How do you choose between translations

[twilightshadow]

I personally don't read Chinese so have to rely on others' translations. There are many valid ones out there, but even among those that are considered accurate there are differences, especially in the lines. I was perusing the archives for some help with 7.3, and I found one where someone asked for translations, and there were numerous, but some appeared almost oppisite in meaning. There were several that felt like they could be pertinent to the situation, but I'm not sure how to differentiate.

In this particular case I asked for someone's response, and I will know what they say probably later tonight. I sometimes use questions like this to track Yi's answers so that I learn from specific experiences how to interpret, but I try to stay away from test questions. I only ask things I actually am interested in knowing.

When I read Tarot, though some cards had different meanings, I found the more I used them the more certain cards always had a specific meaning for me. Is Yi like that? For whatever reason, a couple of years ago the Tarot suddenly stopped speaking to me and Yi opened itself. I have only recently begun keeping track of the responses. Many of my earlier ones are still here on Clarity, but Im not sure of the accuracy because I have found that I do not always get a valid response if my mind is agitated, and lets face it, I spent much of my early time here coming unglued.

At the moment, I am just looking for your experiences in sorting through the different meanings given. Sometimes one just jumps out at me as being specific to my question or situation, but in this case, there are several that could work. Id like to know for future reference, how you handle this? Is it just a case of experience and instinct or is there some pattern? Thanks for the help, my relationship with Yi continues to evolve. Of course, sometimes I think it just has a good sense of humor and I am its constant source of entertainment

 

[willowfox]

Read the line, and adjust it to fit the question being asked, as the line will mean different things for each different question asked. You cannot say line X means this and then try to apply that said meaning to all and every question, even tarot card meanings are very flexible in their application and cover a huge spectrum of meanings, they have to, as people are asking questions on just about any subject.
Somethings cannot be boxed up and that goes for all oracles.

 

[fkegan]

HI twilightshadow,

There is a playfulness to the Yi Oracle Spirit that is always a humane element in Yi use. At times when there isn't particularly good news, it can also convey some sense of personal comfort and relationship which can be even more important it such times.

There is a fundamental question whether the meaning of the Yi is conveyed in the words of the commentary or in the symbolic pattern of the lines. When the words are in a language foreign to us, and from a time totally alien to our own the direct application of the words alone can be difficult.

The selection of a specific translation usually is done because one of them seems to speak to you in a meaningful way. Reading Chinese is not the big difference, as debates arise over what the Chinese ideograms mean and then over what is the import of the various phrases and slogans which make up the Yi text.

Even the fundamental question of is this a 'good' omen or a 'calamity' is a matter of perspective. The Wilhelm is a good translation of the mostly Confucian commentary which was used as a source of advice for traditional Chinese Imperial bureaucrats for whom the issue of avoiding personal responsibility and thus possible blame was a central theme. Thus a situation where one would be expressing oneself would take a slogan of 'humiliation' or blame or danger. Yet for folks nowadays, that can also be a situation of opportunity and fulfillment.

The Yi Oracle is describing symbolically how the situation of your question is developing in terms of what can be seen and felt. It is a mirror that rather than reflecting light, reflects situations and their development process in highly abstract line symbolism.

Beyond finding a translation that feels like it speaks to you, the question is learning to become comfortable with the hexagrams and lines themselves as symbolic representations of what is going on with your Oracle.

Frank

 

[twilightshadow]

Thank you both for your responses. Yes, I do try to adjust the meaning to what was asked, just have to be careful not to fit the meaning for what I want instead of what it is actually trying to tell me. The problem I run into is when there is more than one translation that fits the question, but they say different things. Maybe I should analyze some of my past readings to see if perhaps more than one thing is at work, so that more than one translation might be part of the answer. I guess at times we just have to accept that the answer is not clear and either ask a clarifying question or accept that it is something we have to wait and see about.

I like what you said about the playfulness and comfort. I have experienced both. One night I couldnt get hold of a friend I was supposed to be meeting. I got concerned and asked where is he right now and received a line about breaking the wheels. Turned out he was driving at the time and couldnt answer because his cell phone had died. I always wondered if the breaking wheels referred to his being at a stoplight at that precise moment, lol. And it has brought me comfort many times when I received a reading that was not what I had hoped for. I have asked a follow up question and gotten the proverbial pat on the shoulder, things will get better. I personally believe the universe, god, whatever you choose to call it, speaks through Yi, so its like a universal hug.

Your explanation of the Chinese was also very helpful. I knew the commentary was based on ancient Chinese wisdom, but did not know it was specifically for bureaucrats. That explains a lot and I think will help me to weed through comments that maybe no longer apply in our current society or to my individual situation. The idea that what would have been negative to them might be an opportunity for us is interesting, and I wonder if the reverse is also true. Maybe thats why 58, even unchanging, is never a good omen for me. And I will check out the other sites you listed. Always interested in additional translations or ways of looking at the text. Thank you again.

 

[fkegan]

You can best choose a translation for its connection to you in general, not for a specific oracle answer. You explore that by reading the translation without an Oracle to interpret and feeling how it sounds in your mind.

If one does speak to you it would be pretty clear. If it doesn't, then it probably isn't special for you, at least not now.

When you only go to the Yi text when you have an Oracle to interpret, you are putting an extra burden upon the translation and that makes things more difficult.

The Confucian commentaries became one of the Classics used in official examinations for the only job worthy of a proper gentleman, working for the Emperor at some level. There are also Taoist commentaries for those who chose to be unemployed, generally that meant working at anything else other than being an Imperial bureaucrat. Gia-fu Feng's Taoist translation is on my website at the very end of the Taoist I Ching material and its URL is in my signature. The actual text of the Yi is a mix of many commentaries and various slogans such as perseverance furthers or fruitful to have zest, Luck, success, humiliation, etc.

Once you have enough of a relationship with the Oracle spirit that it comforts you when you need it, you can branch out to reading the various translations without a question and see which ones appeal to you.

Good Luck with your exploration of the Yi and its Oracle,
Frank

 

[heylise]

Nice thread! Good question, good answers. :bows: