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Washing coins in salt water or vinegar

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butterfly spider

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When I was 18 I was given my I Ching book by my friend Paul who gave all his possessions away - he travelled the world with one small bag buying things he needed and then giving them away when not. He lived in Burma and China and many long University evenings were spent putting the world to rights and feeling and negotiating our path in life. He got into Astrology and went to Australia to live in the Outback. He is still there counting stars. However his book is still with me. At our halls of residence - which was a postgrad international hall were friends who were very familiar with the I Ching. At the time some of the communist party grey suited individuals had come to do economics - but one had not been able to practice legally for fear of what might happen - I am not into politics so am not sure why. It was 1974. Anyway. I was told on good authority that when casting for someone new - or even if the question changed you should wash the coins in salt water. It was recommended that each new year (Chinese) you wash the coins in vinegar or rice vinegar

Has anyone heard if this. I have always been told that a new reading using 'instruments' tarot tea leaves should start with a cleanse and be given reverence. Wing Wi the friend said that you wouldn't dream of going up to a stranger and talking without introducing yourself or saying hello

I only thought of this whilst looking through my old diaries - of 1974. I also have this dilemma of over casting. I usually don't but it is so helpful ATM. Like eating another square of chocolate - it's very tempting

Just a thought
Xx:rofl:
 

Trojina

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Anyway. I was told on good authority that when casting for someone new - or even if the question changed you should wash the coins in salt water. It was recommended that each new year (Chinese) you wash the coins in vinegar or rice vinegar

There is no need wash coins in salt water unless doing ritual makes you feel better or more 'connected' in some way. There is no 'authority' on this, it is up to the individual. You will get answers whether you follow some ritual or not.




Wing Wi the friend said that you wouldn't dream of going up to a stranger and talking without introducing yourself or saying hello

Eh ? Everyone talks to strangers all the time without introducing themselves. On the street, in shops, in cafes, in the park, in waiting rooms...surely one just chats to people wherever one finds them with no need for formal introductions. At least they do where I come from. I often enjoy chatting to people I don't know, don't you ? I don't somehow think the I Ching won't to talk to us unless we wash our coins. At least I've never washed mine...and I use any that happen to be in my purse, and the I Ching has still been answering me for all these years
 

pocossin

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Clean coins are nice. I usually select new ones.
 
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butterfly spider

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Mmmm. I have 3 x 2penced that I use although I originally had 3 Chinese coins with holes that U list if of so I now use 3 of my own. I sometimes just find coins if I am away. I find the copper coins (well they are not copper) but tens to use my same three.

Today I soaked them in vinegar and they look a honey and new - I don't think that it makes Amy difference hit perhaps its like polishing nails or having your hair done before an important event. It makes no difference just puts you in a state if mind ti focus on what you are doing ...

Thank you both of you - just wondered

Xx
 
S

sooo

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I have Chinese ritual coins that an old friend once gave to me. They're thin from wear and so covered with a green patina that it takes a long time to complete a reading, having to look very close to be sure which side is which. I rarely use them; they sit in a hexagon rosewood and brass container in plain view. They remind me of a special friendship. I wouldn't dream of washing them in anything. But for practical use, I use a particular virtual binary program. Almost no room for user error. I suppose it's the same logic for using honey and new coins. Each reading new, not carry old mental vibrations into the future.

My grandmother read tea leaves, and she wouldn't think of using old or previously used leaves, nor would she divine for her question using someone else's tea or cup. The tea she drank was what made her tea leaves fall to the bottom of her cup in a certain way. It was to her an essential aspect of her reading.

If you are divining, you must divine in a way you trust.
 
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butterfly spider

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Tea leaves

Yes I know about tea leaves. My nanny and grandad lived in the east end in a terrace with Mrs Young - she read tea leaves. She was very good and people used to come from miles to see her. It wasn't the tea leaves at all I think - just her. The tea leaves were her guide.

I think that anything that helps put you in a good frame of mind is helpful although she was so specific about her tea readings - and anything else. She said that you should never do a reading without someone's permission and that she needed a clean cup to work with. She was also into ouija boards - I thought these were scarey as a 5/6 year old. She would only do this do friends or family as she said that there were a lit of elves out there and monkey spirits trying to mess things up. My grandmother said that if you told a lie a fairy would die and that if you lied about being ill the fairies would punish you by making you really ill. I am never ill.....nor are my children..... At least not physically!!!

