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44 line 5

I

ichie

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Does anyone have an example, from their real life, of how this line worked out?
 
I

ichie

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I will ask again, under friends, where people can reply anonymously.
 
C

candid

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Hi Ichie,

Sometimes it takes awhile. Your question narrows the field of responses.

I can think of no momentous occasion when receiving 44.5. However, it?s meaning seems consistent when it does occur.

It?s a time when Yin undermines Yang (eldest daughter beneath heaven). Imagine the eldest daughter, coming of age, and going to her father for the keys to his car. She?s got an important date and doesn?t want to take no for an answer. In line 5, the father doesn?t admonish her, but instead ensures her safety: Wear your seatbelt. Here?s my cell phone. Call me if you?re going to be late. She does these things not out of fear, but out of love and respect for her father. She ?responds to his influence and falls to his disposition like ripe fruit?.

This metaphor can apply to any situation where the Yin influence is powerful, and the elder Yang influence protects her from danger. The dynamic is, I believe, that of confrontation and condescension.
 

bradford_h

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Gua 44 itself is about having or showing restraint.
In the Tarot it's the eight of swords, the woman bound up and kept from her mischief.
In Line 5, the melons are wraped and kept in the cellar so that they ripen at the perfect rate.
When the timing is right they are served, when they taste like a gift that has "fallen from heaven."
This line is simply about not doing things prematurely if you want the perfect experience.
There's nothing negative about it unless one is unable to defer gratification.
 
C

candid

Guest
Brad, go to "edit profile", scroll down to your most recent posts. There you can edit.
 
I

ichie

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okay. thanks candid and brad. yeah candid, guess i felt nervous that no one said anything. so thanks for writing. also, Brad, what you said about the 8 of swords makes sense. i guess that is why i wished to know if any one had real life experience with it. cuz it seems like what is a forbidden fruit, is handed to one. which is why i wondered about if anyone experienced this. how this actually plays out, in life.
happy.gif
seems like it would be pretty great.
 

hilary

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One slightly odd experience with this line: I was looking for something in particular, wondering what to buy, and this line heralded the *gift* of a better version than any I'd been thinking of buying. However, in the long term even this improved version turned out not to do all I needed.

I concluded that the wrapped fruit is a gift, but not necessarily the kind of gift you expected or were asking for.
 
I

ichie

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hi thanks hilary, that's kind along the lines of what i was wondering. in this line, it falls to one. but because of the nature of 44, wondering if maybe that's not so great, you know, just wondered if in real life the fruit sisint all it's cracked up to be. thanks for sharing. really helped. i like your newest newsletter btw.
happy.gif
but there always good. i learn a lot from them. thanks. it must be a lot of work to put that letter out and this site. someday i will ask you for a reading and pay real money for it. guess when i get in a real jam. now it's all stupid love life. who cares about that. thanks hilary.
 

ena

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Hi there,

I don`t know if anybody is going to read this, but I just wanted to write about my personal expirience with 44.5.

It`s kind of funny, but here it is.
I`ve asked Yi Will something happen that I need to know about, and got 44.5.

Me and my boyfriend had a fight, and we didn`t see or heard each other for more than a month (it`s a usual situation between two of us, since I`m kind of 44 uncompromising strong woman).

He suddenly called, insisting on a meeting, but my legs were in undepilated state, so I`ve run into a bathroom and my depilation cream literally fell onto my head from a high shelf.

That`s my real life situation with 44.5. It made me laugh, and I`ve realized that the Yi is not always talking about some abstract life-insight, but also about this kind of stuff.

Hope this will help,

Greetings,
Mirjana
 
J

jeanystar

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I think you are so right MIrjana, sometimes we look for the deep, esoteric meaning and it is as if the Yi is waiting for us to get the joke..a sense of humor is definitely there!
 
C

cheiron

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Heheheh wonderful!

But then you might go out and be hit with a 'melon' from the sky too!

I suspect the signal was not lost on you and that might have been the reason for your joyous post?

I expect this was the Yi having a real giggle and underpinning a greater message with other more concrete means?

When there is humour, for me, then there is the greatest of connections.

Please say how this works out - Sounds like it is going to be joyful!

--Kevin
 

ena

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The truth is that if you consult Yi for everyday situations, it can describe them too.

Meny times I got some extremely positive line in answer, and I thought that somethig spectacular is going to happen, but the Yi described some ordinary situation, nothing so spectacular. I`m sure that it reflects some internal condition of ourselves, as well as some future event development, but when you keep asking too many questions at the same time, Yi stops giving you answers to your questions, it rather starts reflecting some other situations in your life.

