Is my marriage basically over? 18.3 > 4

[tubinluv]

Hello,
I'm new to the community, but I've been learning/reading IChing for the past few years and I'm very glad to have found this forum.

My marriage has been in turmoil for the past year, I consulted IChing and I asked if my marriage is basically over. I received 18.3 > 4. Line 3 (Wilhelm) - Setting right what has been spoiled by the father. There will be a little remorse. No great blame.

My interpretation of this is no, it's not over, but I need to work on our issues. I may have been overly eager to correct the past mistakes so there might be tensions between us, but at the end, there's no blame.

I'm not sure of the resulting hexagram 4.

Any insights to the this oracle is greatly appreciated.

 

[Blue Eagle]

Hey there,

Sorry to hear about your struggle.

Hex 4 is about lack of knowledge/inexperience. Maybe hex 4 is not referring to the result but it is showing you why you are being so 'overly eager' to fix the past mistakes. So maybe you are gathering experience, learning.

good luck

 

[tubinluv]

Dear Blue Eagle,

Thank you so much for your insight. I really appreciate it! Do you agree with my interpretation on 18.3?

 

[steve]

Hi

Welcome to the forum, so many people find this forum due to relationship issues, thats how i found it.

18.3 I believe is saying what you think it is as this seems to ring true, but the yi is also saying its better to have acted this way than have done nothing, like sitting on the couch with a beer pretending nothing is happening. I think 18 is saying that you can work on this but you will need a different approach, maybe back off slightly however i dont know this I am just suggesting this hence the line.

I think 4 maybe saying again there is no real blame as you didnt do anything on purpose exactly.
As stated above maybe due to lack of experience, something along these lines.

Steve

 

[radiofreewill]

Hi tubinluv,

Yep, I agree with your reading.

4 means that you and your man will relax and feel better, if you can decrease the emotional pressure on him in the next few days (18.3) ~ sincerity and honesty about your feelings can help a lot in this situation.

all best!

 

[steve]

Oh sorry I thought you maybe male, maybe sitting on the couch with a beer wasnt the best metaphor, but i think you know what I meant

Steve

 

[Blue Eagle]

Yes I do! I think that it will worked out for you.

 

[tubinluv]

Wow, thank you all for your responses. This is such a great forum, I've been on my own trying to understand IChing's messages, but now I feel I have a "home". Thank you again!!

btw, how do you know if I was a female or male? Is it indicated somewhere?

 

[steve]

you can view a persons profile which maybe i should before I comment, after this

Steve

 

[steve]

you can view a persons profile which maybe i should before I comment, after this

Steve

 

[rosada]

18.3 "Sorry, Dad, This doesn't work for me."
You have had an idea in your mind as to what a marriage should be. Probably you're still influenced by what you saw in your parents' marriage (whether it was good or bad). In trying to wrench your present life experience into alignment with this ideal you have created separation. So yes, your "marriage" as your dream of what a marriage/relationship should be, is over because you realize that that vision you held was unreal. But now you can begin to create something more authentic for you and your partner from this day forward.
4. "Marriages are made in heaven..but you have to work them out here on earth."
Test your theories but don't try to hold yourself or your partner to some unrealistic ideal.

 

[tubinluv]

Thanks Rosada for your input! That's another insightful perspective for 18.3. I'm somewhat lost on your interpretation on hex 4 "4. "Marriages are made in heaven..but you have to work them out here on earth."
Test your theories but don't try to hold yourself or your partner to some unrealistic ideal. " Can you please elaborate on that?

Another question I have in general is do you interpret the resulting hexagram as a possibility of an outcome based on the first hexagram and its moving lines. For ex: 18.3 >4, I would normally look at 18, then line3 to understand what the message is then hexagram 4 as a result of 18 and its moving line (3), this is where it gets a little bit more difficult because the hexagram and the moving lines can be positive but the resulting hexagram is "negative".

Another example would be 59.2.6 > 8 and the question is will I be able to get the job?

Thank you in advance for all the responses I may receive, your insights are greatly appreciated!!

 

[diamanda]

the hexagram and the moving lines can be positive but the resulting hexagram is "negative".

It's very common in life to have a situation start well, then end badly for whatever reason.

 

[Trojina]

People do vary in how they see the relating hexagram but generally I think most find to use the relating hexagram as the 'result' less helpful. How to see the relating hexagram is fairly fluid, I think it was Karcher who said that the relating hexagram is the sea in which the primary swims. In that way you can see how it might include aspects of the past and future.

You were right when you said

this is where it gets a little bit more difficult because the hexagram and the moving lines can be positive but the resulting hexagram is "negative".

It doesn't make sense and isn't a useful way to connect primary and relating hexagrams. Here's a blog post from Hilary about it




http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2013/06/01/the-old-resulting-hexagram-conundrum/

I suggest you see the relating hexagram not as 'the result' but the entire backdrop to the situation which can incorporate aspects of the future too but isn't 'the result'.

