Problems with faith

[bostonian]

Some things which I interpreted would resolve themselves in a certain way based on my interpretation of I Ching readings did not come out as I had expected. The situations are not over, but I had expected (also based on the readings) them to resolve themselves by a certain time, which is now past. Anyway, that has led me to be less trusting of the I Ching as a divining tool and oracle.

This is the second time this "crisis of faith" afflicted me. But this time i decided to turn to the I Ching for an answer.

Question: What should i do about this crisis of faith?

I got 13:1 (Fellowship with Men)>33 (retreat).

Since I got Fellowship with Men, I thought that at least an aspect of an answer might come from posting here.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[willowfox]

We were all equal once, we were all novices at one time.

Hex 33 is about retreat, to retreat away from your disappointment, your lack of trust, do not let that doubt creep in otherwise it will cloud and destroy your future readings. Stop your doubts, stop thinking why, why was the IC wrong.

Anyway, misinterpretation is always a problem, sometimes we see what we want to see and sometimes we just read the answer wrongly, don't forget, most of us are human, with human failings.

 

[lucia]

Question: What should i do about this crisis of faith?

I got 13:1 (Fellowship with Men)>33 (retreat).

Cute answer!! I like it..............

Agree with WF but also I, and maybe the ching too, is questioning your idea of "Faith". It has religious overtones. It can be a comforting form of fellowship but it is open to the perils of clinging to things that should be more fluid. I think 13.1 says it's a beginning but don't get trapped behind the garden fence of "faith" because there is more beyond if you let go of ideas of certainty and and just keep your mind open.

As WF says, it is not an "exact science" apart from anything else it is about change and that is not fixed no? Never mind the perils of interpretation. Keep a journal - keep your sense of yourself as the agent of your own change and keep an open mind about the advice you receive in your readings.

I have years of journals and I still go back over really old things. Some make sense with time, some I see afresh with the clear light of retrospect, some give me lightbulb moments, some are just as confusing or apparently irrelevant as the day I threw them...........

What is very clear however, is that there are times when the ching was all I had and it gave me, not only very appropriate advice, but also told me things I could not otherwise have known at the time. Of that I have no doubt because it is evidence based over time; but I don't have "faith" as such because it is all too fluid. The ching is a very very valuable tool if I use it right but I make my own decisions and blunders.

Lucia

 

[gene]

Hi Bostonian

Reading for ourselves is very tricky, as few of us really see ourselves the way we really are, and we tend to read, unwittingly, what we want to read. Even readings by others is very subjective. The problem is not the I ching's answers, but how we, as underlings, tend to misinterpret them. I have done it. I have hurt myself by reading incorrectly at times, although when I went back and looked again, i think, how could I have missed that.

What I am about to say applies to all readers, senior and well as junior. We must be very careful. Reading the I Ching will not save us from the karma that we came into this life to go through. It is not a cure all and it will not solve all our problems. Then why do we use it? We use it as a tool for personal development. We must all realize, and this is very, very, serious, that we are underlings. We are no where near mature. We are children that never grew up. If we understood everything, we would not be on planet earth expiating karma and going through this cosmic school. Anyone who thinks that the I Ching is going to solve all his/her problems is sadly mistaken. All we can do is take steps daily to understand a tiny bit more and a tiny bit more. We can never solve our problems by asking the I Ching, we can only learn more about ourselves.

The commentary on hexagram 13 line one says, "Secret agreements brings misfortune." If we think of the I Ching as our personal tool to overcome every problem and help us rise above our fellow man we are following a recipe for disaster. Unfortunately, I see a lot of situations where readings are mechanical and do not take into account the overall character of the person being read for. Some problems are too big for a simple I Ching reading. We need a different type of counselling. Some people are using it to try to save themselves in some way. If your karma is to go through a situation, you are going to go through it, no matter what reading you get from the I Ching. The I Ching throws the question back at us, and gives us a mirror glimpse of ourselves as the universe sees us. This is the only salvation that can be expected of the I Ching.

By the way, I would guess that over 90% of the time, we misinterpret readings. We must go through the experience, and then go back and see what we missed, what we didn't understand.

Gene

 

[tigerintheboat]

Compare Oracles

Some things which I interpreted would resolve themselves in a certain way based on my interpretation of I Ching readings did not come out as I had expected.

Question: What should i do about this crisis of faith?

I got 13:1 (Fellowship with Men)>33 (retreat).

Since I got Fellowship with Men, I thought that at least an aspect of an answer might come from posting here.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

As for the reading, you Retreat (H33) in order to Advance later. It may be you are putting too much faith in your ability to understand the readings, and that you should Gather with Men and find the real purpose of a divining group, which is to learn to read the oracle by understanding not only the symbols of the Oracle, but ourselves.

Imagine if YI were instantly and 100% understandable to anyone over the age of majority who studied it for and passed a test. Not very realistic, is it? It would have to be a purely mechanical process, and can we understand ourselves and the universe in a mechanical way, without self-knowledge? I don't think so.

Finally, suppose it is only 80% accurate. How does that compare with other Oracles? Shop around and find something better, if it exists. I always liked this verse below from Joni Mitchell's "Song for Sharon."

"There's a gypsy down on Bleecker Street
I went in to see her as a kind of joke
And she lit a candle for my love luck
And eighteen bucks went up in smoke"

Best Wishes,

Tiger

 

[meng]

Anyway, that has led me to be less trusting of the I Ching as a divining tool and oracle.

This is the second time this "crisis of faith" afflicted me. But this time i decided to turn to the I Ching for an answer.

Question: What should i do about this crisis of faith?

I got 13:1 (Fellowship with Men)>33 (retreat).

Since I got Fellowship with Men, I thought that at least an aspect of an answer might come from posting here.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Learn from it. Go back (retreat) to the beginning (line 1) of those questions and answers, and become familiar with them in the light of what actually happened. Find the important relationships which bring it from theory to actuality.

Second, your original interpretations may not have been entirely wrong, but even one unintended rationalization can hide the truth from being seen (33).

I've had a couple big ones, so I can relate. One of mine was in relation to (13) hex 19. More than once that one has tripped me up, totally sending me where I didn't want to go. But through reexamining the whole picture, I realized that I made one mistake, one "small" rationalization to bring its meaning closer to what something I wanted. In other words, I heard what I wanted and needed to hear, but overlooked some essential meaning, leading me (19) down a path of my own wishful thinking. HELLO!!! Anyone in there??

But that's how we learn. That's how it moves from the head to the heart.