I think it is a question of using the energies we have and not using up the goodwill of souls - living or otherwise. Having minor rituals to focus the thoughts is fine within limits. Washing coins wrapping books in silk etc are all minor rituals .... And have a basis in history. Even the Church of England has rituals.

My first question was that washing of coins prior to a new reading - is this usual -
I don't know and it probably doesn't matter

Xx
 
S

sooo

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No, it doesn't matter. Rituals are for the benefit of the one performing them and the ones who lend their faith to their importance.

May I suggest, however, that you use caution in implying that ones thoughts and/or words about illness can attract that illness to you. If you are a man, that can get you castrated here. The mores here are more tolerant of women, but they are not immune to being rebuked for such beliefs.

Personally, I have found that my statements regarding faith healing or my healing at all are almost certain to attract the very same illness symptoms back to me. As someone is alleged to have said upon a sick woman being healed by touching the hem of his garment: “Someone has touched me, for I know that power has gone out from me," and he was crucified. Better, I think, to keep some things private, or shared with one who shares your faith, lest others knowingly or unknowingly cast a spell upon you.
 
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butterfly spider

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Folk lore and stories - even children's ones that we tell to very young children are steeped in fairies elves and mischievous imps. Many are based on the notion that if you don't behave as you are meant to then ill luck will befall you. Many of the Confucious ideals were embedded in stories - many were to do with morals and ill luck on the evil. Ill thoughts and ill will manifest in various guises - and stories of creation and rebirth use accessible stories around the globe

Of course the stories banded around of evil women casting spells and causing ill luck have no more truth than the notion that by washing coins in vinegar will aid your divination of the I Ching. I do think however that we can create our own energies that either help or hinder our life. We can probably trick ourselves into being well or unwell just by our thoughts. - I am no expert but happy thoughts and positive thinking are good healers IMO.

It could also work in reverse - telling people you are down feeling unwell or even lying to work or a child's school - when you/they are not - is not a good idea. It is not healthy in itself. It is just not a good idea.

Xx
 
S

sooo

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I don't know the truth of elves, spirits of the dead, ouija boards and such things, but I do know the power of the mind is as deep as a well and as tall as a tower, whether wicked or benevolent, whether self-imposed or imposed upon another. To say I believe in this but not in that, how can one know these things? Belief, faith is what we have to go on. Are the Yijing's answers actual, or do we find in them what we filter out based on our will to know? The latter has been endlessly argued, though the great majority of believers find the oracle's answers to be too accurate to merely be seeing what we want to see or fear to see.

At any rate, I was only attempting to spare you an unpleasant confrontation regarding the mind controlling ones illness, with my cautionary advice. Of course you will do what you think best, as well we all should. Don't shoot the messenger.
 
S

sooo

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Of course the stories banded around of evil women casting spells and causing ill luck have no more truth than the notion that by washing coins in vinegar will aid your divination of the I Ching. and then you say telling someone they fell down is not a good idea.
It could also work in reverse - telling people you are down feeling unwell or even lying to work or a child's school - when you/they are not - is not a good idea. It is not healthy in itself. It is just not a good idea.

Xx

So then, which of these "truths" are true? First you say that spells are untrue, but then you say telling someone they are down and feeling unwell is not a good idea. Is the latter not a form of spell?

My brother used to constantly tell me I had lots of angst. The fact was that his own desperate angst was always repressed, and the form it took was projected onto me. But I'd be lying to say I didn't find his taunting irritating, and resulting in having angst over it. This agrees with what you've said, and what I said about casting spells, as well. Knowing or unknowingly. Meanwhile and after some time, he's taking two anti-depressant medications due to his angst. The mind is a powerful dragon.
 
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butterfly spider

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Thank you for the thoughts - like Father Christmas all things can be made to feel real and the power of the mind to manifest the unreal is endless. That is why children love fairy stories (and grown-ups). I know that the I Ching works in a way that I do not comprehend but that does not mean I cannot access it. I know that there are certain things that I cannot understand - but that does not mean I ignore them.