What I use a lot in interpreting the answer is Section Q: Appendix 4, Commentary Working Notes by Bradford Hatcher, since it is ?catalogue of attitudes?, and there you can find a lot of real-life attitudes.

Many times Yi will give really deep insight into the problem, but I personally thing that most of us, interested in Yi Ching, will use it for brain-exercise, rather than follow advice.

I could think for hours what does 44.5 mean, but the meaning jumped out, and I didn`t have to think about it any more.

To much thinking can make a mess in brain.

Anyway, I`m reading this forum for about 2 years,but I didn`t post till now, and I`ve noticed that people here are sometimes too polite to give their true opinion on somebody`s problem.
I would prefer that people, after receiving Forum`s opinion on some question, come back after realisation to tell what really happened. It woul help us all to see how Yi works in practice.


Greetings,
Mirjana
 
I

ichie

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greetings, too, Ena, but what i see , thank you so much for telling this, by the way, is that the exact thing you were looking for came and hit you on the head! I just am looking to see how this actually is, this line. Brad says 44 is about restraint, i get that, but this is the line where it gives it all up! I mean, couldn't that be great? But then I was wondering if that's good trouble or what. In Hilary's it wasnt all it was cracked up to be maybe, which could be an aspect of temptation, right? But temptation could also be great. anyway. it's about my relationship. So I was just wondering. thanks Ena for telling this. Is depilatory cream for shaving legs? I'm all for a confess it all 44.5 session. If anyone else has something good here.

ena, i'm new too. havent been reading that long. my step mother does the I ching, and so I just started not too long ago too. it really helps. i have a book by jack balkan, and then i read some stuff online.
 

ena

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Ichie,

Well, I would really like to explain to everybody that we don`t have to look for some deep meaning in an answer, it depends on what are we asking. There are some serious life issues for which we need serious guidance, but most of us will ask about our unsatisfying love-relationships (if it were good, we wouldn`t have a need to ask anything, right?).


Time in 44 is very important, so that means that something will happen soon.

44 can mean a lot of things, depends on a question, but timing is important.
It can mean a strictly sexual relationship with no emotions,
It can mean meeting with some male person for any reason,
It can mean a call from a male who doesn`t care a lot about you,
It can mean that you are demanding too much from your partner and caused a fight...

That`s what I can remember this moment regarding love relationships and 44.

Intuition is the most important thing in realising the answer.

Since the timing in 44 is very important, I would like a feedback from you. The situation in 44.5 should happen very fast, within a next few days. It is some kind of suprise, or something unexpected. But it`ll happen soon, so I`m waiting to hear wrom you.

Mirjana
 
C

cheiron

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I think the answer often reflects the level at which the question was put to the Yi.

44 can often refer to a 'fateful event'.

That is an event which might not be expected or brought about by ones direct actions.

At those times I have found that being open to the time of 44 as advised by any particular lines is the best course.

So for me it is the nature of how I deal with the time, as indicated by the lines, rather than timing which has been important.

44 Is sometimes referred to as the 'Lady of Fate'.

Line 5 has often heralded very creative and successful times for me. The coupling being with the lady of fate, so to speak and not another person.

Wonderful things just happening (falling) out of the blue.

Sometimes the 'sexual coupling' has been that of working creatively with another to great ends... Nothing to do with physical sex at all in this case.

However it might also refer to sexual liaisons... and in line 5 I would expect those to be very wonderful indeed? (Pregnant with promise) possibly very emotionally wonderful and unexpected?

or an unexpected pregnancy.

or a knock on the head
happy.gif


--Kevin
 
I

ichie

Guest
well i did get a phone call a couple days ago Ena but thats cuz i thought he was dead. I dont think it was about the 44 5. but i understand what you are saying thanks for writing back. ill keep it in mind. also i try not to do it too much. Ceiron i like what you write too. it fits. this guy is my big temptation. but i cant make mistakes cuz i have a kid.
 
I

ichie

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Ena when i asked about the relationship, as in "Where is it at?", I got 44 5. also, i asked it a few days before i put the post up here. just so you know. i took the anwswer to mean that our relationship was not ready yet, will happen in time. guess i should just be happy with that, and i am. the phone call came day before yesterday, after i panicked that he was dead, and he left a message to tell me he's not. maybe the phone call was the 44 5,

but my hunch is not quite, but stiil, i get your point more and more, been thinking about what you said, you make a lot of sense to me, just so you know not everyone is dense out here. i really get it.
 

hilary

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Hi Ichie,

Thank you!
blush.gif

(Most people care about 'stupid love life' things, as far as I can make out.)

