How do you describe jealousy? 27.4.6 > 51

[marshy]

Hi all,

Just a brief one to share with you this amazingly precise, in my view, description of jealousy that I Ching just gave me... I've always believed that the source of jealousy is a deep need to be loved, rather than any sort of rivalry and here we go... The I Ching seems to have read my thoughts...

Marshy

 

[dobro p]

I'd say jealousy arises out of the ego feeling threatened on the one hand, and possessive on the other. If you didn't feel threatened when you saw your sweetie kissing the other person, you wouldn't feel jealous; if you didn't feel like you had some legitimate claim to the exclusive sexual and romantic expression of your partner, you wouldn't feel jealous when you saw them romantically engaged with another.

But how do you see 27.4.6>51 as echoing your view of jealousy?

 

[Trojina]

But at root jealousy comes from hunger for love and the belief that someone else will get the love instead of oneself. The belief that someone else can take away from you the love you need. I agree with Marshy, i feel if you trace jealousy back to its root you find the need, the hunger for love - hence i guess the 27, when someone is perceived to be taking away your 'food' like the tiger in line 4 you stare around with an 'insatiable' gaze - though really you have it all the time, your own source 27.6

 

[meng]

Cool reading and responses.

There's also a potential upside (wow, is that Freudian or what?), the same threatening fear which arouses jealousy can act to arouse sexual interest in the object of attachment. Lots of 51 in jealousy.

 

[mudpie]

27.4 is a hungry tiger who won't let anything stand between him and his nourishment.
He sees the one at 27.6 to be the source of his nourishment.
Don't get in that tiger's way.
yup, that's jealousy

 

[dobro p]

But at root jealousy comes from hunger for love and the belief that someone else will get the love instead of oneself.

Okay, and out of that hunger for love arise the perceived threat and the possessiveness. But this topic's huge, right?

* Seeing love as something that resides in the other person and which is given to you, like they give you a kiss or some food. Love as commodity. Is that the only way jealous people think of love and relate to it? That being needy and looking to ease that neediness? But that's not really love, right?

* Here's a step beyond that. I understand that you trigger love in me. I understand that when I'm with you, the love rises in me in a way that it doesn't arise in me when I'm on my own. I know that you don't give me anything, I know that your feelings for me don't make me feel this way - I simply know that when I'm with you, love rises in me. Okay, so now you go and make ficky-fick with that guy you work with. And I get jealous, cuz that all-important connection with you is threatened. But is this jealousy of mine the same as the jealousy in the previous example?

* Two people really love each other. They experience something sometimes when they're together that they experience with no other person. Okay, so they also have fully functioning egos and sometimes they disagree and irritate each other and occasionally argue and have to patch up afterwards. But it's all easy because of the very high value they put on what they know is a relationship that produces something very, very special. Okay, so one day one or both of them strays. I mean, things happen, right? And after they've tasted the forbidden fruit, they realize that it's dust in the mouth compared to what they have with each other. So they get back together and the relationship moves up and into a new phase, cuz now they KNOW something about the value of the relationship that they didn't know before. Whew! Can you understand those people who can forgive each other for having affairs with someone else? That's a stretch for me.

 

[Trojina]

Well I think the answer shows as you said jealousy arises where people see love like nourishment/food. Is nourishment a commodity though, I don't know. I do know most people do experience love this way even when they know intellectually this isn't really love. But what love is a huge question. Someone explained to me recently how even the most appalling behavior was really a cry for love and that what isn't really love, or doesn't look like love, like possessive behaviour etc ,is still really a cry for love.

Jealousy is a real taboo emotion I think. People are generally ashamed of their jealousy. I suppose neediness and possessiveness are not attractive qualities. Thats why I liked the Yis answer to this question - its like it doesn't condemn it as egoistic or wrong, just shows it like when we are jealous we are like hungry tigers on the prowl lol.
When real love/food can be known I guess the tiger chills but until then theres the mighty crash of the jealous rage in 51

 

[zander]

On experiencing my own jealousy, it came as such a surprise to me. There were times as a single person when I,seriously, never viewed myself as the jealous type. I always thought that's other peoples problem, not mine. Then I got into a realtionship and WHAM-CRASH--BOOM!!!
Suddenly I become very insecure, possessive, jealous, and yes, not attractive. It was only after realizing how this "thing" can destroy my relationships(shock51)that I had to take a hard look at myself.
27-4/6>51 I can see what Listener said about hunter(line4) and the hunted in the upper line---to be a source of nourishment is dangerous yet auspicious(trans.by Cleary)---I have felt jealousy, in myself, as something forceful that devours, destroys, but also as a wake up call to change. Thanks Marshy, this was definitely food for thought

 

[marshy]

By the time I get a chance to write again and the discussion has advanced so much that there is very little left for me to add...

Trojan, you seem to have read each and every single thought of mine – the starving, chasing its pray animal (line 4), which has entirely given up to its unsatisfied desire (line 6), as a personification of the jealous, hungry for love partner. And then the plenty of shock mentioned by Meng, the ruining of trust and the relationship itself as Zander shared... All these thoughts and images were running through my head while reading the I Ching's answer...

Interestingly though, I asked the question with the intention of checking in a next step if another person was acting the way they were acting towards me out of jealousy. To add a bit more spice to the case, the other person is actually already involved in a romantic relationship with a third person. So, in my view, the I Ching not only reflected my own beliefs on jealousy. It also gave me a pretty clear indication that it was my own jealousy bringing the shock in my life... It made me re-consider my role in this relationship triangle and I eventually withdrew from further pursuing my "pray"

Thank you so much to all of you guys for sharing your insights!