On again off again

[kincadefoster]

Hi. My first post here.

So I have this on again off again thing with a girl and from what I can see from reading a few threads here, there's plenty of them going around. For the first time she hasn't talked to me in a while, I think it's been a couple weeks. I'm pretty sure she'll eventually start missing me again soon and ask for me back.

So I asked, (keeping in mind as part of the question that I love her and want this relationship and the question is toward this end) "What will happen if I call her today?"

IC says 2 unchanging.

But after a while I started thinking maybe I really want her to understand the consequences of her actions, that I shouldn't just take her back easily this time. (she does the breaking off)
And I asked(again keeping in mind the question of the relationship working as the intent of the question): "What if I wait for a sign from her or for her to make a move?"

IC says 33.1.4.6 > 63

63 already across or after completion could maybe mean she has already given a sign, idk? She liked a post of mine on FB which post was several days ago which means she was looking at my page not the news feed.

Or maybe she is the one retreating? But it probably means I need to regroup, right?

 

[Tim K]

"What if I wait for a sign from her or for her to make a move?"

33.1.4.6(Retreat) -> 63(After Completion)

Hex 33, Wilhelm:
Thus we do not simple abandon the field to the opponent; we make it difficult for him to advance by showing perseverance in single acts of resistance. In this way we prepare, while retreating, for the counter-movement.

Line 1: Yes just keep still
Line 4: You keep still by your own choice, voluntary and it's good.
Line 6: The impulse to retreat comes from the understanding and accepting the situation, 'cheerful retreat', very good.

Make yourself some tea and sit

And just look at the structure of hex 63 - It represents the title of this thread!

 

[kincadefoster]

"Thus we do not simple abandon the field to the opponent; we make it difficult for him to advance by showing perseverance in single acts of resistance."

Ummm.... this sounds like taking small actions here and there is good, instead of doing absolutely nothing? Am I just thinking too much?

 

[Tim K]

You are resisting by 'not biting the hook' Just wait. Not completely abandon the relationship, but only resist taking the initiative.

maybe I really want her to understand the consequences of her actions, that I shouldn't just take her back easily this time.

Yes you are thinking too much)

 

[blue_angel]

Hi Kincadefoster,

This is just my opinion of the interpretation, you're going to ultimately have to use your intuition. For your first question, you asked "what will happen if I called her day?" Your answer was 2 unchanging. Its very likely if you called her she would be receptive to you or perhaps you would need to be receptive to her. Either way the advice in hexagram 2 is good to follow, especially since you say she continuously breaks it off then comes back. Wouldn't you rather get to the root of the problem of why she feels the need to break it off in the first place, and find a solution to those existing problems, this way the repeated behavior will cease to exist? Rather than "teach her a lesson?" This would require some effort, willingness to work, and to be receptive.

As for your second question, you did not ask Iching "what should I do regarding x?" Or "how can I help fix the existing problems between me and x?" No, you asked "what if I wait for a sign from her or for her to make a move?" Ichings answer, first 63, already across. Beginnings good, endings chaos. This is already what's happening. And its possible that this very attitude is what brings you to these break ups in the first place. You are already in retreat mode. What will happen?

You will continue to retreat 33 and the advice in the lines 1. It is dangerous to stay in the rear during a retreat. Come to the front, bring everything out in the open. Does she know you love her? Does she know you want the relationship? To want you must be willing to work on the existing problems. Since you're already in a state of retreat, if you do nothing what will the danger or results be? Line 4- if you retreat for good reasons, you will have good fortune. If you retreat out of meanness or "to teach her a lesson" misfortune. Line 6- if you have no doubts about retreating then you will have good fortune by doing so.
No doubt whatsoever.

Advice is to act with grace, to have a clear conscience in
your dealings with her. Back to 2- do not try to lead, but create through perseverance, being willing to follow each other, when you are receptive to each other you will have peace and be able to continue with good fortune.

Take care,

Blue_Angel

 

[Tim K]

Blue_Angel is right about the need to ask right questions, leading to the solution of the problem.

