The meaning of life, the universe, and everything.

[binz]

Hi all,

I was thinking recently of the bit in Hitch-hikers Guide To The Galaxy where the question "what is the meaning of life, the universe, and everything" is answered. For those not familiar with it, they sit and pull letters at random from a scrabble bag, these make a maths question to which the answer is 42. Earlier, a computer had taken many years to arrive at the same answer.

This led to different thoughts (some shallower than others);

What other famous films, books, etc have key moments of divination?

Getting the same answer by different methods - indicating that different methods of divination lead to the same truth?

Was the answer "42" refering to Hex 42?

Can a single hex answer a question as big as this?

What's the difference between divination and coincidence? and how can you tell?

hhmmmm!

Binz

 

[lindsay]

Dear Binz,

Thanks for calling our attention to this amazing coincidence. I am perfectly prepared to believe that Hexagram 42, Increase, is in fact the secret of everything. After all, isn't the universe expanding at such a dizzying rate that our night sky may be empty of stars in a 100 billion years or so? Isn't endless replication the fundamental drive and purpose of all life? Isn't ever-increasing complexity the natural product of biological evolution? Didn't God tell us to be fruitful and multiply? Aren't we all, everyone of us, always trying to get more? Yes, I believe you've found it! 42!

Herman Hesse's "The Glass Bead Game" has some elements of Yi divination in it, but I can think of only one novel that actually features the I Ching, and it is a good one: Philip K. Dick's "The Man in the High Castle." The premise of this novel is that the Allies lost the Second World War, and it explores what future society might have been like if the US had been partitioned between Japan and Germany. The I Ching plays an important role in the lives of the characters.

Thanks again for pointing out this astounding synchronicity. I believe I'll play the numbers tomorrow.

Lindsay

 

[lindsay]

I forgot to mention one other book. The American journalist Frances Fitzgerald wrote an early indictment of the Vietnam War called "Fire in the Lake". Fire in the Lake, as you recall, is Hexagram 49 - Revolution - and that is the theme of Fitzgerald's book. "Fire in the Lake" won both the Pulitzer Prize and the National Book Award, the two most prestigious literary awards in the US.

Lindsay

 

[hilary]

I have some faint memories of the Hitchhiker's Guide... didn't '42' turn out to be the result of an arithmetical error in the end?

Divination in general in books... there's a wonderful passage in Paulo Coelho's The Alchemist. Our young hero is given the stones Urim and Thummim, which form a yes/no oracle, by a wise old man.

A few pages on, after he's been conned out of all his money, he consults the oracle.
"The old man had said to ask very clear questions, and to do that, the boy had to know what he wanted. So, he asked if the old man's blessing was still with him.
He took out one of the stones. It was "yes".
"Am I going to find my treasure?" he asked.
He stuck his hand into the pouch, and felt around for one of the stones. As he did so, both of them pushed through a hole in the pouch and fell to the ground. The boy had never even noticed that there was a hole in his pouch. He knelt down to find Urim and Thummim and put them back in the pouch. But as he saw them lying there on the ground, another phrase came to his mind.
"Learn to recognise omens, and follow them," the old king had said.
An omen. The boy smiled to himself. He picked up the two stones and put them back in his pouch. He didn't consider mending the hole - the two stones could fall through any time they wanted. He had learned that there were certain things one shouldn't ask about, so as not to flee from one's destiny. "I promised that I would make my own decisions," he said to himself."

 

[lindsay]

Hi all!

I?ve thought of one more example of fictional divination, and that is Philip Pullman?s remarkable fantasy trilogy ?His Dark Materials?: ?The Golden Compass?,?The Subtle Knife? and ?The Amber Spyglass?. I?m not much of a fantasy fan, but these books are riveting. Some people have compared Pullman to Tolkien, and for once I think the comparison may be apt.

Impossible to summarize the plot ? Pullman thinks even bigger than Douglas Adams ? but the main character is a young woman named Lyra, and Lyra has a divinatory device called an ?alethiometer?. This alethiometer ($10 to the first person who can say the word clearly 5 times in 2 seconds) is a gold and crystal disk that displays strange symbols when asked a question. Very few people understand the symbols, and even fewer can interpret them correctly. Except, of course, Lyra, who has an innate ability to read the device (impossible not to think of Hilary or LiSe here). The alethiometer was made by the ancients, and offers advice and glimpses of the future. Or probable future, unless you do something heroic like slip into a parallel reality to get some answers.

