Clarity,
Office 17622,
PO Box 6945,
London.
W1A 6US
United Kingdom
Phone/ Voicemail:
+44 (0)20 3287 3053 (UK)
+1 (561) 459-4758 (US).
I haven't read all this thread,
The Yijing has no transcendental dimension. Unlike the bible it is not "inspired". I have no doubt of the value of the Yijing and Daoism. However to a believer, the bible will not lead to profound insights without faith.
Bob :bows:
Unless we are sociopaths we do not murder, steal, lie or seduce our neighbour's wife. We usually honour our parents. These all derive from our Judo-Christian heritage, as well as many other ethical injunctions.
It is also interesting to note that whereas the Yijing has become popular in the West, but probably only amogst the educated middle classes, China, the birth place of the Yijing, is increasinly welcoming other faiths. For example, Wikipedia quotes 12 million Catholics and 65 million Protestants at the last count.
Sorry Bradford, I think few educated Catholics and fewer educated Protestants would hold to that definition. Bob
I don't know of any Christian who use the Yijing.
Hi Neegula, as I said I'm no expert so I can't explain it all.
The mention of witches is in the Old Testament if I recall.
To a Christian, the most important "bits" are the gospels as they show us what Jesus was like. I don't think he said anything about witches or divination.
Bob
At the moment I've had an experience of God's love,
Bob
For entertainment purposes only
Catholic Encyclopedia: Divination
Oh.. I know A LOT of them !! and from all the scope of christianity: from catholics, to lutherans to greek orthodox.I don't know of any Christian who use the Yijing.
I haven't read all this thread, just caught the last few bits. One thing seems to be missing from the discussion regarding the bible, is the activity of the spirit or Spirit. Unlike the Yijing, the bible cannot be understood without the influence or guidance of God's spirit. This would apply to both Jews and Christians.
The Yijing has no transcendental dimension. Unlike the bible it is not "inspired". I have no doubt of the value of the Yijing and Daoism. However to a believer, the bible will not lead to profound insights without faith. Which means approaching it with prayer, and the expectation that God will speak, as the Quakers say, "to our condition". I don't know if Yijingers pray although I think Daoists might, but that of course is another dimention. The Jew and the Christian do not have to consult the bible when perplexed and in doubt. They can pray.
Bob :bows:
Nothing is that is not Spirit.
I don't know of any Christian who use the Yijing. I think it would be difficult because God wants a Christian to put all his trust in Him. As Jesus said,"I am the Way, the Truth and the Life", so why bother with the Yijing?
Bob
.1.- Many of the people I know are HIGHLY commited to Jesus, at least in the way they understand Christ's work in the Universe.
. Once again I have only lifted the information from the gospels. Jews would understand God's love in a similar, but different way. However in both cases it's similarly demanding. Love God before all else, and love your neighbour as yourself. There are many ways to love /be loved by God, but the bible specifies certain demands. If you're a Muslim or Sikh then, of course, it may be different, but you'd have to ask a Muslim or a Sikh..- Are you saying that only the people who belives in Jesus -in similar ways than you - can love and be loved by God? Ok.. enough christian superiority for me.
Meng, I never mentioned the word "belief", which is of course simply an intellectual assent to some proposition. However I did mention believer. Perhaps, as it causes problems, I should replace it with follower.
Faith is a different matter. As far as I undertand it, and I'm no expert, faith is the same as trusting.
So faith in a god or Jesus or an Yijing reading, is the same as saying that you trust in your god, Jesus or the Yijing to make sense of your life there and then. You trust it or him or whatever, because when you tried it and trusted it before, it worked, and therefor proved itself or himself as trustworthy.
Does that make sense?
Meng,
If you say that everything is spirit, then of course you're saying nothing. My dog is spirit, my car is spirit etc etc. Such all embracing statements provide no real information. When I mentioned spirit I was referring to what Christians call the Paraclete or Holy Spirit, which is how God connects with humans. I don't particularly like the concept of the Trinity and would prefer, when talking of the action of the Holy Spirit, to simply talk about God. But it's a matter of words rather than a difference in reality.
Bob
. Please read what I actually said. Faith, in the context of Jesus and religious belief in general, is about trusting the object of your faith and therefor being committed to it. Belief is an intellectual agreement with something without necessarily any emotional involvement or commitment. For example, I believe the earth is round not flat. Either way it doesn't really matter to me. I have faith that my wife won't commit adultery. This involves both my emotions and my trust in her. There is a big difference between the two concepts as any dictionary will show.A belief is a fixed form of faith, such as the exclusive beliefs you have been expressing here
. In what may I ask. Personal faith is always in something is it not? Do you mean faith in yourself? In which case we all do. It's the same as saying that you value and trust yourself.I have personal faith,
. It means what it says, see above. I'm not aware of it being a common Christian put down, nor am I aware that Christians fail to use their minds as you seem to imply. (I wonder where that prejudice comes from?) There have been some pretty heavy weight Christian thinkers over the centuries!"intellectual assent" (a common Christian put down of those using cerebral facilities)
. You compare "own cognition" with being told what to do. As far as I know Christians, I'm not so sure about other faiths, are not told what to do or believe. To have faith is to be invited to follow your god/guru/Jesus. There are no demands about what you should do beyond the fundamentals which I've already expressed. For a Christian love God and your neighbour. Everthing else stems from those fundamentals. Of course church hierarchies are a different kettle of fish and what they expect will vary from one church to the next. I have a great respect for Quakers in this repect as they don't impose. Ultimately what you do and believe is a result of your interaction with your god/guru/Jesus or whatever.The term (cliche) is used to describe those who, in place of faith, rely exclusively on their own cognition. Not such a bad thing as it's made out to be by those who prefer to be told what to believe
.You say that to say everything is Spirit is saying nothing. Is it saying more to say Spirit gives exclusive membership rights to those with particular beliefs? Would your son or daughter be disowned if they believed otherwise?
You don't have to join anything or do anthing. It'a all down to you.
To say that everything is spirit says as much as saying everything is made of energy or atoms. So what, it doesn't tell me anything new and is therefore a redundant comment.
Clarity,
Office 17622,
PO Box 6945,
London.
W1A 6US
United Kingdom
Phone/ Voicemail:
+44 (0)20 3287 3053 (UK)
+1 (561) 459-4758 (US).