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Which (if any) hexagrams do you instinctively dislike?

picklebop

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I'm very curious about this! I know that one isn't supposed to have favourites, as all the hexagramas are necessary and components of the universe. I was curious to see if we could challenge each other to see beyond the immediate dislikes that can block our interpretations.

I keep getting interminable Armies 7. I know it makes sense in the organisational context, as I'm a bit chaotic, but I hate the military connotations and elements of detachment, and instinctively react against it. It seems to come up a lot in emotive readings and I tend to interpret it as coldness or disengagement. I'd like to make more use of it but I subconsciously close down and get irritable as soon as it comes up. Does anyone love this hexagram? I am interested to see how much I get it, usually as the final unchanging hexagram. Evidently I need to incorporate it somehow but it always feels like exactly the wrong answer. Though I'm very rude to ignore the replier when I ask a question!

I also dislike 22, Grace. I think it is because I read one interpretation that read it as shallow, surface 'niceness', ineffectual and ultimately meaningless. It also hints at a type of acceptance that I am not very good at. I do know there are positive aspects to it (I'm a Libran and horoscopes tend to extol it as an Air sign virtue) :LOL: That is one reason I tend to interpreter-hop, as I prefer now to have a few perspectives. Grace was one of the earlier ones I encountered and the prejudice alas has stuck fast. It usually turns up when I'm cross about a result and want to change it.

I like 8, Union, but find it very frustrating to interpret as it's often very ambiguous in context. The De Korne interpretation is particularly difficult as it implies it could equally be integration within the self. A lot of his summaries incline that way, which is simultaneously brilliant, but potentially over-insular as any reading could potentially just refer to the self.
 

dfreed

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Which (if any) hexagrams do you instinctively dislike? .... as all the hexagrams are necessary .... I was curious to see if we could challenge each other to see beyond the immediate dislikes that can block our interpretations.

The (perhaps related) idea of "negative" hexagrams (or lines, or trigrams, etc.) comes up quite often here. If you haven't seen it already, I suggest you take a look at Bradford Hatcher's pinned thread, above, about "Positive and Negative Hexagrams", in which he says:
"It's my thesis that as long as someone is locked into thinking of any Gua as inherently positive or negative they will NEVER understand the Yijing."

I think that sometimes our 'intuition' or our first impressions might be overrated, incomplete, or off a bit (especially regarding oracles or about our own situations!); and this is one reason we may have oracles in the first place! :unsure: So, I suggest we may want - or need - to dig a bit deeper than our first, initial gut reactions to the Hexagrams' names, etc.

One way we can do this: with Hex, 7 (and all the hexagrams) different authors and interpreters give it a range of names, titles, or 'handle's':
The Militia - Hatcher​
Organizing Onself - Javary​
Many Forms Within One - Richmond​
Organized Action - Needham ....​

Right away, we are able to see Hex. 7 from different perspectives, many of which are not about our modern ideas about a modern Army (and some of these names we may resonate with, some not so much). Bradford Hatcher's Yijing Hexagram Names and Core Meanings is a good resource for exploring these.


*******************************
There is also the Judgement, Hex. 7's words (and it's different translations and interpretations):
Omen of good fortune for an older man. No harm will come.
.... OR ....​
Persistence. A mature person's good fortune.

For both of these (and for many other hexagrams - and their various translations), if we were blindfolded and only heard the words - so we didn't know these are from a hexagram that some call THE ARMY - I think we'd have a generally favorable response: good fortune, no harm ....

Interestingly, (and conversely) in another thread here, Hilary discusses one of the lines of Hex. 54, "The Marrying Maiden", "Little Sister's Marriage", "The Young Bride", etc. The hexagram's title itself feels very positive to me - a young daughter getting married - but the actual text (and the related meanings) of Hex. 54's judgement don't sound very positive - or more precisely, it doesn't just carry only a positive or a negative meaming (more on this below):
No signs are favorable.
An attack will bring misfortune. (trans. Field)​


*************************
Getting back to Hex. 7, I often look at the trigrams - the three-line figures that make up the hexagrams to see what meanings, images, or ideas the hexagrams (can, may, do) have. With Hex. 7, we have trigrams Earth above Water. One way I can see (or imagine) this is:
Here we have groundwater, a hidden / buried resource. We must get 'down to earth' - perhaps organize our resources, and the tools and people necessary to get below the surface of the earth, to tap into this groundwater - which is of course a necessary part of The Well (48), or any well. I can also imagine this being about 'seeing' or going below the surface of our situation, to find a deeper meaning or truth, e.g.​
"You need to look 'deeper' here to see that Hex. 7 is not just about an Army (or just about your ideas of an 'Army')."


