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Dreams and Yi

hilary

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Dreams and readings, readings and dreams... the more I pay attention, the more deep, strange, comical and wonderful the relationship looks. I'd love for us to share ideas and experiences around it - see if we can help each other to a deeper connection in this, too...

There seems to be a flow between the two realms, even if I don't cast a reading specifically about a dream -

Dreams 'colour in' readings with specific people and places and emotions. Especially emotions - and a sense of the emotional depth and scale of whatever-it-is. I suppose that's especially true with questionless, 'what-to-be-aware-of' readings like I cast for each week.

(Weekly reading: 27.1.2 to 4. Dream: ludicrous great anxiety saga about the turkey I must cook for a party, and how there's not enough time or enough oven space or probably even enough turkey, not that I know how many people there are, and why did anyone imagine I could cope with this??

Not putting that one up for discussion particularly - wrong forum for that - just to show how the reading-themes are there in the dream - it's like the full-colour comic-book version...)

And readings anchor dreams in a bigger context - 'this is part of that story' kind of thing. It's a map of the terrain, so I don't just drown in the emotion of the dream but have some sense of what's happening/ what it's about. Especially good for recurring dreams, because there must be something I'm not getting in those.

  • Do you ask Yi about dreams?
  • Come to that, do you ask dreams about readings? (or do they tell you anyway?)
  • How does it all come together, for you?
 

meng

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  • Do you ask Yi about dreams?
  • Come to that, do you ask dreams about readings? (or do they tell you anyway?)
  • How does it all come together, for you?

Yes,
yes;
will explain.

As I experience it in my life, there are dreams, and there are Dreams. Likewise, there are readings, and then there are Readings. Crossroad dreams and readings always agree; I believe it is because they are the same thing. They are my seeing far foreseeing magic staff: through which The Mind may communicate to my limited and self-absorbed self. It's up to the better, more intelligent part of me to listen, or not.

Every major crossroads in my life was accompanied by an emotionally shaking, and somehow deeply penetrating dream or series of dreams, and I've learned not to too easily dismiss Yi's answer, by answers like 62 or 64.. even if they do leave me with a sense uhh, gee... thanks a lot, Yi :rolleyes:. There's usefulness in those answers, if that is what I get. :bows:

I believe crossroad dreams spring from the Creative when we are in a state of readiness for change that was coming anyway.

I believe likewise, there are many little questions, though the fact that so many are emotionally charged, that the overly energized bunny is what, or whoom, comes into the spotlight, and is what Yi speaks to. And, dreams likewise. I think this makes up the great majority of our midnight rambling; but these are not crossroad dreams. Though if I asked Yi about one of the small dreams, it might answer, it might not. Either way I feel a little foolish for asking.

I, personally, am seeing emotion playing a much greater role in all aspects of the Yi, as far as being an oracle goes. Dreams have always been connected to change and emotions. I wake with a Feeling of something, more than with a thought. I try to explain the feeling to myself, and I can't quite yet understand. I ask Yi. Yi give me images and patterns to contemplate, that I may choose the way informed, even if I can't yet quite get my head around it, and sometimes never will. Sometimes change is a kick in the ass or whack on the back with a bamboo staff, to wake up!
 
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I've had dream-yi connections, both ways.

After dreaming something strange or highly charged I have asked Yi 'what did that mean'? and gotten very good feedback. I've also woke up a handful of times with various hexagrams, and a couple of times a specific line, in my mind. They haven't been the most clear of dreams, more like me walking around in some sort of senario thinking about a hexagram in the dream, once writing it down. So I will wake up and read about that specific hexagram I was dreaming of. It's pretty interesting stuff at the time, but for the life of me, I cannot think of any of the examples of the hexagrams I woke up with. I remember 51 being the answer to one very intense dream I had asked about though. Will be nice to get Justin's software and link these together.
 

chingching

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Me too, both ways. When I first joined laity I slept with readings under my pillow.
http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?t=12110
Whic I wrote down in the thread above.

A few others here have had readings appear to them in dreams too. I remember someone having that with 34.

I also cast for dreams that befuddle me, and when I have posted these in shared readings in the past I found what others had to say quite illuminating. I remember sooo and trojan's the most vividly.

Both dreams and yi are wells and dreaming and casting are dipping one's bucket into them. If you use one to help decipher the other I suppose you've just gone and drawn out two buckets of water from different wells, maybe they are the same maybe there are points of difference but having two of something increases the ability to see. For example, we have two eyes so we can perceive distance and depth. That's how it comes together for me.

Hilary, did you cast for the dream, or did you have the dream after the weekly casting?

"Weekly reading: 27.1.2 to 4. Dream: ludicrous great anxiety saga about the turkey I must cook for a party, and how there's not enough time or enough oven space or probably even enough turkey, not that I know how many people there are, and why did anyone imagine I could cope with this?? "

Pretty great reading for it!
 
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meng

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Both dreams and yi are wells and dreaming and casting are dipping one's bucket into them. If you use one to help decipher the other I suppose you've just gone and drawn out two buckets of water from different wells, maybe they are the same maybe there are points of difference but having two of something increases the ability to see. For example, we have two eyes so we can perceive distance and depth. That's how it comes together for me.

I'm glad you mention this. To me it represents a whole set of paradoxes, which divides 1 into 2. The Dao and my dao. The Spirit and me; me and thou. The Well and my well, which is mine also to maintain and keep the water untainted and pure. They are connected and divided. Kinda like when a few teens buy an ice cream soda, and each has their own straw to drink from. I view consciousness the same way, whether it be a time when the body is awake and active, or when I sleep. The good fisherman will fish in the moonlight, while the uniformed sleep through the bite. I'd rather sit weary eyed, drinking morning coffee, with a funny grin, then be yawning my empty head, rested.