My 44,5 was a real gift, and saved me spending a load of money I didn't need to spend. I suspect the bigger problem came from me not thinking through what I needed in the right order.

Mirjana, I love your 44,5 story! And agree with you all the way about Brad's section Q: I look at it for every reading.
 

ena

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Hi Ichie,

Glad to hear this things from you, and I guess that in your case 44.5 ment that phone call. Did he call you before or after you`ve got 44.5?

I`m curious about that, since his call could be the answer Yi gave you, because it was sudden and unexpected.

If you got this answer before he called, his call is a explanation.

Remebmer what did the answer mean this time, so you can conect it next time you get 44.5.

Ofcourse, this doesn`t mean that the next 44.5 will mean the same thing, or that something similar is going to happen, but it will be helpfull.

Yi is very complicated since 64 hexagrams have to describe all possible life situations, and we have to think and think about applying answers to real life.
But, as I`ve allready said, it`s a kind of brain exercise.

And one more thing, I`m convinced that whatever answer Yi gives you, it isn`t absolutely good or absolutely bad, there is always "BUT..."

So, maybe it is wiser to stop asking Yi or Tarot or any divination system about future, but just to live a life the best we can.

Wanting to know the future can be a very disturbing thing.

There are people who will always find positive things in their answers, and some people will understand everything negativly.
And that is where brainmess starts.

After a while of conslulting Yi about life issues, people become addicted to Yi, unable to make a single decision without consulting the Yi first.

And we are not Gods!!!
If we ought to know everything about our future, we all would have ideal lives, would do perfect moves and have no problem at all.

The most important thing is what you feel inside of you, at that is the only right state and judgement.

Greetings,
 
C

cheiron

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Ena

I agree we are not Gods and cannot know the good or bad of a situation very easily, if at all.

However should we therefore not resist destructive and demeaning things for want of a lack of insight?

There is joy and love and peace creativity and insight and beauty.

There is sadness and loss and decay and pain.

There is balance and sincerity and duration and moderation.

There is hate, excess, and inconstancy.

We must experience the all but does that mean we should seek them all equally?

The Yi, for me, is not about seeing the future... it is about knowing how best to be in the present.

Though I agree always to seek the future with it is not wise. To do that means we are not fully in the present, we are not living.

But one not use it to plumb the future. I believe it is best at helping us to plumb the present.

I believe with careful use it teaches moderation, compassion and understanding as well as many other noble things.

Even wisdom comes, in time, from its teachings.

--Kevin
 
I

ichie

Guest
and yes the phone call came after i asked "where's it at" and got 44 5. so maybe it was all only about that, that surprise phone call. so i see your point Ena. but do you use it?
 
I

ichie

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and Ena, thank you for writing, but do you think you can know what you know by comparing it to something else? im not criticisng what you are saying, i think you are right, and i hope i hardly use divination anymore. but isnt one way of knowing what is inside of you by provoking a cataylist? im just wondering what you think about that. not trying to play mind games.
 

jte

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Here's a 44.5 anecdote from work. In this situation, a person who doesn't understand the work our dept. does very well, but who has management experience in another field, was made manager for a temporary project. I had to work under her and although she wasn't all bad, it wasn't fun because she didn't understand what needed to be done very well. Also, she was a bit manipulative at times, and that wasn't fun either.

We had a permanent position open up around this time and she applied for it. I was a bit worried when it got out that she was one of two candidates "on the short list". Around this time I received 44.5 several times asking about work. Sure enough, she didn't get the job, the other person did. From my perspective, this was the "good issue" that required no doing, just waiting on my part while circumstances worked themselves out favorably.

And, BTW, welcome Ichie and Ena.

- Jeff
 

ena

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Kevin,

I agree with you, but me, personally, would prefer to be capable of not asking anything at all...

If you look carefully at the members of this forum, you`ll notice that ALL of us started consulting Yi (or any divination) in times of crisis. Many of us are unfortunate in some way and have a desperate need to know more about our problems in order to solve them.

Does that mean that Yi Ching diviners live more perfect lives than people who don`t divine at all?

Are we wiser than other people are?

Are we cleverer than others are?

In order to get old and wise, and learn something about life, we should pass through all kinds of life experience, good and bad, disastrous and happy. That is the only way!!!

There are some kinds of misfortunes that we should not try to stop, since it can be a precious experience in sage gaining.

If we are strong inside, we?ll pass through misfortune well, able to move on and forget about it.

Many people fail in this. They finish broken and depressed.

After all, Yi Ching is kind of divination which tells about that we all have our own TAO, everyone of us different one, and that we have to pass through all kind of things in order to find out what is our tao.