I think that if you believe in something wholeheartedly there is an energy that can be very powerful - and in the same way that various groups of people have been treated over the Centuries - there is a fear of this energy - think of the persecution of women in the inquisition. It was fear. This is not so far removed from the fear that Baba Yaga or whoever will punish you if you are naughty or that the poor fairy folk will die if you tell a lie. When I visited my fathers mother she had a cellar with a spider called old nick. She used to tell me stories about him. I really like spiders but oh how I hate going down into cellars. There is no reason other than fear for this. If I tell myself I have a really bad cold it will be a bad cold but if I say it's a mere skiffle it will be. In fact I can tell myself whatever I like. The more I believe something and the more energy I put into the intention - I think the greater the energy and the greater the chance if it happening.

Anyway I am reading some poetry by Seamus Heaney and it is taxing the few grey cells left.
A poem called The Rattle Bag (translated from Welsh) talks of imps....

X
 
S

sooo

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I learned arachnophobia from my mother. It used to make my father so mad, he'd yell at her and say, "your going to make them (sons) fear spiders the way you do!" Living in the desert I've had to evict my share of spiders, since an old Crow Indian told me not to kill them. I still did if they were in the house and very large. Since I've moved into this house about a year ago, very few spiders have shown up. I have no pictures on the walls, no wall hangings of any kind, and against the white they will show up plainly. I strongly believe that by thinking about them, they will show up. Yesterday I was thinking of them in a sort of sacred way, thinking about what the old Crow told me, and I said to the spider, it's ok, you can come out, I will not harm you. I felt a bit silly but it's not unusual for me to be silly. This morning when I came out of the shower, a spotted spider was trying to hide inconspicuously in the edge between the wall and ceiling. I gently pushed it with a broom until it fell down into a basket I placed beneath it. I finished dressing, then went outside and released it.

The question remains: did my energy manifest the spider or make it feel safe to expose itself, or was my consciousness raised so that I was more attentive to seeing one, even to the point of expecting to see one? It's dream-like, eerie, but I believe I somehow manifest that spider today. Of course I have no way of proving anything one way or another, but it was interesting, like an affirmation of some kind.
 
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butterfly spider

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I was visiting the doctor with my son about a break. We hardly ever visit the surgery (he last went in 2002). When we arrived the receptionist and 2 doctors were outside in the street flailing around looking very anxious
There was a wolf spider just behind the door

I casually walked in picked it up in my hands poor thing and took it to the bins at the back

Oh arnt you brave thank you .... My son at 13 thought it was hilarious. But the legacy if old mick. All the fears and angst about spiders had manifest. Serious professional people had actually been really scared of a small harmless creature. Had they been an aphid fine but they could have crushed it with one step. I was bitten by a tarantualla in southern Spain in 1977. On a field trip. I started to swell badly and went to hospital. An Old man there told me that if I felt for the poor spider I would feel compassion and the bite would be less painful. It wasn't and it hurt but I was OK. I don't mind spiders but hate snakes and anything wiggly like tadpoles. Why - I have absolutely no idea. I will tackle anything - just tadpoles freak me out. A friend of mine hates worms - I like them and rescue as many as I can. Why is this - they ate wiggly and like snakes but oh so beautifully harmless.

Horses scare me in that I always think they knows re than me. Cats I tolerate but they will always come and sit on my lap - almost to the point of defiance. Dogs I live and I love them.
I was born in the year if the dog .... My mother was a snake. ... I like rats. And keep several so does my son. They play with the dogs and nibble their eats. ......

Funny old world
 
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butterfly spider

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Ears Not ears my phone does strange things
Rats nibble ears - they are lovely creatures and oh so clever. We has a cat who loved rats. They used to sit and sleep on their backs. We had a dog once who lived with our hamsters in his kennel. He used to round them up and looked after them. We called him bones. Poor old bones. He only ever growled at one person - and his perception was spot on. He was jailed for 7 years for child abuse. Perhaps we should listen to souls like bones.

