make them specific, that's up to you.

However, I don't see how a Wen Wang Gua (WWG) calculator would help in this regard, or how you'd even apply it, because I think WWG based on the current time and date (or on someone's birth time and date), which then generates a hexagram or hexagrams, but it doesn't work the opposite way (input a hexagram and get a date), and I don't see at all where it generates a time period for a specific hexagram and/or line.
 
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legume

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i use pocossin's calendar from this thread (then the month number for me corresponds with current year and duration of lunar month). it's not the most precise tool but seem to work well for a particular timeframe (e.g. between may 12th - june 9th). i believe wen wang gua can be very precise, it's just too much for my current level of understanding.
 

Topher

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That countdown is until the end of "void". Void is one of the symbolic stars, however its different then other symbolic stars as its made in very different way. Most of the other symbolic stars are relation of branches or stems(as there are many in bazi too). Void is made in different way more directly related to how the calendar is counted. We can see it in almost all systems of chinese metaphysics with few exceptions.

In questions where an important line is in void, we do use it as timing, that is why the countdown shows there, as it is often used. But it depends on other factors, as in many questions there may not be a line in void, in that case there are other ways to tell time(complex to go into details on that also it needs different way of viewing the second hexagram to understand that then what is usually approached around here).

AK has video about void here:

The sad idea here is that I would guess for that specific question it just happened that void was position on important enough line that you could tell timing by the end of it. In general, it won't work every time only when something important to the event is what is in void and even then not every time.

Example: Trouble in relationship - boyfriend line in void. Girlfriend will be unable to get in contact with him in almost all cases that happens. And we can guess that when boyfriend line is out of void they will be able to connect. We have dozens example with that through the years in the Chinese Metaphysics forums... Yet there are many other factors, only thing we could guess is that when void ends they will get in contact with each other, but if the question is about the whole relationship as it usually is, the timing of when they get in contact matters very little... As the relationship may still fall apart, because of the way they relate to each other and/or other factors.

Then it will show timing again, but not of anything that you would actually want to know.

Short answer - this is a tool that comes together with many other tools. If we use it alone we may attune to it with time and figure out what kind of "lack" from something in the situation actually gets fill with time, then it will work for prediction in some cases. But it won't work for any type of question or hexagram, from experience i would say 15-20% at most.
Well for specific lines I would like to see what would be the correct wiring time because I received 63.1.2 iirc and talked about 3days(used 63) and I have found that the vois for 63 was pretty acurate, if there was a way to make the calculations as per line i would be far more useful but 63 is almost completed pretty much the timeframe matched now I wonder if i would work other times there are certain hexagrams that talk about a certain season so this method isnt relevant in such hexagrams I receives one hexagram that acted in winter solstice and the I asked few days from winter solstice

I wonder are there other star that one could use as reference?

Do you mind if I send you a PM?
 
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Topher

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My sense is that the time periods and time frames in the Yi's are meant to be general: about three days or about ten days, or three days before and three days after .... If you want to make them specific, that's up to you.

However, I don't see how a Wen Wang Gua (WWG) calculator would help in this regard, or how you'd even apply it, because I think WWG based on the current time and date (or on someone's birth time and date), which then generates a hexagram or hexagrams, but it doesn't work the opposite way (input a hexagram and get a date), and I don't see at all where it generates a time period for a specific hexagram and/or line.
How I see it the casted hexagram would end up at x days turns out that 63.2 talks about seven days but the void ended at 3-4days and I mean probably I had wrong timing, either way I fins useful that a tool could predict timing inside iching because it is very limiting when you iching when to do x and the hexagram has a stablished number 7days for some
 

Gmulii

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Well for specific lines I would like to see what would be the correct wiring time because I received 63.1.2 iirc and talked about 3days(used 63) and I have found that the vois for 63 was pretty acurate, if there was a way to make the calculations as per line i would be far more useful but 63 is almost completed pretty much the timeframe matched now I wonder if i would work other times there are certain hexagrams that talk about a certain season so this method isnt relevant in such hexagrams I receives one hexagram that acted in winter solstice and the I asked few days from winter solstice

I wonder are there other star that one could use as reference?

Do you mind if I send you a PM?

Its ok, of course, feel free to send.
Timing is not as complex as people usually think in WWG, seasonal hexagram also work, yea. I can post some really nice questions and cases we had in the open forums some time ago where we can see different principles of how to tell time with WWG, its not difficult just needs getting used to. : )

Edit: I'm not entirely sure we have PM here, I think there are profile messages or something, but they are open I think. My mail is on the site and on all the apps, in any case.
 
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dfreed

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probably I had wrong timing, either way I fins useful that a tool could predict timing inside iching
I still don't get what your saying or doing here. WWG doesn't give you specific time periods for the 4,096 different lines of the Yi. So, I'm not sure what it is you're finding useful. But so be it.
 

Topher

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I still don't get what your saying or doing here. WWG doesn't give you specific time periods for the 4,096 different lines of the Yi. So, I'm not sure what it is you're finding useful. But so be it.
not the lines but the hexagram itself
 

dfreed

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not the lines but the hexagram itself
I understand that WWG generates a hexagram based on a particular date, time and location - it doesn’t give you lengths of time (e.g. 3 days, 7 days, etc. ) — and specific lengths of time is what you are asking about.

(And you only find a few of these in the Yi, in both hexagram and lines, ex. 57.5: ‘before reforming, three days / after reforming, three days’ — and that’s why I mentioned lines, and you did too.)

It feels to me the you’re mixing two entirely different ideas and ways of working with the Yi that I don’t think fit together, and this is confusing to me; but if you’re finding something useful here, so be it.
 
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hilary

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I'm not entirely sure we have PM here, I think there are profile messages or something, but they are open I think. My mail is on the site and on all the apps, in any case.
Click on someone's name above their post and you'll see a 'start conversation' link. That's private messaging, just under a different name.
 

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