I am an exceedingly slow reader. The average novel takes me at least 2 months or more to read. Last year I read all three of Pullman?s books in less than a month! They are so absorbing I could not put them down. I hope to read them again someday, and I would recommend them to anyone interested in the Yi without exception. Yi people have all the requisite qualities to appreciate these books.

Thinking about Binz?s questions, I found myself wandering in archetype country. Why is it that women are nearly always the best diviners in fiction and real life? There are many professional tarot card readers in my area, and they are all women. Once I went to a ?psychic fair? in a nearby city, a large event, and although it featured quite a variety of divination techniques, all the diviners were women. As were most of the clients. Thinking back through history, legend, and stereotypes, I keep finding women mainly associated with divination.

However, this is not true of oracles ? ?that which is asked?. I think most oracles are seen as male. We?ve talked before about our mental picture of the Yi Oracle, and the wise old man archetype seems to win hands down.

Is it possible men do not like to ask questions? There is an old joke about how a man lost on the highway will fiddle around with maps, compasses, celestial navigation, anything, before stopping to ask for directions. As a man, I admit I have had some difficulty asking a lot of questions about my life, something basic to Yi divination. I?m not inclined to much introspection about daily problems, I just bumble ahead and deal with them. My introspection tends to be rather abstract. For example, I might be addressing only my own hesitations, but I will always ask a general question like, ?Why don?t men ask questions?? My personal problems are somehow always phrased as philosophical problems. I know other men like this, but it does not seem to be so typical of women. Sometimes I suspect women actually enjoy asking questions.

Or maybe it?s really a question of communication. Are diviners such communication junkies that, not satisfied with their usual amount of daily communication, they turn to oracles to stay in even closer touch with life? Men read newspapers and listen to the news, but women actually talk to each other. Imagine.

Related to this are the improbable conventions of detective fiction. Fictional male detectives are always asking questions, noticing every minor detail, open to the subtlest of signals, always emotionally aware. Now honestly, have you ever known a man like that? But I can believe it of women, and I find women often make the most convincing fictional detectives, except when the rough stuff begins.

A diviner is a kind of detective, is she not?

Sorry for a lot tiresome maundering, but I really would like to know why most diviners are women? As a man, am I swimming against some archetypal current? Should I give up on the Yi and take up a masculine hobby like drinking beer?

Lindsay

 

[louise]

What I have noticed is on this forum there are loads more women asking what men think/feel about them than there are men asking the same thing. I've been dying to say for some time now "Ladies the more times you have to consult Yi about a man the less likley it is that the relationships a goer". I know I've been there.

 

[louise]

What i meant was there was more women asking YI what men feel about them, than men asking Yi about what women think of them.

 

[hitchhiker]

It's the same on an astrology board that I frequent. Mostly women wanting to unravel the arcane mystery of a man's mind. I think it may go back to basic communication styles - women tend to talk/share more, men tend to keep their problems to themselves (esp about relationships). The more women need answers from their men, the more the men retreat - at least from my own experience, and from reading others - so women look to other people to help them work out what the men won't/aren't telling them.

I'm not sure about this - but I don't think more women use the I Ching to ask about relationships than men. I think more women are willing to SHARE their results here than men. Hmm, maybe someone should do a survey.

My two cents

hh

And yes, the nickname was inspired by good ol' Douglas Adams.

 

[hitchhiker]

Oh and if anyone's interested in why "men read newspapers and watch the news and women actually talk to each other" (to quote Lindsay above), Deborah Tannen's book, You Just Don't Understand, provides some fascinating answers.

Basically Tannen says it comes down to different communication styles - IN GENERAL (I'm aware of the over-generalisation), men talk when there's information to be passed on, women talk to form personal associations. Hence men in groups tend to talk business or sports, women tend to share what looks like mundane details of everyday life, which allows them to form personal bonds with other women mostly. The trouble is when men and women try to use these different styles on each other and the signals are misread. Tannen gives the classic example which Lindsay has pointed out: at a breakfast table, the man picks up his paper and appears to ignore his wife, the wife sulks because she thinks her husband isn't interested in her. According to Tannen's research, the man does this precisely because he is comfortable being around her and doesn't see the need to ask her how she is, etc. He assumes she knows. She on the other hand takes the silence as absence of feeling or caring. The examples abound.