The whole mosaic will be seen in the end.

One more thing, Kevin, What do you meen with LADY OF FATE?
Is it some kind of a destiny meeting?

Hilary,

Thanks for encouragement; It means a lot, since this is my first posting.

Critics are also welcome


Ichie,

I do use Yi Ching a lot (unfortunately), and had periods of all-night thinking about answer meaning,

I felt very stupid many times, because I didn`t understand the answer ( I even bothered Hilary few times to help me ? and she really did, thanks).

It all started in 1999, when USA bombed my country ( Serbia), and then started the time described in hexagram 25.

That is my beginning of consulting Yi.

After that, many things changed for the worst in my life:

- I?ve lost a 6 years long job, and ever since than, whenever I try to get a new one I get hex 43 (I`ve been working in Federal Police, and I guess that no one want to emply a person with connections with the state bussiness)
- I`ve had a very bad relationship that lasted 5,5 years, and right now I hope it is finally over.
- Many bad things happened in my family.
- Broke many bad frienships and live pretty isolated in comparisson to earlier time, full of contacts
- Had a health problem, first operation in my life, and I was so scared...

Hex 25 everywhere!!!

What to do then?

I wanted to know so many things! What is happening with my life? Where does it lead from here? What can I do to change it for the better? What to do with my relationship?....

So I`ve passed through my personally hex 12, and continuing to consult Yi.

Fortunatelly, lately I`ve got a lot of 12.6, 55.5, 26.6, 40...All good omens

Since my first question to Yi, I keep a diary of questions and answers, many times I got same combinations for different questions, and I compare them all the time. And it helps in interpretation a lot.
That`s why I`ve told you to remember the meaning of this 44.5.

But I would really like something extremely positive to happen, so I can just live my life without consulting Yi ( I`m totally confident in my capability of good judgement).

Jeff,

Wonderfull, wonderfull 44 story! It fits perfectly!

And thanks for a welcome!

Greetings to all,
Mirjana
 
I

ichie

Guest
Ena, So you are speaking to the better part of your own understanding when you speak to me, to not use the I Ching so much, and I appreciate that. But you must know, everything you wrote here about your experience with the hexagrams with the time you used them was a Month of Sundays. 25/being bombed. Innocent, yet devastated. You mean me to develop my own understanding, not be reliant on the I, yet you only deepen my curiosity as to how hexagrams ACTUALLY play out in real life, not the fantsy life with the hexgrams. Anyway, I am listening to you, you certainly have made an impression on me, and what you have said will only go into the cauldron of my own understanding to shape my life and choices with the I. You are not broken. I am not broken either. If i wait, however, for something positive to happen, to end working with the I, well that is a mirage. The only time to do things is now. ena, you speak a lot of sense, so please know I am listening.

Hi Jeff, that story really clears it up. Thank you for writing, and hi back atcha.
 

ena

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Ichie,

As I wrote, Yi Ching consists of 64 hexagram, and each of them has ONLY 6 lines to move and form your answer (of course you can get unchanged - single one too.

That makes about couple of thousand answers.

That means that every situation, everything you ask about your life must be in some hexagram or some mooving line.

This would also mean that life can have ONLY few thousand of situations, which ofcourse is not true.

But then, the question is HOW TO APPLY HEXAGRAM (with mooving line or not) to our situation?
The only possible answer is to look at your specific situation.

If you are asking about love/relationship that`s one thing,

If you ask about some job problems and solutions - that`s another thing.

If you ask about family life, or making some important decisions, that`s also different thing.etc...

Nobody can tell you the meaning of hexagrams (except what they mean in general), untill you get them as an answer to a specific question.

Applying hexagram meanings to real life is possible only after some time of asking questions.

And I personally think that keeping diary is very important.

It`s often hard for me to predict what will happen according to hexagram I get, I can only see the tendency in situation development.

But then, when a situation I`ve asked about happens or pass, I look at answer previously written in a diary of questions and answers (I have 3 notebooks full of it), and then I understand.
It`s a kind of retroactiv understanding.

So you see, it would be a better idea to think about questions you`ve asked Yi, and then remember what really happened, and that is the only way for you to know how to apply hexagrams to real life.

You`ve mentionet that your mother is a diviner, so she is probably more expirienced that you are.

Maybe she can help you a lot.

Greetings,
Mirjana
 
C

candid

Guest
Through a very recent and significant experience I finally got my head around LiSe?s rendition of 44: to beget an heir. She and I have debated 44 for quite a long time, but I finally understood the value of her meaning.

Looks like my take on 44.5 went nowhere.

Ena, I?m enjoying your contributions.
 

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