***********************************
And finally, this brings to mind another related idea: in the Ten Wings Commentaries, in the Fifth Wing - a part of the Dazhuan or Great Treatise, it says:
Yi has no thought, no action.
It is inert and motionless;
BUT when activated it penetrates
every cause under heaven.
What then, 'activates' the Yi? One thought is that it's our queries, questions, statements, etc. that we put to the Yi that are the activators; these transform the Yi from an inert and motionless book into an Oracle or book of wisdom (these, along with the act of asking, or casting, for a response).

This also may mean that our queries, questions, statements are what give (or help give) the hexagrams their meanings. So, depending on your situation and what you've asked about, Hex. 7, or Hex. 54 - and all the others - will have / carry different meanings. Seen this way, none of them can be said to be either 'positive' or 'negative', or only carry any one meaning, image, idea, or emotion: instead they are the 'activated' responses to our queries - and they convey a range of meanings, ideas, emotions, depending on our situations and what we've asked about.

Best, D
 
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dfreed

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That is one reason I tend to interpreter-hop,
I know it's not entirely related to the title of this thread, but (since you mentioned it) I suggest that you try working with one translation (instead of many), and see what comes of it. To use Hex. 7 as a metaphor, it's going, digging deeper / deeply with one translation - one well - instead of perhaps digging a bunch of shallower holes, which each yield something different - but these may not work together, nor get you to a deeper understanding.

Just something you may want to explore and try.

Best, D
 

IrfanK

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There are some hexagrams that I think I just don't get. 19 feels a bit like that to me, I just don't really feel what it's doing. I don't have an overall image of it. And then there are some hexagrams with lines that I feel are extremely powerful and evocative, more so than others. Almost every line in 38, for example. I don't know that I could say like or not like them -- some of them describe very uncomfortable situations.

I also admit that I was coming to dread the sight of 36 in 2020. That and 29 turned up all the time. But I survived it.
 

redoleander

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I dread seeing 56. I don’t actually think it’s always bad at all but I think it runs on the challenging side and I am often unsure if I’m being told “this is how it is” or “‘make sure this doesn’t happen” with the scarier lines like 3 and 6. Really might not even be either of those messages but I think that’s one I struggle to use well. I relate to the above of not really understanding 19. 29 might be another that’s not preferred but seems unavoidable :)
 

picklebop

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The (perhaps related) idea of "negative" hexagrams (or lines, or trigrams, etc.) comes up quite often here. If you haven't seen it already, I suggest you take a look at Bradford Hatcher's pinned thread, above, about "Positive and Negative Hexagrams", in which he says:
"It's my thesis that as long as someone is locked into thinking of any Gua as inherently positive or negative they will NEVER understand the Yijing."

I think that sometimes our 'intuition' or our first impressions might be overrated, incomplete, or off a bit (especially regarding oracles or about our own situations!); and this is one reason we may have oracles in the first place! :unsure: So, I suggest we may want - or need - to dig a bit deeper than our first, initial gut reactions to the Hexagrams' names, etc.

One way we can do this: with Hex, 7 (and all the hexagrams) different authors and interpreters give it a range of names, titles, or 'handle's':
The Militia - Hatcher​
Organizing Onself - Javary​
Many Forms Within One - Richmond​
Organized Action - Needham ....​

Right away, we are able to see Hex. 7 from different perspectives, many of which are not about our modern ideas about a modern Army (and some of these names we may resonate with, some not so much). Bradford Hatcher's Yijing Hexagram Names and Core Meanings is a good resource for exploring these.


*******************************
There is also the Judgement, Hex. 7's words (and it's different translations and interpretations):
Omen of good fortune for an older man. No harm will come.
.... OR ....​
Persistence. A mature person's good fortune.

For both of these (and for many other hexagrams - and their various translations), if we were blindfolded and only heard the words - so we didn't know these are from a hexagram that some call THE ARMY - I think we'd have a generally favorable response: good fortune, no harm ....