Anyway - uh - my point was ... oh yes, that women have a need to communicate their fears and anxieties. Or at least, they aren't afraid of sharing them. Men tend to prefer not to reveal that they are going to pieces simply because a woman has left them - it doesn't look, well, manly. Hence, so many message boards function like Agony Aunt's column for brokenhearted women. (myself included

)

Ok, I'm not plugging Tannen's book here - I had just been reading it and thought I'd share. I caught myself nodding in agreement many times while reading it. Anyway, thanks for letting me ramble.

hh

 

[lindsay]

Dear Louise,

Yes, I think you may be right about the women vs. men thing, but I?m not sure what to make of it. Last weekend I read in a newspaper that statistics show women are more likely to surf the Internet than men, and women spend a lot more personal time on the net than men. Actually, as I recall, there was quite a large disparity ? 10% or more. If this is true, then possibly websites like Clarity attract more women than men (if it does) simply because more women are on the net. And since men and women are always thinking about each other, more women means more questions about men.

Putting numbers aside, I wonder if I understand correctly what you are saying in your first post. Are you saying that if you find yourself in so much doubt about a relationship that you are continually asking the Yi about it, then the relationship is probably in big trouble? I suppose the assumption might be that a really strong relationship leaves one with a feeling of trust and certainty.

Actually don?t a lot of people use the Yi because they know their relationship is unraveling? Or not coming together in the right way? And aren?t they really looking for reassurance and advice rather than knowledge? ?Things seem to be falling apart, what can be done?? The Yi is a lot of things but it is definitely a great problem-solver.

So maybe people asking relationship questions come here simply because they need help and they know it.

Lindsay

 

[louise]

Lindsay, I have heard the theory that women consult diviners more because they feel in less control of their lives and seek reassurance. At least they may have felt less in control of their lives in the past,ie if a husband changed his job, she had to move with him. Some would also argue that womens lives are more intensley bound up with others, that they adapt more to the demands of others and that gives them a sense of being less in charge of their own destiny than men. They are just some ideas I've heard.

However that may be rubbish it may just be more women are diviners and seek divination because we are innately more intuitive, sensitive and altogether more perfect than men

You were right in your understanding of my first post. This is of course not to say there is anything wrong about asking relationship questions. Most important questions usually are about relationships of one sort or another.

Only there is this terrible female affliction called "waiting for him to call", "does he or does'nt he love me". My own experience has shown me that if the only source of reassurance I have is from the I Ching about whether a man likes me or not, I can be pretty sure I'm living in fantasy land and thats a waste of time. Radar loves no good - he should be here fixing my car or mending my washing machine - proving his love (chortle/joke).

Of course there are times in existing relationships when you need to consult to help you get your bearings. I was more referring to times when us women go off on a totally neurotic self deluded trip instead of facing a reality like - "he hasn't called me for a year, he's obviously not interested". My perception is men don't do this so much - or if they do they keep very quiet about it.

 

[hilary]

I do know exactly what Louise means. The question is, if you really want to know how he really feels, why aren't you asking him? But the answer isn't necessarily 'because I don't want to know' - it could be 'because he's from Mars, and I don't believe he knows himself, and if I ask him he'll probably run miles.'

Martians and Venusians online - I'd read that more women use the net for email and chatting, and of course shopping. You can guess what more men use it for.

Lindsay, have you noticed what a high proportion of good writers of detective stories are women? But they've classically opted for male detectives. Someone (else) should write a doctoral thesis about it all.

I'd have the feeling I was drifting hopelessly off topic, if it weren't for the rather brilliantly chosen title of this page

 

[lenardthefast]

Hi Lindsay, et al,

Lenard the Fast here again. I am finished with my move almost(still haven't found a place to live, but getting closer, I think). Lindsay, your musings have reminded me of a recent joke making the rounds. Seems this chap reads in the newspaper that it has been scientifically proven that women speak approximately twice as many words daily as men. He immediately becomes all excited, rushes into the kitchen to lord it over the wife, exclaiming "See, its just like I've always said, Dear, women do talk too much!" His wife says "Let me see that, dear." After perusing the article, the wife says "Well, of course, I agree with this, and its because we always have to say everything twice." The husband says "What?!".

Have fun, guys.

Namaste,
Leonard

 

[louise]

I can't sleep so I've come up with another theory about why women seek to know the minds of men far more than men seek to know the minds of women.
There is the theory that it has more to do with status and power than actual sex difference.

