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All right, another thread about complicated simplicity

confucius

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This is not a coined psychology question, it is about perspectives and points of view, the many relative approaches to a singular understandable answer :

Is the glass half empty or half full ?

Simple enough, two possiblities but, as a matter of fact, and realistically, there is just one answer that is correct, why ?

FuZi
 

martin

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Well, unless you drink in a vacuum the glass is full.
It is half full with air and half full with liquid.

Is that what you mean? :)
 

luz

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It depends on the direction the glass is going.. if it's in the process of being filled then it's half full, but if somebody is drinking from it then it's half empty. Like the crescent or waning moon.

But I don't agree there is only one correct answer, from an objective point of view the glass is both half empty and half full.
 

manfredk

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Neither nor, it is just that your mind makes you seek duality ...
 

Trojina

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Shouldn't this thread be in the Open Space area ? Its got nothing much to do with divination has it ? Neither did the last mind game/guess whats in my mind thread.
 
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crystal_blue

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Neither nor, it is just that your mind makes you seek duality ...
Agreed - the glass simply is; the problem is linguistic, namely, the concepts of 'half empty' and 'half full' are absurd and presuppose non-existent entities (the other half of the water/emptiness). The glass is full of a certain amount of water, such that the level of water lies half-way between the top and bottom of the glass.
 

confucius

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Com...pli...ca...ted...

Why always this necessity to seek an answer at the other end of the universe ? Why ? always complicated, learned, protocolean...why not understand the question ?

The question is asked : ''what does it have to do with divination'' ? To devine is to anticipate, the Yi helps anticipation by having one find his/her given position in a given environment and properly exploit the better possibilities for harmony.

I do not seek to promote discordious threads, those that do wish to participate with the same objective of being exposed to other ways of observing SEE the great utility of such a forum...

The glass, has never been full. When a glass is fabricated, it is empty, and made to hold whatever is put into it. Its virtue is to hold, but it is empty, therefore half full when half filled !!!!!

I am amazed so as to how countless ways there are to tackle a ''problem'', though the Yi started as a binary code, two posibilities, one beneficial, the other beneficial if delayed, the cumbersome human mind gives too much thought and depth to simplistic refined phenomenom...the question is always simple : Yin or Yang? Now or later ? that is the Yi...keep it simple

FuZi
 

luz

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When a glass is fabricated, it is empty, and made to hold whatever is put into it.
Precisely!!! It is meant to hold liquids, it is meant to be FULL!!

That is exactly why it is HALF EMPTY! :)
 

confucius

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Please explain this, it is meant to be full, it has to be the most confusing answer I saw in a long time !
 

Trojina

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Please explain this, it is meant to be full, it has to be the most confusing answer I saw in a long time !

Lightangels statement is perfectly simple and straight forward. Rather than tell her to explain what she meant why don't you explain why you don't understand it. What do you find so confusing ? None of the answers given here are very complex you know yet you seem to find them so
 

getojack

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I agree with lightangel. It's simple, FuZi. The glass's sole purpose is to hold liquids. Anything less than fullness is not meeting it's purpose, so it feels half empty when it's only half filled.

Your confusion is probably coming from belief that a glass has no feelings... You probably think that a simple glass couldn't possibly wish to fulfill it's potential every moment of it's existence. How dare you leave all those half-filled glasses around? Don't you know that they wish to be completely full?
 

Trojina

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I am amazed so as to how countless ways there are to tackle a ''problem'', though the Yi started as a binary code, two posibilities, one beneficial, the other beneficial if delayed, the cumbersome human mind gives too much thought and depth to simplistic refined phenomenom...the question is always simple : Yin or Yang? Now or later ? that is the Yi...keep it simple

FuZi
So in your view the Yi gives us "...two possibilities, one beneficial, the other beneficial if delayed.." ?? I think you need to explain why the Yi has lost the possibilites of an infinity of meaning to only two possibilites which are " beneficial or beneficial if delayed".

You think our questions to the Yi only involve "Now or later" ? Wow i wonder we discuss it so much here on the forum or people write books about it when all along we only need to know "now or later". Now or later, now or later, later or now ....yaawwn :rolleyes:
 
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crystal_blue

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Wow i wonder we discuss it so much here on the forum or people write books about it when all along we only need to know "now or later".
It seems to be endemic to the human condition that we must take the long way round.
 

luz

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And you are not even a half empty glass! Imagine how THAT feels!!!
Now or later... that's all they ever hear! :rolleyes:
 

sparhawk

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And you are not even a half empty glass! Imagine how THAT feels!!!
Now or later... that's all they ever hear! :rolleyes:
Hey, I resent that. I'm a "half full" type of guy... (half full of "#%it"...) :rofl:

L
 

luz

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well, I like to think of myself as half EMPTY of it! :rofl:
 

confucius

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We all know the Koan about the frog and the Scorpion,

for it is a metaphorical analogy of Taoism, therefore undistinguishable from the Yi...