I was just trying to help interpret the reading in the context of the question. I don't like to give people advice on how to live their life, to judge them, they should think for themselves.

 

[blue_angel]

Ashteroid,

I see no reason for you to feel the need to defend your opinion of the translation. I don't think anyone is here to judge or tell anyone how to live their lives, but thank you for informing us that you don't like to. I agree it is best for one to think for themselves, which is why I stated in the beginning, this is my own opinion and he would have to use his own intuition. All opinions are good and welcome because it helps us to grow and learn together. At least that is my experience here. Sometimes the opinions will be the same and other times they won't. I believe that is because we each use different translations and have our own unique perspectives, as well as our own life experience. Overall though I believe most come here to help and continue learning.

Take care,

Blue_Angel

 

[kincadefoster]

tomorrow I will ask the IC more. But for now, what would your advice be then, I humbly ask? You see it has been going for a while. We get in fight over something stupid, mostly bc she has issues and is kinda crazy, she's a hard woman to love, but I love her love her. I'm not trying to teach her a lesson purely out of anger, altho I am angry. I want her understand she can't keep doing this. That if she starts yelling at me and disrespecting, the consequence is the pleasure of my company. If she moves on, she will do it to someone else. I thought the silent treatment for a while may help.
I guess I want advice from wise people and not just the universe who can only speak to me in this metaphorical language...

 

[blue_angel]

Hi kincadefoster,

Try learning how to use the Iching. How will you know anyone on here is any wiser than yourself? You are coming here for help, advice from complete strangers. To me there is no better tool to use than the Iching because it speaks through you, to you. Once you are able to connect with it, tap into your own intuition of what its saying to you. Its like sending a prayer out, and receiving an answer. Its your life, your path. The wisdom already is within yourself.

Giving her the silent treatment, that is just a game in my opinion. It does not solve anything. Communication and understanding is what can help you solve. Being receptive.

Try meditating and clearing your mind, then ask the Iching the questions I suggested. "What can I do to help resolve the problems I am having with (name)?" Or "how should I approach (name)?"

You think the arguments are stupid, obviously she doesn't. What is the source of those arguments? This is something you have to figure out and talk with her about. If you feel disrespected, let her know. If the relationship is important to you let her know. Let her know you are
willing to work things out. Let her know that rather than break up every
time somethings not going right, that you need to instead be able to talk
it through respectfully, like two adults. Calling her crazy... is that the
truth? Is she crazy? Why would you want to be with someone that's
crazy? Or is that out of anger, a way of not taking responsibility on your
part? In my opinion, if she keeps coming back, you must be important to
her, she must have some love for you too. Have you expressed your love
to her? Is everything clear on both sides?

My initial thought was your answer is in hexagram 2. Now that you've written further. I believe that much more, your answer is in 2. You need to follow the advice of 2. There are many different translations of 2. Learn to be receptive, relationships are work, be willing to do the work, like the mare. Persevere in hard times. There is also a sticky right above all of these threads on relationship advice, for what kind of questions to ask. Read it, that should help.

Take care,

Blue_Angel

 

[Tim K]

I was just reading "Heritage of Change" by Wallace Andrew Sherrill, and found an interesting view on human relationships:

I think this on and off game fits here perfectly.

 

[blue_angel]

Hi Ashteroid,

Thank you for sharing that. Its good reading, I enjoyed it. However, I disagree that it fits perfectly with on and off again, here's why... Sure, as it says, a healthy friction from time to time is good, spices things back up a bit. Differences of opinion are good, gives us something to debate, exercises our minds, shows that even though we connect and love each other we are still unique and our own person. Like the chapter says though, (mild) forms of friction.

Breaking up, is extreme, at least to me. To me, in my experience, it is draining, tiring, and unhealthy. When I am in this same type of a situation, I would rather debate. I would rather communicate. Its too unstable when one is consistently breaking up and uncertain. There's no foundation, no security, and nothing to build on. I would be constantly starting over at square one with nothing accomplished.