In any situation it is always more important for the lower status person to be able to anticipate the mood of the higher status person. This is because obviously the lower status person is subject to the whims and will of the higher status
one. For example at work it will be more important for you to note the mood of your boss than it is for him/her to notice yours. That is you need to keep him/her happy because they have the power to fire you or whatever. A slave is going to be far more sensitive to his masters facial expression and general demeanour than the master is to the slave.
It has been argued that as historically women have been of inferior status to men, and dependent on them, that women have developed a far greater sensitivity to subtle indicators of mood/feeling. I think some study somewhere has actually shown that women are far better at reading facial expressions than men.
The other hangover is of course that women are still geared up to always trying to read mens minds. If this theory holds then it should be the case that as equality increases women should generally be less and less concerned with the machinations of mens minds. This does not seem to be happening though - if you look at the cover of any womens mags, theres still articles like "Do you really know how he feels for you"

Totally off topic I know but I loathe books like Men are from Mars - they are purely descriptive, not at all analytical and more often than not simply support the existing status quo, ie ideas like 'you must not bother him when hes in his cave etc' - which amounts to yet again instructing women how to behave around men. Huh if hes in his cave he needn't think I'll be there when he comes out - huh huh huh...I hope to go to sleep now

 

[anita]

Hi Fellow Seekers,

What a fascinating dscussion! As for asking more about men than anything else, I can only say that I DO ask career questions too very often, and if there is some conflict or uncertainity there, I would share it with this group to get some more insights. As things are, at present, the only thing that's been unsettled is the future of my relationship with Him. However, now that is getting pretty much unravelled too. He should be back soon.

Hmmmm why do women ask more about relationships than men? Because they're deeper than men. They know that relationships are more important than status and power and indeed, once relationships are right, the other two follow.

Also they are not afraid to share and are capable of thinking from both sides of their brains at the same time. It's TRUE! Research ( I have been writing articles on women's issues for quite a while and have done a lot of looking around) shows that a man is unable to do this. Which explains why women are more balanced in their thinking. Hee hee.

Coming to think of that, most of the Senseis in my spiritual path are women. Very few men. They say this is the period of yin. And I believe it.

Best for your Quest

 

[binz]

Hi all,

on the questions "why don't men ask questions?" "why are most diviners women?". Well 1st, they're the same question pretty much.
My understanding is that men don't have problems with questions - it's answers that men don't like!

So they will ask questions of others, but not of themselves. (e.g. are happy to ask "why did you do that?" but would not HONESTLY ask "why did I do that?" and are even less likely to take notice of the true answer if it were offered). And generally divination questions/answers are finding things out about yourself.

In most of our societies, men are 'conditioned' (by schools, parents, media, etc) that it is their role to be strong and supportive, to solve lifes problems by themselves and show no weakness, and they are put down if they show that they do not know things. So generally men will avoid admitting that there is something they don't know or can't handle, and the easiest way to avoid this is not to ask.

This has produced some bold male leaders - and has often also led to their downfalls.

It is very difficult for some men to admit that they are not what society expected. And even more difficult for them to make the change to become who they truly are, instead of playing out the role imposed on them. (I know this from experience)

Saying one sex is deeper than the other is a gross overgeneralisation. I don't agree that men are not as deep as women (I could give many examples of shallow women - and men), and I don't want this discussion to go down a battle of the sexes road. Yes there are differences (yipee, wahoo, etc). But when it comes to apparent depth, I think it is that men are often afraid to look into their depths.

Cheers

Binz
(who, after many years of societal conditioning, is learning to be a person, not a sexual steriotype)


PS a quote from Pink Floyd
" I was just a child then, now I'm only a man."

 

[louise]

I agree with you totally there Binz. Men do seem to be less self reflective than women - but in no way can this mean women are 'deeper' than men.
Anita, power and status permeate any relationship whether we like it or not, or so I've read in sexual politics books etc.

But hey - its just occured to me, we all think we're getting way off topic discussing gender issues, but maybe we've hit the nail on the head.
Maybe the meaning of life is finding the perfect balance between yin and yang, male and female. Thats what the Yi's all about isn't it, the interplay of male and female energies, constantly striving for union, creation being the result of that union. We struggle for harmony between yin and yang not only in our relationships but also within ourselves.

There, so I propose the meaning of life is to bring into unity the forces of yin and yang - unless of course its 42.

 

[lindsay]

I think Binz has got it right about the question/answer issue. There have been times when I?ve really dreaded asking the Yi about a problem. I did not want to know the answer because I was afraid I would not be able to deal with it, that fixing the problem would be beyond my abilities. There are times when you know you cannot be, maybe never can be, the ?superior man?. Sometimes nothing is harder than to fall short of expectations, your own or other people?s.

Louise, have you ever considered taking up a martial art? It might do you good to toss a 200-lb man to the mat or bang around with weapons once a week. Of course it takes a while to learn to fly over rooftops . . .

Lindsay

 

[louise]

How heavy are you ??