Interestingly, (and conversely) in another thread here, Hilary discusses one of the lines of Hex. 54, "The Marrying Maiden", "Little Sister's Marriage", "The Young Bride", etc. The hexagram's title itself feels very positive to me - a young daughter getting married - but the actual text (and the related meanings) of Hex. 54's judgement don't sound very positive - or more precisely, it doesn't just carry only a positive or a negative meaming (more on this below):
No signs are favorable.
An attack will bring misfortune. (trans. Field)​


*************************
Getting back to Hex. 7, I often look at the trigrams - the three-line figures that make up the hexagrams to see what meanings, images, or ideas the hexagrams (can, may, do) have. With Hex. 7, we have trigrams Earth above Water. One way I can see (or imagine) this is:
Here we have groundwater, a hidden / buried resource. We must get 'down to earth' - perhaps organize our resources, and the tools and people necessary to get below the surface of the earth, to tap into this groundwater - which is of course a necessary part of The Well (48), or any well. I can also imagine this being about 'seeing' or going below the surface of our situation, to find a deeper meaning or truth, e.g.​
"You need to look 'deeper' here to see that Hex. 7 is not just about an Army (or just about your ideas of an 'Army')."


***********************************
And finally, this brings to mind another related idea: in the Ten Wings Commentaries, in the Fifth Wing - a part of the Dazhuan or Great Treatise, it says:
Yi has no thought, no action.
It is inert and motionless;
BUT when activated it penetrates
every cause under heaven.
What then, 'activates' the Yi? One thought is that it's our queries, questions, statements, etc. that we put to the Yi that are the activators; these transform the Yi from an inert and motionless book into an Oracle or book of wisdom (these, along with the act of asking, or casting, for a response).

This also may mean that our queries, questions, statements are what give (or help give) the hexagrams their meanings. So, depending on your situation and what you've asked about, Hex. 7, or Hex. 54 - and all the others - will have / carry different meanings. Seen this way, none of them can be said to be either 'positive' or 'negative', or only carry any one meaning, image, idea, or emotion: instead they are the 'activated' responses to our queries - and they convey a range of meanings, ideas, emotions, depending on our situations and what we've asked about.

Best, D
Thank you for all your detailed feedback and advice, I really appreciate it! I love the I Ching but am a beginner so it's really useful to have your perspective. I'll definitely do as you suggest and try looking beyond single interpretations of titles and more at the content.
 

picklebop

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There are some hexagrams that I think I just don't get. 19 feels a bit like that to me, I just don't really feel what it's doing. I don't have an overall image of it. And then there are some hexagrams with lines that I feel are extremely powerful and evocative, more so than others. Almost every line in 38, for example. I don't know that I could say like or not like them -- some of them describe very uncomfortable situations.

I also admit that I was coming to dread the sight of 36 in 2020. That and 29 turned up all the time. But I survived it.
That's a difficult pair of hexagrams to get regularly! I'm glad you came through it. I like your distinction between dislike and discomfort. It will make me look at things more carefully.
 

picklebop

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I dread seeing 56. I don’t actually think it’s always bad at all but I think it runs on the challenging side and I am often unsure if I’m being told “this is how it is” or “‘make sure this doesn’t happen” with the scarier lines like 3 and 6. Really might not even be either of those messages but I think that’s one I struggle to use well. I relate to the above of not really understanding 19. 29 might be another that’s not preferred but seems unavoidable :)
I feel just the same when I get 56! I tend to react with a feeling of apprehension and insecurity to it. It does remind me a little of the Fool tarot card, which helps me to see its' liberating/refreshing side too though.
 

rosada

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Try reading all the lines of the hexagram and try to see the story they tell.

Hexagram 7 with it's only solid line in the middle of the lower trigram emphasizes that this is a situation that requires clarity about your own position and the extent of your influence. It says a strong physical presence is needed like a sargent right there on the battlefield with his troops who can make immediate decisions about what needs to be done, who can make changes about old rules vs. new ideas. Then further there is a feeling that one should not try to become a king or try to manage a huge organization but rather should delegate authority with those who have shown themselves to be capable, 7.6. Like you might be master of your own household but you hope your children will eventually leave home and set up their own households.

Hexagram 8 coming next describes the efforts to then form a partnership with these independent households. I think the significant points in 8. are that it's important not to miss the opportunity to form a partnership - late comers meet with misfortune - and then that good partnerships are for a limited time and purpose and ultimately they all dissolve, 8.6.
So 7 is sort of My house / My rules and then from there we can go on to forming a 8. Limited partnership with others' houses and rules.