I agree with Rosada's comments about your 18.3. 18.3 doesn't bode well for fixing things which doesn't mean it's wrong to try just that it's ineffective. So I'd think if you want to save the marriage that current ways of going about that don't work terribly well. Looking at 4 which is the angle you are coming from, particularly 4.3, the fan yao, perhaps you have a particular ideal of how things should be that isn't very real. I do not suggest using the fan yao instead of the answer or in any way as the reading but it can sometimes cast light on the answer you got. In 4.3 someone casts themselves away in adulation of a kind of false god and I wonder if that might be reflected in the decay in 18.3. Are you trying to make your marriage into something someone else said marriage should be like ? Remember it's your marriage, it's not something to measure success by through looking at other people's. As this is 18 your parents in particular may have influenced your ideas here.


You asked for a yes/no prediction not whether you were going about trying to save your marriage in the right way. I think if you just want a yes or no then this is a yes it's over...because your ways of remedying things don't work. But Yi has given you something more than a yes/no response, I think it's suggesting you consider the way you go about trying to remedy things. I don't think any 'remedy' is guaranteed here but to have the best shot at it a re think is probably required about what your aim is and how to go about it.

 

[rosada]

My thinking on hex 4. meaning "Marriages are made in heaven but we have to work them out here on earth":

The first three hexagrams IC all advise perseverance furthers. Imagine someone consulting the IC over and over and getting this advice.

Questioner: I'm miserable. What should I do?
Advice from hex 1: Perseverance furthers!

Questioner: But nothings working! What should I do?
Advice from hex 2: Persevere!

Questioner: Persevere in being married? Persevere in not being married? Wha..??
Advice from hex 3: Persevere!

Questioner: I don't know what you mean by persevere. Can you explain, please?
Advice from hex 4: Geeze, I've answered you too many times already. I guess you've never experienced perseverance so of course you don't even know what the word means. Just telling you anything more isn't going to work until you've had some actual experience with perseverance.

Questioner: What a grouch. Okay, well, the image for 4. Youthful Folly says the superior man is thorough in all that he does. I guess that means I don't get new insights until I thoroughly digest the perseverance furthers advice. Looking at the lines:

4.1 To make a fool develop..the fetters should be removed.

Ah ha! So the IC is telling me that I can't learn more about perseverance just reading the advice "Persevere! Persevere!" Experience is the teacher so I have to quit focusing on the theory, the restrictions, of how I imagine a marriage should be and get out there and live with my situation with the attitude that hell or high water I am going to keep on keeping on.

...and thus this is where I come up with the interpretation that 4. means marriages are made in heaven, that is, in theory marriage is divine bliss but....when we actually experience marriage we find what we thought the theory meant needs a bit of tweaking.

Looking at the rest of the 4. lines:

4.2 The inexperienced fool does have a bit of understanding already wired into his hard drive making him capable of figuring out a few things about how to get along in the world. {You've been able to do a few things right to keep the marriage going on a basic level]

4.3 Trouble is he tends to want to just keep following this same old advice or look to others to tell him what he should do rather than trusting his own experience. {But you didn't progress because you fell back to comparing your marriage to some outside ideal.]

4.4 Of course following his own guidance just leads to humiliation because he lacks any previous experience to guide him. {That didn't work so now you're wondering what should I do? What is MY idea of a good marriage?]

4.5 But that's okay because even the trying and failing counts and he learns from it and now having had some experience he can ask for more focused guidance about how to move forward.{Once you know what you want, to stay married or not or to make a fresh start or..? Then you can ask a new question]

4.6 And this time he he doesn't have to argue with the answer. {Ditto]

 

[tubinluv]

Thank you all exceedingly for your insights!! I've been getting hex 18 in the past with similar subject and many quotes such as" it's good to see a great man". I've been trying to find out who this great man is, counselor, astrologer, an older friend I can trust??? I think I have the answer now.

Looking at fan yao as Trojina suggested shed a good light to the scenario and the explanation from Rosada is crystal clear!!

Thank you very much!!

 

[Sofia Andrews]

request

what does it mean? 18.3>4 .I think it is not 3 coins method.what is that method?

 

[tubinluv]

18.3>4 means hexagram 18 with changing line 3 creating the second hexagram (4)). I'm casting the oracle using onlineclarity site but you can also use the 3-coin method as well. Hope this helps.

 

[tubinluv]

Dear Community,

It's been a while and I'd like to provide an update on the situation as my humble gesture of appreciation towards the ones that had provided me insights.

18.3>4 did not bode well at all. Whatever it was in the past in our relationship (the connections, the interactions, etc.. ) were pretty much gone. I didn't understand hex 18 that well and took it lightly even though Rosada and Trojina clearly spelled it out, I guess I was blind and felt somewhat confidence in what we've had in the past. I just thought... ok, if there's a problem, then let's fix it! I underestimated the magnitude of the situation and hence the meaning of hex 18.

I think I slowly understand more about hex 18. My experience with18.3 or hex 18 in general is the situation is already bad/rotten BUT things can be repaired but keep in mind that it does require a tremendous amount of work to rectify the situation, internally (mental thoughts and attitudes) and externally (actions). I'm very grateful for Yi's guidance along the way because looking back, things would have been irreversible due to my ignorance and immaturity.

Once again, thanks for all your help!