 

[willow]

hee hee!

One thing that's interesting to me is how from time to time people get confused about the genders of the posters here. It happened a lot last spring with Candid and Dharma, as I recall -- as a matter of fact I got both their genders wrong myself, until they were revealed in discussion.

 

[louise]

Well Willow I've always thought you were female, and because of your name, slender, delicate and ethereal. I think I am getting my imagery from those flower fairy books. I was therefore quite shocked to hear of you digging in the other thread (omens) - seems a far too brutal an activity for someone called Willow. For all I know though you could be a huge big hulk of a man.
Loads of people, including myself assumed Dharma to be a man - it is funny isn't it. I wonder if it makes a difference to how we respond to posts according to whether we think we're replying to a man or woman ?

 

[gene]

Hi everyone.

I was a little curious about the reflection that men are less self-reflective than women. On the surface it would seem to me it is the other way around. However, I don't believe that is true either. The difference is the way we go about it. Much trouble is often caused between men and women because when women have a problem, they just want to talk it out, without being offered solutions, etc. However, when men have a problem, they don't want to talk about it at all. They want to go to the den, close themselves in, and just meditate on it. Talking just breaks their concentration and makes them irritable. Not talking is the yang way. Talking is the yin way, and yes, the whole underlying theme of the I Ching is to balance out the yin and the yang. However, we must do it in the right way. The martial arts were mentioned in this post. Having studied Tai Chi Chuan for around 19 years now, I have learned that a lot of the exercises are geared for just that, balancing yin and yang. But there is time for yin and time for yang. They both have their place. The Tai Chi form is constantly switching from yin positions to yang positions, and back. The first two hexagrams give examples of the purest yang and the purest yin, and the following 62 hexagrams all have a portion of one and a portion of the other. The lines of hexagram one give a hint on how to interpret the corresponding yang lines of the following hexagrams, and the lines of hexagram two give a hint as to how to interpret the yin lines of the following hexagrams.

I do believe we respond differently according to our perceptions of whether someone is male or female, there are different social rules that apply to male than there are to female. I won't say anything more than that right now, except that a lot of those rules are unconsciously followed and not always in our immediate awareness.

Gene

 

[gene]

Just another thought. As I read through this, I saw something that stated most sensei are women? I study and do some teaching of Tai Chi Chuan, a martial art, and I teach both men and women. However, when it comes to higher level spiritual discipline, that methods that work with men just do not work with women. It seems that women need to learn from women, and men with men. For one thing, men respond to anger. If you are angry with them, or act like you are, which is more likely the case, they will think about the anger, and respond to it, trying harder. Coaches of football teams and baseball teams know this principle very well, and are constantly screaming at the men for their "lousy" performance. Women just do not respond to that, their feelings are hurt, and they don't understand the meaning behind it. They respond much better by understanding where they relate with team members, and understanding how they fit into the scheme of things. Not only are men from mars, but mars rule aries, the me first sign. Not only are women from Venus, but venus rules Libra, the relationship sign.

Gene

 

[gene]

One more little thought, then I will shut up. In response to women being more concerned about relationships than status and power. The irony is that every man knows that if he does not have at least some social status and power, his chances of finding a women with any class is greatly diminished. This forces them to think about career and status and power in order to have relationships. I realize there are exceptions to this, but as a general rule, money rules, men without it get nowhere in finding a relationship. To relate this to the I Ching, hexagram 4, line 3 says take not a maiden who, when she sees a man of possession and power, losses control of herself. Madonna sang, "I am a material woman, and this is a material world." Someday maybe the world will return to a path of spirituality.

Gene

 

[hilary]

Ah, but Gene, if you Martians don't bring in great quantities of buffalo, what are the Venusians' offspring going to eat? I somehow doubt that this preoccupation is a modern development.

Welcome to the ICC, by the way, it's very good to have you here!

 

[gene]

Hi Hilary

I agree. A steady income of buffalo is absolutely essential in this day and age. I guess I am going to have to do an in depth study of hexagram 14 and 55 and figure out how to augment my wealth significantly.

BTW, Louise, I weigh exactly 200 pounds, so if you are still looking for that man to throw around, ha ha.

Gene

 

[cassandra]

Gene,

Thanks for your reponse to my post on Hex 8. It directly relates to the topic now being discussed. The person in question on the Hex 8 question does not quite have the hunting gathering skills that I would like and am used to. This is a constant inner conflict for me and has caused problems in the relationship. It all goes back to Candid's bird jumping up and down on the nest. It must be hardwired in us. Can't shake it