When a baby is born

[mollies]

Thinking of coincidence, I had (have) a question about the meaning of how we are born. And in particular the position of the baby’s body.

Baby’s are born on a certain time, at a certain place, in certain circomstances, have such and such parents, etc. These are influences of the moment. The child also has something of his own, it is that which makes the difference between brothers and sisters and everybody. That piece, the self, is much more difficult to trace back, if you should feel any need to do that, because it is about the moment BEFORE. The moment of the decision, to come down to earth. (Hope you understand what I mean)

So here comes my point:

is it possible, that already the position of the baby at the moment of birth, can tell us something about the ‘intention’, in which this human being will live his or her life? How shall I name it, drive, intention?

I myself do feel, that there must have been an intention in us, in our ‘self'. But I also feel that most of us forget about it, once we’re here and lived a while.
And so I think, that the position of the baby is not just a coincidence.
On the internet I found some pictures, and I thought I would show them here, so that you can imagine a little better what I mean.

I asked the I Ching: What can the position of a baby being born tell us about him/her?

And I got Hex 47>3
becoming Hex 28

Now I am interested in your view on this.
And I can also tell you how it continued.

I asked another question. This has to do with my own birth-situation many many years ago. I was born “face” first, and this was ofcourse very painful for my mother and me. And I cannot help thinking, that this tells something about me, my energy, my struggles and how I stand in life.

The question I asked the second time, was: ”What did this mean to me, personally?”

And I got Hex. 18

Ofcourse that gave me thoughts……and a kind of shock too.
And I DO like to know if anyone has interesting thoughts about this answer.

Thank you for reading this.

Carin

 

[jesed]

Hi Carin

Just in case the comment could be useful

In traditional teachings, our spirit choses the time of conception and the time of birth.
The time of conception influences the way we act in our inner experiences, specially is macrocosmical and spiritual issues
The time of birth influences the way we act in our external experiences, specially in microcosmical and day-by-day issues

From there, you can trace your Macrocosmical House (In the 8 Palaces system) and your Microcosmical House.

From there you can derivate your Own Nature (Individual Tao) and your rol in the world.

Best wishes

 

[izhar]

The position of a baby being born

Dear Carin

Kan (the Abysmal, Danger) symbolize the water, the liquid in which the baby is floating in the womb during the time of pregnancy. And the Danger situation in which the baby can be during that time.

Tui (The Joyous, Pleasure) symbolize the outside (the upper trigram). I believe it is speaking about the mother of that baby. The mother as personal and the mother which contain the baby. Most of the time the baby will fill Pleasure and secure but in time of danger, most of the time during labor, the pleasure change to stress. Tui is also for the opening which the baby is supposed to get out (genitalia or the side of the lower abdomen (Kan) in a Caesarean Section).

The hexagram 47 – Oppression (Exhaustion) symbolize the hard time the baby is in. The distress can be perceived by the baby as life / death situation (is it going to influence the baby in the future?). The womb that gave him life and was pleasant is going to become tomb. The trauma, at birth, can develop to love / hate relationship (What kind of relationship will the baby develop with his mother?).

47.3 – Six in the third place means:
" A Man permits himself to be oppressed by stone, and leans on thorns and thistles." – I believe that this part of the line is describing the labor time.
" He (the baby) enters his home and does not see his wife (mother) – Misfortune."

The mother of the baby, who had suffered a lot during that labor, will probably need to take time for herself for recovery. Time which the baby will fill her absent, especially after the trauma the baby had suffered. Is that can be the ground for the abandonment feeling that the baby may develop in the future?).

The Nuclear Trigrams of 47 are leading us to Hexagram 37 – The Family. This symbolizes the importance of the family in this situation. A good and supporting family could help the mother and reduce the damage that can be developing in the baby. But we have to remember that the baby has his/her fate, strength. Will the baby be able to cope with his trauma in a way that will give strength to him/her, or not?

If the Damage will come to a point of Getting over (Hexagram 28 – the new Hexagram) "the breaking point – Misfortune".

Tui (Metal) Exhausts Kan (water) = Misfortune.

The picture of Sun (Hex' 28) reminding the crotch area, Tui – mouth and Kan cavity (ear or mouth). We don't find a picture of the head!

yours, Izhar.:bows:

 

[heylise]

Tried to post, with pictures, but they refuse to upload. No idea if that is just now, or all the time lately?
Without them, my post makes no sense, so I will try again later, or else forget it.
LiSe

 

[mollies]

From there, you can trace your Macrocosmical House (In the 8 Palaces system) and your Microcosmical House.

From there you can derivate your Own Nature (Individual Tao) and your rol in the world.

Thank you Jesed, I find it interesting.The 8 palaces system is unknown to me. Where does it come from?

 

[mollies]

get rid of them

This all makes very much sense to me. It goes deep down inside, and really seems to hit something there. Since I am that baby and that mother is my mother. It appears that such trauma's can last a whole life.....

My second question was about what it meant to me personally, but it seems that the FIRST question already was concerning me (ofcourse, what else could it have been)

Thanks for explaining so carefully.

Carin


PS 1:And I am still interested in anybody's idea about Hex 18.:"
The question I asked the second time, was: ”What did this mean to me, personally?”
But maybe it was superfluous, to ask a second time. Still, it struck me, that the answer should be exactly this one.

I looked it up on LiSe's site, (the Yi really talks to you there) where it says:
" Everybody has alien influences embedded in his soul. Many are hidden; one does not even know they exist. It seems as if they are part of the personality. Especially those one collected in childhood.
In order to live one’s own life and one’s own fate, one has to get rid of them. The more one succeeds, the more happiness, strength and health will come back.
Every influence makes a distance between one’s mind and God, or however one calls the inner essential being. Really reaching God is very difficult – except when one does reach Him, and then it turns out to be the easiest thing in the world. You wonder why you did not know it was – it is because the distance is made of thinking, but to reach Him is made of being."

The sentence:".....one has to get rid of them" keeps asking for more.
Maybe I could ask now HOW I can get rid of them?

Hi LiSe
No, I won't forget about it! We will try again!

C

 

[lightofreason]

The sentence:".....one has to get rid of them" keeps asking for more.
Maybe I could ask now HOW I can get rid of them?

see the thread "Projection and Transference (part 1)"

http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?t=3404

THe issue with most of this stuff is it is often 'accidental' transference of an emotion with no history attached. Talk helps in that it take a bit of detective work to flesh things out. If this is not possible then links to others with similar experiences can help - add to that a touch of imagination! ;-)

Drugs etc aid for extreme situations but they dont remove the issue, or more so dont 'discharge' it through linking to some history.

We have such notions as "state specific memories" that mean you have to be in the same state when you originally experienced them to get details etc These can cause 'damage' under certain conditions in that the vague state can elicit the emotion but no details appear until in the precise state. Neurosis can develop (situation neuroses are all like this and require a change of context to deal with them quickly OR flsh out the details etc through talk)

Since the metabolic rate og children is higher than than of adults so their experiences can be 'forgotten' as they age other than some 'vibe' that can be made to resonate in a context and our consciousness tries to figure out what the hell is going on!! ;-)

chris.