When given the silent treatment, I think the person must not love me, or even care enough to communicate with me or work things out.
Eventually I will give up. One person can only try so much. It takes two.

Of course everyone is different and this is just based on my own experience, my own opinion. Not saying yours or anyone elses is not valid.

I am not sure exactly what kincadefoster's situation is
or what his girlfriend feels or thinks. It seems in relationships there's
usually two sides to see and sometimes three. Relationships can be
tricky. People evolve, they come from different cultures, belief systems.
Age and experience plays a factor. Different personalities, different ways
of thinking, seeing, and doing. So its hard to say, that's why I feel
communication is a key ingredient and the advice of the Iching, once
one is able to develop that connection, and intuition with their own
readings can be very helpful.

Blue_Angel

 

[kincadefoster]

blue angel thank you.

as far as what you said about eventually giving up, this is what I felt close to...
As far as craziness, she is a bit of a basket case. Before I met her I never could have imagined loving someone like her. I told her in the first week that I liked that she was a bit of a basket case as it made me feel better about being one myself(I don't lash at people normally, but have major anxieties sometimes) She knows she is so didn't take it as insult. And somehow I find her perfectly adorable. Someone once told me that everybody is crazy; you just find the crazy you can deal with. I have told her in txt I miss her, and we had a short txt conversation, sup hows it going type stuff, I didn't press anymore than that. It has been a few days since. I know you probably think calling would be better, but I know her well and after our fights we would always txt b4 being comfortable enough to call and she always called me when she wanted to talk. It's been a few days since...
I have asked the IC two questions
What is going on with me with regards to this situation?
1. Creative unchanging
How should I approach (her) ? (one of your suggestions)
53.3.4.5 > 35

 

[blue_angel]

Hi,

For your first question, I think you would have to read translations on hexagram 1 and see what resonates with you. I hope you do that anyway. I am no psychic or expert. Some translations speak of creativeness, some speak of sexual energy, and some speak of spiritual enlightenment. So maybe you are full of creative energy and you are working on or contemplating all aspects of life, getting in touch with yourself, and in doing so learning the ways of heaven. I really don't know, maybe someone else has a better feel for 1 unchanging.

For your second question, 53 is great for relationships, although it is such a slow progress, literally step by step, and takes so much patience I find.
Line 3- something has been taken to far, or maybe it reflects you feeling this. Maybe you are wondering if its worth it, and it also speaks of illusions.

Line 4- adapt and overcome is how I see it. Be gentle and flexible, yet accept it as it is for now.

Line 5- seems like eventually everything works out after some work and perseverance.

35- in relationships for me has been a sexual attraction hexagram. Lol we mate like the horses 3 times in a day. But this may not be the same for everyone. It is an advancement through work. Being blessed with gifts and working to multiply these gifts. Both 53 and 35 in my experience I get when things are going pretty good, as if meant to be. The only real advice I can give here, is read the translations and see how they resonate with your situation. Usually I will read and I have a few bells ring or ah ha moments as they say. Take that creativeness in hex 1 you have and use it to your benefit. See how the Iching works for you.
Let us know how it all works out.

Best wishes on your journey,

Blue_Angel

 

[kincadefoster]

Well, it hasn't changed much. There has been limited communication between us lately, and she invited me over on christmas and nothing went beyond cuddling.
She acts pretty disrespectful of me sometimes, and I feel angry like I want to lash out and tell her I'm sick of it and to get out of my life, but I know deep down I don't want to, mostly I am looking back on previous stuff that was unresolved, so I asked:
How can I find a balance between not giving up on her and not allowing disrespect? 4.1.2 > 27

 

[Tim K]

How can I find a balance between not giving up on her and not allowing disrespect? 4.1.2 > 27

Nice answer,
Line 1, Wilhelm: "To make a fool develop it furthers one to apply discipline. The fetters should be removed. To go on in this way bring humiliation."