He loved our neighbour John who was the dearest sweetest man ever - bones was the one who told us he had died in the night. - he kept circling for about an hour by the door. Everyone thought bones was a bit toop (stupid in welsh) but perhaps he wasn't. When he was 18 he had a spinal stroke and when we were undecided what to do he almost spoke to us - poor old bones

Animals are not muddled by rubbish - of what one should or should not do. They have no parrot sitting in their shoulder whispering shoulds or fears. We have had a goldfish for 37 years that has swum round and round in its bowl since it was given to me by a friend to look after. Poor thing swims around and around flipping its tail when I enter the room It has survived the cat getting out the bowl my daughter deliberately knocking the bowl over with shards if glass. My friend not feeding it for 2 weeks whilst I was away and my daughters friend using the bowl as an ash tray. It is the same fish it has survived - how heavens only knows.y daughter now has 3 cats - they sit and way h the fish but dare not go near

My friend keeps a python - I really cannot think of anything more repulsive but last week I visited and stroked it on the head (it had just eaten some defrosted mice). It felt like stroking a demon... So can understand the spider situation....

Xxx
 
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butterfly spider

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My friend Guss has a reptile called jaws. It is a rescue lizard of some kind with green frills. It is really angry most of the time. Guss loves Jaws and sleeps with him. Apparantly it can bite your hand off .... Guss finds it hilarious that both of them are considered highly dangerous!!!
 
S

sooo

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Thanks for sharing your experiences, butterfly spider. Most entertaining.

There was a particular type of wolf spider in my old house, also tried hiding against the ceiling and wall. Other than the occasional tarantula, which here are considered quite harmless, unless they're taunted by a dog or like animal, at which time they rub the hair off their back with their hind legs, which are extremely irritating to the eyes of its taunter, this particular sub-species of wolf spider was the largest I'd ever seen. I knocked it down with a broom with the intention of releasing it outside, but it ran so quickly, my instinct was to swat and kill it. He or she was about 4" across, leg to leg. I've had others, one big one that my son's friend went to pickup to bring outside when she drop dozens of her babies onto the kitchen floor, and I didn't want them to infect the house, so stomped as many as I could before they found cover to hide and grow in. I figure territorial rites apply. I don't try to live in their webs.

I recently watched a youtube video where a wolf spider and a poisonous brown recluse were put into the same clear container to see which would win. The wolf killed and ate the brown recluse in short order, which to a human is quite surprising.

Snakes don't bother me unless they're poisonous. Here, various rattlesnakes are out and about in summer in abundance. Have to watch for them while walking or riding horses. The worst is the Mohave Green, as it has both venom and neuro-toxins, and they are extremely aggressive, will actually chase after you. We never walk outside at night without a bright flashlight to see where we step. A friend got bitten on her ankle when she stepped out her door first thing in the morning. She was immediately hospitalized, and still has not regained full use of certain body parts. We just except them as part of living here. No one here fears tarantulas. They are called the gentle giants. I'm quite surprised that your experience was so serious. Maybe in Spain they have different kinds than here.

I was stung 6 times by three poisonous bark scorpions while sleeping. That was an interesting experience.

I too love animals, and especially dogs, so long as their owners bring them up well. Some breeds are more prone to misbehavior than others, and they require special attention; not to be confused with spoiling them.

I am more cautious of humans.
 

pocossin

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This talk of spiders has done me good. In my house, spiders frequent the toe spaces of cabinets. I had not cleaned the spiders out this winter. Hidden up under the toe spaces, they cannot be seen, and vacuuming and moping does not get them. I have a special brush with a 4-foot handle that I use just to clean the top of the toe space. It is amazing how much spiders build in these hidden spaces. I've no idea how they find enough food to make the silks.
 
S

sooo

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This talk of spiders has done me good. In my house, spiders frequent the toe spaces of cabinets. I had not cleaned the spiders out this winter. Hidden up under the toe spaces, they cannot be seen, and vacuuming and moping does not get them. I have a special brush with a 4-foot handle that I use just to clean the top of the toe space. It is amazing how much spiders build in these hidden spaces. I've no idea how they find enough food to make the silks.