Hexagram 19 has an evangelical feel to it. Like someone who has just experienced 18. Work on What Has Been Spoiled and goes out to teach the world what they now know. I associate it with Martin Luther King's "I Have a Dream" speech. but it comes with a strong warning that while there may be plenty of good intentions one mustn't look for results too soon.

Hexagram 38 follows 37. Family and zeros in on the plight of sisters who while raised in the same house by the same parents yet they still have totally different life paths and so only small things can be accomplished. This hexagram comes up for me when I am considering doing something that might stress the established order. It has a very frustrating feeling for me. I'd be interested if someone wants to expound on the joys of 38.

Hexagram 22 often gets bad press because a fire (trigram) under a mountain (trigram) doesn't spread much light and often creates a lot of smoke and thus a feeling of deception but if you think of it as a time for visions and dreams and don't mistake a pretty appearance for reality, hex 22 can inspire you to think positive while still keeping your feet on the ground.
 
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angelatlantis14

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My least desired answers are
Hex 44 - strong antagonistic forces are unable to overcome (for what its worth, it has always played out that way for me)
Hex 13 - the feeling of fellowship with men here seems for the most part unpersonal and not very warm
Hex 56 - feels like being dislodged and without a home - you can feel the cold wind on the mountain...

that being said, there have been a couple of Hexes I thought negatively about, but after talking them through in one of the well gatherings or the foundations class I have a new and more constructive perspective on: Hex 39, Hex 47 and Hex 12.
So maybe to get a Hex to open up to you (or vice versa) you need some actual, in-depth engagement to it ? :)
 

picklebop

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Try reading all the lines of the hexagram and try to see the story they tell.

Hexagram 7 with it's only solid line in the middle of the lower trigram emphasizes that this is a situation that requires clarity about your own position and the extent of your influence. It says a strong physical presence is needed like a sargent right there on the battlefield with his troops who can make immediate decisions about what needs to be done, who can make changes about old rules vs. new ideas. Then further there is a feeling that one should not try to become a king or try to manage a huge organization but rather should delegate authority with those who have shown themselves to be capable, 7.6. Like you might be master of your own household but you hope your children will eventually leave home and set up their own households.

Hexagram 8 coming next describes the efforts to then form a partnership with these independent households. I think the significant points in 8. are that it's important not to miss the opportunity to form a partnership - late comers meet with misfortune - and then that good partnerships are for a limited time and purpose and ultimately they all dissolve, 8.6.
So 7 is sort of My house / My rules and then from there we can go on to forming a 8. Limited partnership with others' houses and rules.

Hexagram 19 has an evangelical feel to it. Like someone who has just experienced 18. Work on What Has Been Spoiled and goes out to teach the world what they now know. I associate it with Martin Luther King's "I Have a Dream" speech. but it comes with a strong warning that while there may be plenty of good intentions one mustn't look for results too soon.

Hexagram 38 follows 37. Family and zeros in on the plight of sisters who while raised in the same house by the same parents yet they still have totally different life paths and so only small things can be accomplished. This hexagram comes up for me when I am considering doing something that might stress the established order. It has a very frustrating feeling for me. I'd be interested if someone wants to expound on the joys of 38.

Hexagram 22 often gets bad press because a fire (trigram) under a mountain (trigram) doesn't spread much light and often creates a lot of smoke and thus a feeling of deception but if you think of it as a time for visions and dreams and don't mistake a pretty appearance for reality, hex 22 can inspire you to think positive while still keeping your feet on the ground.
This is all so helpful, thank you! 38 is interesting. I do groand inwardly a bit when I find it, but it usually fits a situation I'm aware of anyway, therefore is a relief in a strange way...
:LOL:.

I like an alternate translation of it as 'polarity' as that suggests there is a place for it in the wider scheme of things, almost alchemical in a way. I do find it helpful at times as the changing lines can give suggestions to reconcile the two extremes and most of them have positive end results. I tend to encounter it as the first hexagram during disputes, but the suggestions are always really helpful. As the second hexagram, it tends to warn me if I am heading down an alientating direction so I can change course.

Of course there are some people and ideals that it's a positive bonus to be alienated from!

From the few commentaries I've read it seems to imply a unifying object can help but that the two 'sides' are too different to merge- the potential looks to me more like two horses in harness than anything!
 

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