Laying some ground rules will be helpful. Like "No slapping before dinner, honey, my skin gets itchy after that", and
"Hun, please don't throw my briefs out, they don't look so good after our neighbor's dog plays with them".

Line 2, Wilhelm: "To bear with fools in kindliness brings good fortune. To know how to take women brings good fortune. The son is capable of taking charge of the household."

Don't be angry with her, just try to understand that it is in her nature.

More Wilhelm: "He has the inner superiority and that enable him to tolerate with kindliness the shortcomings of human folly. The same attitude is owed to women as the weaker sex. One must understand them and give them recognition in a spirit of chivalrous consideration."

And hex 27 gives the feeling of taking a stand for yourself, don't forget about your interests.

 

[kincadefoster]

So there was an issue between us that I have been debating with myself whether I have to put my foot down or allow her to figure out(sometimes with stubborn people its best they work it out and come to the truth themselves rather than being pushed)

best course of action? 23.1 > 27

 

[blue_angel]

Hi,

All I see in this reading is (27)- pay attention to what will nourish you, her, and your relationship. How does she nourish you? How do you nourish her? How do you nourish yourselves.

(23)- whatever you're doing or contemplating doing is the exact opposite of nourishment. You're stripping away.

And line (1)- your frame of mind is not right. Are there others persuading you against her? Either way until you get your mind right, don't take any action. You are in danger of losing the relationship altogether.

Have you read "The 5 languages of love" by Gary Chapman? That's a great book for relationships.

All the best,

Blue_Angel

 

[cornucopia63]

blue angel thank you.

I have asked the IC two questions
What is going on with me with regards to this situation?
1. Creative unchanging
You would like to be in control and take the initiative with her.

How should I approach (her) ? (one of your suggestions)
53.3.4.5 > 3

Difficulties and chaos between you like all new beginnings when something is being formed. It's best to consolidate your position with her. There has been cheating and betrayal. Was she or you with someone else before? Defend your position instead of attacking her. Don't be in a hurry to succeed. Make her feel safe and secure. She wants a permanent home/relationship. With inner strength and flexibility you can reach your goal. It may take longer than you expected - marriage and children is possible.


You need to plan ahead and prepare yourself before you make any moves with her. Don't be spontaneous and adapt. This started out as something casual but now it's time for long term commitment.

 

[blue_angel]

Has there been infidelity and betrayal? Where does that come from? Did I miss something?

 

[cornucopia63]

Has there been infidelity and betrayal? Where does that come from? Did I miss something?

Hello blue angel, I have hexagram 53 line 3 as possible betrayal from partners (business, friendship or romantic). Betrayal could also be revealing confidential information to a 3rd party like trusting someone with your secrets and they spread it around for personal gain not necessarily cheating.

 

[blue_angel]

Ah, I see thank you for clarifying that. May I ask what translations you use?

 

[cornucopia63]

Ah, I see thank you for clarifying that. May I ask what translations you use?

I use many and combine them in this case I used John Blofeld. Hexagram 53 line 3 is about separation caused by going astray and there is misfortune for the couple. 'Going astray' I interpret as cheating or betrayal and in Blofeld's version I take it from the woman's side because the man is not willing to commit and build a monogamous serious relationship.

The other source which is usually spot on for me when I'm too lazy to go into the original versions is The I Ching Made Easy by Amy and Roderic Sorrell.

 

[kincadefoster]

This man is willing to commit.

But I may as well tell you guys more now, I kinda didn't want to say over the internet, now I will.
Basically we have split up and she wants to see other people. The last time she came back saying she wanted me back and we ended up friends as she ultimately was unwilling to commit to anything. And she will keep coming back most likely too...
The last question was to whether I should put my foot down, not as to whether she sees other people(I believe in giving people freedom), but she still seems to want to hang out w me during most of her free days and cuddle all night when we do and I felt I was just being used so she can have all the good things she wants from me(feeling loved and all the warm fuzzy stuff), but ultimately may be saving the sex for other people. I got fed up, frustrated and didn't wait for you guys to answer on 23.1>27 b4 I confronted her and a sort of argument ensued and ended w her saying basically she doesn't want me sexually(which is a load of crap, even if she believes it as she has said it before and we still did the deed and she still told me it was fantastic, along with a bunch of other evidence) I'm kinda out of my depth, pretty sure there is some BPD(Borderline) going on, mostly I just wish she would work on herself like she keeps saying she wants to and avoid the self destructive stuff.
But, I am conflicted. I have dealt with BPD twice before and I dumped them like a bad habit, but somehow I just can't do it this time. Something in me keeps telling me there is something good that can come of this, and the I ching also keeps supporting it too(Usually I get something saying it is no go). Oh and I love her...