What I do not understand in the answer that a glass' virtue is to be full is as simple as the Yi, in fact. How can it be the glass's nature to be full ? is it not a glass if it is half full ? understand my question ? do you see the puzzle in the answer that the virtue of a glass, besides containing, is to be full ?

If you understand , please, honestly, share the light...Since you knighted yourself with the pseudonym Trojan...or did you mean the preservatives ? ...just a little tease...

FuZi
 

luz

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for it is a metaphorical analogy of Taoism, therefore undistinguishable from the Yi...

What I do not understand in the answer that a glass' virtue is to be full is as simple as the Yi, in fact. How can it be the glass's nature to be full ? is it not a glass if it is half full ? understand my question ? do you see the puzzle in the answer that the virtue of a glass, besides containing, is to be full ?

If you understand , please, honestly, share the light...Since you knighted yourself with the pseudonym Trojan...or did you mean the preservatives ? ...just a little tease...

FuZi
Dear Fuzi,

I am a bit confused by your last post, see quote above. You said yourself that it was the glass' virtue to be full, no? :confused:
Are you making a distinction between 'virtue' and 'nature'? is that it?
In any case, these are some of the definitions of 'virtue' that I found:

- the quality of doing what is right and avoiding what is wrong
- merit: any admirable quality or attribute; "work of great merit"
- morality with respect to sexual relations
- a particular moral excellence

We are talking about one fine little glass here but, in any case, a virtue is a quality, an attribute, a readiness, a disposition... isn't that also the same as its nature?
I am a light angel, an angel of LIGHT:D , so isn't light an attribute of mine? isn't light also my NATURE?
Same thing... no?
As for trojan knighting herself, a trojan is simply a citizen from Troy, there is no knighting involved, you are the one that, in your mind, has given such romantic attributes to the figure in the box, I suppose.:)
 

getojack

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On a windy day, two Zen monks saw a flag waving in the wind. One monk said, "The flag is moving." The other monk said, "The wind is moving." They argued heatedly about it until finally someone summoned the Master to answer the question definitively. They pointed to the flag in the wind, and asked, "Which is moving? The flag or the wind?" The Master said, "Neither. Mind is moving."
 

confucius

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Grasshopper, the Zen Master does not master the issue, just his positioning in relation to your confusion...the wind is moving, which makes the flag move...any other way of understanding is distant to the Tao.

As for the Angel of Light, you ask: Is not light an attribute of mine ? Is it not also my nature ?

I believe, but you are welcomed to change my mind, that in this case light is an attribute of yours; it may be your nature to share the light, but that is your nature, not to be, but to share

There are two ways to see the light: the source and the object which reflects it, in the Yi these two relatives are called Sun and Moon, Yin and Yang, neither exists without the other, but neither is the other either.

FuZi
 

getojack

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Grasshopper, the Zen Master does not master the issue, just his positioning in relation to your confusion...the wind is moving, which makes the flag move...any other way of understanding is distant to the Tao.
No, grasshopper. Your mind is moving, so you can't see the truth clearly.
 

luz

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it may be your nature to share the light, but that is your nature, not to be, but to share
Yes!!! So it is the glass' nature to BE FILLED, to SHARE ITS EMPTINESS. Because, have you thought about where that emptiness goes, once there is liquid in the glass?? :rolleyes:

Wow! gives me the chills... I feel like that moving flag that leaves ripples in the wind... :)
 

sparhawk

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I've read of many actors that remain "in character," long after the shooting of a movie ends. I remember seeing an Interview with Anthony Hopkins, shortly after his second "Silent of the Lambs" movie and the man was so scared about his personal character changes, from being "in character" for so long, that he didn't want to make any more of those kinds of movies (he lied or changed his mind, of course)

I'm starting to wonder... :D

L
 

crystal_blue

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I've read of many actors that remain "in character," long after the shooting of a movie ends. I remember seeing an Interview with Anthony Hopkins, shortly after his second "Silent of the Lambs" movie and the man was so scared about his personal character changes, from being "in character" for so long, that he didn't want to make any more of those kinds of movies (he lied or changed his mind, of course)

I'm starting to wonder... :D
Time to stop acting?
- ;)
 

confucius

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Does anyone remember when that idiot thought that the world was round...they threatened to kill him, excommunicated him...burn him at the stake too...what a moron, to think that the earth is round when everybody agrees it is flat...

The virtue is the glass is not to be filled, it is to contain, it is a glass even if half filled...do you not see ?

FuZi
 

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