I bought a new amp recently, and was checking it out thoroughly. There's a small opening through which a very small screw driver is inserted to adjust the bias of the vacuum tubes. I noticed a bit of web traces in the cab and thought nothing of it, but when I blindly reached up behind the chassis, I put my hand right into a web. Creepy feeling. I had to remove the chassis anyway to replace a speaker and so got a good look at what was up there, and swept out the web while it was exposed. However, I did not remove the panel which would expose "the guts" of the amp, the circuit. That spider, assuming he or she is inside there, had better be careful, as those big capacitors hold enough charge to kill a person. Thing is, the spider would have to have one leg to ground with another on the positive end of the capacitor (yin and yang); very unlikely. I hope it likes my playing; maybe it will add a little mojo to the sound.

Gordo-8-panel-Sunday-strip-for-October-1-by-Mai-Wurd-by-Gus-Arriola.jpg
 

pocossin

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You have a fellow musician in you amp.

Spider webs are used like harps, with spiders plucking at the strings to produce different frequencies of movement. . . When spider webs are used like harps, spiders are sensing the relative frequencies produced by plucking and the subsequent movements in the spider web. It must sound like glorious music to them to “hear” the web move such that they know they have captured a fly or found a mate.
http://guardianlv.com/2014/06/spider-webs-used-like-harps/
 
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butterfly spider

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My children are musicians and my eldest daughter a cellist was playing tarantella - very fast piece. Her teacher (a very well-known violin teacher) had wonderful terminology for children and used phrases games and words to learn rythmns that caused difficulty. Children would then dance or walk this round the room.

Triplet is difficult in square or 4-4 time especially followed by repeating quavers or quarter notes. So in this fast dance 6 quavers followed by a triplet caused difficulty

So it was:-
spider spider spider butterfly spider spider spider
Followed by lots of butterfly's.

Easy. - dancing round the room and singing this is still in my head. It is used in other pieces too
I can see my daughter dancing this and singing getting faster and faster.

The same theme was used by John Hedgley in his rendition of Do you remember an inn Miranda - he used the triplet idea to read the repeated phrases

I was probably bitten by a black widow spider not a tarantula because the bite was very severe - but because I didn't actually catch it it might have been either. It sounds better as a tarantula - it goes better with the butterfly's

Xx
 
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butterfly spider

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John hegley not hedgley. He is a poet who wears glasses and likes dogs
He is into armadillos and Luton
Xx
 
S

sooo

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As a child, the highlight of every extended Italian family celebration was when the matriarchal and patriarch (my grandparents) would dance the tarantella. It was one of the only times I've seen my normally somber grandmother smile and laugh (a woman who was depressed and frustrated from the subordinate lifestyle would fall into a trance that could only be cured by music and dance. This normally lasted three days and during that time the tarantata (the woman bitten by the tarantula) would be the center of attention, which in turn would cure them of their frustrations and depressions.) This strikes me as funny since our original Italian/American family was predominantly matriarchal, at lease outwardly.

We've wandered far from divination discussion, I think, unless one considers the oracle of spiders, snakes, butterflies, music, dance and fate; oh, and ceremonial coin washing.

[video=youtube;W3uJCwXPj9I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=W3uJCwXPj9I#t=223[/video]
 
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butterfly spider

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Dancing (the tarantella) whirling dervishes, chasing unicorns, or indeed coin washing are all a form of connecting or preparing and for many It is probably useful to put one in a state of mind to focus on the task at hand. - and animals also perform them - probably more than we can see or understand. Whatever helps an individual on their path I think.

What is particularly nice about this site and this particular thread of it is that we can explore this divination and out thoughts - and get feedback from across the Globe. It is a very heartening form of connectivity and companionship.

There is a poem I read about a Music Concert - but the sounds were of spiders birds and butterfly wings
Will try and find it

Xx
 
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butterfly spider

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Couldn't find the poem I wanted but reading a new anthology just now came across this by Theodore Roethke
From the lost son

Sat in an empty house
Watching shadows crawl,
Scratching.
There was one fly.

Voice, come out of the silence.
Say something.
Appear in the form of a spider
Or a moth beating the curtain.

Tell me:
Which is the way I take;
Out of what door do I go,
Where and to whom?

Xx
.
 
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butterfly spider

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Thank you everyone for your replies on washing coins...
 
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