What I do have in my favor is that I am the only person willing to stick with her and I can handle her storms much better than most. In fact, I can always calm her down as long as I am calm...
But, in case I am wrong about this, something good in the making, I asked if there is something missing, a missing piece of information here?
46 unchanging

 

[blue_angel]

There's a great thread on here about borderline mother's. Having a relationship with anyone borderline is extremely difficult and painful. There's a book specifically for a borderline girlfriend. Go to outofthefog.com Google it. Great info. I have a borderline mother so I can share some experience if you would like.

There's also a great thread that speaks in depth on sex, feelings, and the spiritual connection made during such intimacy, if I can find it, I'll share. A lot of times a woman will cut off sex if she doesn't feel a man loves her or has long term intentions with her. No matter how great the sex is, no matter how much she loves him. A lot of times she will attempt to be friends or she could even be attempting to make you jealous, to see if you are committed. I can not stress how important communication is. So again I ask have you told her you love her and are there for the long haul? I have been in a similar situation and loved a man with all my heart. Thought it was meant to be. Although his actions said he loved me. He told me he didn't. We tried the friend thing many times. We would get back together, and fall apart. Finally I put my foot down and said I loved him for who he was and all he was and I would be there as a friend whenever he needed me but no more than that. We have never spoken again and probably won't. Ever. Its a long story. And its history. My point is life is too short, enjoy all you can. Open the communication. Get to the roots of the issues to see if you can work them out. 46 pushing upward, seems like a yes, there are some pieces missing. Seems to me like reassurance, you asked the right question. Now what are those pieces. Iching is a great tool but sometimes you have to go off your intuition. I know from experience love can be hard. Painful to let go. Then again the most loving thing you can do is let go if that's what she wants. Once you've given it all you have, you tried everything, you were fully open and honest, not much more you can do. Sure you can put your foot down. Maybe that's what's needed. I hope it all works out for the best.

Blue_Angel

 

[Tim K]

Thank you for sharing more details about your situation, kincade.

I think it was your soul's plan to learn how to deal with bi-polar people. You say you have already tried to date two of them but with no luck.

I dumped them like a bad habit, but somehow I just can't do it this time

And I think this will keep happening until you 'get it', that's why you feel like that.

In this sense, 46 is telling you that this experience is presented for you to grow and ascend your soul to the next level.

Wilhelm:
PUSHING UPWARD indicates rather a vertical ascent-direct rise from obscurity and lowliness to power and influence.

The pushing upward is made possible not by violence but by modesty and adaptability. Since the individual is borne along by the propitiousness of the time, he advances. He must go to see authoritative people. He need not be afraid to do this, because success is assured. But he must set to work, for activity (this is the meaning of "the south") brings good fortune.

Within the earth, wood grows:
Thus the superior man of devoted character heaps up small things in order to achieve something high and great.

Step by step, systematically you will reach your goal. Don't be passive, try to do something even if it is only talking to her, use your 'great' qualities to help you.

Adapting itself to obstacles and bending around them, wood in the earth grows upward without haste and without rest. Thus too the superior man is devoted in character and never pauses in his progress.
Adapting is the key, you must be like a rubber buffer between train cars, damping her impulses.

What I do have in my favor is that I am the only person willing to stick with her and I can handle her storms much better than most.

I think you have a great task to accomplish, and you have all the means to do it properly, persevere!

 

[blue_angel]

Thank you for sharing your view Ashteroid, and you may be right. However, I am going to share some facts on this. First, he said borderline not bipolar and for treatment sake, they are different and distinct. Second statistics state there are over 6 million people diagnosed with borderline disorder in America. Not unlikely to run into a few. A few more facts according to research, if one has a parent that has borderline personality disorder they are more likely to attract or be attracted to a relationship with someone with borderline disorder. If she's demonstrating she would like help or has said she would like a help there is a likely chance she is not borderline, there is at least a chance for hope. If she's even borderline at all. Borderline has a huge issue with abandonment so they will often push people away before they can be abandoned and repeat the cycle. Maybe she is, maybe she isn't, even if you do all the research yourself on the disorder, until she's diagnosed its really just speculation. The part I do agree with, is yes it could very well be your path to learn about this disorder or these types of people for your own growth. Not that it is necessarily meant for you to be with her. Maybe you are, maybe you aren't. That is of your choice and your life what you decide to do. I hope that helps some.

 

[blue_angel]

Also... I wouldn't go off of the fact she is pushing you away and then coming back to decide wether or not she is borderline. There could be a number of reasons she is doing this. And as you stated, she doesn't seem to be pushing you away altogether, she wants to remain friends just doesn't want you sexually. She still wants to cuddle and hang out. That doesn't sound borderline to me. But then I am not a Dr or a
therapist. I can only tell you from my own experience with my mother and as a whole family we have done research and went to therapy. So this is what I have learned. If she doesn't want sex. She doesn't want sex. That's pretty forward. Who knows why she allows sex again. Maybe she is not strong. Maybe she gets bord. Maybe she feels sorry for you
and does care about you but doesn't want to hurt your feelings. Maybe
she is using you. Maybe she holds onto you until she finds someone
better. Who knows? She does. I would take her word that she just
wants a friendship and make your boundaries firm, since that is the last thing she said she wanted, you must respect her decision. If she
comes back for sex again or wants to get back together that would be the time to work on ground rules and getting to the root of the problem as to why the back and forth. And again if a woman feels a man does not truly love her or does not have long term interest in her,
Its not uncommon for her to stop the sex and yet still want to remain friends because she cares about the man or loves him. Agreed the back and forth is painful and unhealthy.

 

[kincadefoster]

In the beginning, she would always talk about how I was the best thing that happened to her. somewhere along the line, I disappointed her by being imperfect or something and now she has convinced herself she never had any feelings for me. Whether she is borderline or not, this is a borderline behavior... And the cuddling is borderline behavior too as she goes through phases where she constantly wants to be next to me, then suddenly doesnt for no apparent reason. We have done this for a while now, she would always say she wanted to just be friends and then sooner or later want sex from me and I never really pressured her into it.
I can tell that she does have feelings for me deep down somewhere because of the things she gets angry about with me. You don't get angry with someone if you don't care about them.
Our last big fight was basically because I didn't want to have sex with her without more commitment.

 

[blue_angel]

Well... just because she said you were the best thing that happened to her and overtime she now sees it differently, I still don't see as borderline.

You mentioned disappointing her, can you think of a specific disappointment? Something that never got resolved at least perhaps not in her eyes? The thing is people fall inlove, and a lot of times the "inlove" is an illusion. At the time you don't see it that way, it feels completely natural, you can't wait to be with the person or talk to them, and they're all you think about. But as time goes on, you've been together for a while, you start to see each others bad habits and faults. The illusion is lifted. When we came into this we show our best self, we may try to show our true self but we end up showing our best self. With time we see all the true colors. At this point we may no longer be in love, now it is a choice to whether or not we are going to love this person and commit.

If she somewhere along the lines lost trust in you, that could keep her from wanting to commit. But she could very well have thought she felt "you were the best thing that happened to her." And then realized you weren't. In tue beginning a lot of people project onto to other people. So she may have had a sort false image of you. Placing you on a pedestal. Making you the guy she hopes for or wishes for, failing to actually see you. When she finally sees you, it's not at all what she had envisioned. So it could be something specific you did or it may not be.

You can get angry with someone you don't care about. I use to do it everyday while driving home from work. It never fails at a certain intersection for some idiot to cut you off and speed past nearly causing you to wreck into the wall. Doesn't matter who you are. We get mad at the idiot and we have no idea who they are. There are a number of reasons why she could be doing what she is and how she is. No, its not right, and its hurting you. But you are going to have to do what works for you to nourish you. And stop doing whatever is not healthy for you. You only can direct yourself, not anyone else. If she says she does not see you sexually I would take her word for it. It is possible she did at one point and now she doesn't. Something turned her off. Or she lost trust. You can attempt to find out by asking her, what happened? What is it that made you change your mind? Is there something I can do to make it better?
She may have come back trying again to have sex or cuddle hoping she would feel again what she felt in the beginning. When she didn't feel it, she backed away. She seen how it affected you, didn't want to hurt you, tried again. She still didn't get that feeling back, that loving feeling, or spark.

You asked is there a missing piece? You got 46. I take that as yes, there's a missing piece. Meaning something you haven't already thought of, or something you don't see clearly. Find the missing piece. Also you got 23.1 and another translation I read of 23 line 1, is "his assumptions are wrong."

I've been in this very same position, a few times actually. Although I am a woman and its usually the guy wanting sex and a friendship, as they say now friends with benefits, and the woman wanting a commitment. The woman is hoping he will eventually commit, so she keeps having sex. In the beginning he said all of the wonderful things she wanted to hear. He was stringing her along. In the end the woman finally gets strong and realizes she is not going to get a committed, loving relationship from this guy. So your story is a lot like roles reversed. Have you asked her calmly why she comes and goes and comes back again? People are not always borderline. Even if the behavior may seem borderline, she may have a reason for her actions that if she opened up about and communicated could make perfect sense. Half of relationship issues are a lack of communication and misunderstanding. Read the book I suggested, look up the site. One of the two should help.

 

[kincadefoster]

Blue Angel thank you for taking the time with all your answers. And thank you everyone else too.

Maybe Im just being pedantic at this point.
But I really can't be friends with her. After all that is said and done(and I havent told u everything she put me through) her wanting to be friends while she dates other people just hurts and she still wants to hang out and call me a lot and be affectionate. And she kept saying things like she wanted me back, but I guess changing her mind. But majorly mixed signals. This messes with my feelings. She is obviously plan-B-ing me.

It seems to me she has a hard time believing someone can really love her, based on how she has acted around me(ie asking me often if or why I love her)

Can anyone really hang with someone they really want to be with while watching them date other people? So, selfish or not, the only acceptable outcome for me is for us to get back together romantically and hopefully more permanently. With this in mind, I asked the following questions:

What happens if I tell her my feelings about the whole matter and that I can't be friends(at least for a good while) with someone who treats me like garbage?(basically cutting off the friendship for now)
52 unchanging
While I was throwing the coins for this question I had thought something about what the next line might be. I cleared my mind before throwing and it ended up being what I had thought, so later on I cast again, thinking maybe I had affected the reading. I don't know if this was the right thing to do or not.
5.1.2.3.4.6 > 12
I'm pretty sure one of the reasons she lost interest was that I was genuinely nice to her and always answered when she called and set aside what I was doing if not too important to be with her. A friend told me I have to give the impression that I value my time or any women in my life won't. So the other question I asked what if I am more challenging and a pain in the ass? (the idea I had in mind was that I ignore her more bc when we argue she knows my stance on most of these issues so she knows I mean it. Basically making her work more for the pleasure of my company and not being easy. For example she gets mad now that as we are "friends" I don't spend hours on the phone anymore Im like, "gotta go" after a while)
got 45.6 > 12
For the record I wouldnt be doing this to play a game or be manipulative, I just can't spend all that time and energy anymore with diminishing returns. And I'm still learning to take care of my own needs first in my life.