All day long the junzi is creatively active.
At nightfall his mind is still beset with cares.
Danger. No blame.
 

Trojina

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I had a very clear dream of 55.4 I wrote of in CC and it made me think of 55.4 in the coloured in comic book way Hilary described...and also changed my way of thinking about 55.4. Dreams have different qualities, some feel very random and a rehash of the previous day, then there are recurring dreams, lucid dreams,etc etc ....but this dream didn't seem at all random, it was actually headed 55.4 I couldn't see the heading exactly but I knew it was there. I know I will be bringing that dream understanding into my future inner conversations about 55.4
 

hilary

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...As I experience it in my life, there are dreams, and there are Dreams. Likewise, there are readings, and then there are Readings.
Very true! I used to have endless strings of small-d dreams, things like, 'Oh look, we have run out of tinned tomatoes.' Apart from making shopping trips more confusing, they didn't seem to do much. But yes, then there are Dreams.

I believe crossroad dreams spring from the Creative when we are in a state of readiness for change that was coming anyway.

I believe likewise, there are many little questions, though the fact that so many are emotionally charged, that the overly energized bunny is what, or whoom, comes into the spotlight, and is what Yi speaks to. And, dreams likewise. I think this makes up the great majority of our midnight rambling; but these are not crossroad dreams. Though if I asked Yi about one of the small dreams, it might answer, it might not. Either way I feel a little foolish for asking.
Yup. It helps, for me, that looking at a reading about a dream tends to mean lots of hard work. Since I don't like hard work, I'm disinclined to ask about the deeper significance of No Tomato Tins In The Pantry.

I, personally, am seeing emotion playing a much greater role in all aspects of the Yi, as far as being an oracle goes. Dreams have always been connected to change and emotions. I wake with a Feeling of something, more than with a thought. I try to explain the feeling to myself, and I can't quite yet understand. I ask Yi. Yi give me images and patterns to contemplate, that I may choose the way informed, even if I can't yet quite get my head around it, and sometimes never will. Sometimes change is a kick in the ass or whack on the back with a bamboo staff, to wake up!
Something important about that meeting of feeling and image-pattern, I think. Getting your head round it is probably optional.

Actually, that's a general feeling I have with dreams and even with some readings - that 'understanding' as in 'being able to put into words that make sense' is optional, and doesn't always add anything. Some dreams feel to me more like events than messages. A better question to ask about them would be, 'What just happened?' (not 'What did that mean?')
I've had dream-yi connections, both ways.

After dreaming something strange or highly charged I have asked Yi 'what did that mean'? and gotten very good feedback. I've also woke up a handful of times with various hexagrams, and a couple of times a specific line, in my mind.
Oh... interesting! I've dreamt in hexagram imagery occasionally, but I don't remember ever dreaming a reading. Wonder why not...?

Will be nice to get Justin's software and link these together.
Absolutely. Meanwhile, I'm fiddling round with my own organiser-journal-dump software set-up trying to create associations.
Me too, both ways. When I first joined laity I slept with readings under my pillow.
http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?t=12110
Whic I wrote down in the thread above.
Love it - thanks for the link!
Both dreams and yi are wells and dreaming and casting are dipping one's bucket into them. If you use one to help decipher the other I suppose you've just gone and drawn out two buckets of water from different wells, maybe they are the same maybe there are points of difference but having two of something increases the ability to see. For example, we have two eyes so we can perceive distance and depth. That's how it comes together for me.
Yes, that. Also it makes it more of a dialogue, doesn't it? And the value of dialogue for conveying ideas and letting them come to life has been known from Plato to podcasting.
Hilary, did you cast for the dream, or did you have the dream after the weekly casting?

"Weekly reading: 27.1.2 to 4. Dream: ludicrous great anxiety saga about the turkey I must cook for a party, and how there's not enough time or enough oven space or probably even enough turkey, not that I know how many people there are, and why did anyone imagine I could cope with this?? "

Pretty great reading for it!
Weekly casting first, then the dream. Then I actually cast about the dream, and had 45.2 - whatever turkey I can come up with, offered with sincerity, will be enough.

I had a very clear dream of 55.4 I wrote of in CC and it made me think of 55.4 in the coloured in comic book way Hilary described...and also changed my way of thinking about 55.4. Dreams have different qualities, some feel very random and a rehash of the previous day, then there are recurring dreams, lucid dreams,etc etc ....but this dream didn't seem at all random, it was actually headed 55.4 I couldn't see the heading exactly but I knew it was there. I know I will be bringing that dream understanding into my future inner conversations about 55.4

Must revisit CC thread.

Recurring dreams strike me as particularly good ones to ask Yi about. The reading can change the recurrence or dissolve it altogether - maybe an example of reading-as-event rather than message?
 
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svenrus

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I find "the language of dreams" pictorial, just as it seems in the way I Ching is written....

(Maybe out of this thread: many years ago I was slowly awakening one morning. Very strange conversation found it's place in my consciousness. Somehow I felt I understood a little of it, but on the other hand no. Too strange to clearly understand what this conversation was about although I nearly got the sense. As I awoke I realised that it was a rookery situated not that far away from where I awaked, making an ugly noice.....)
 

meng

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Yup. It helps, for me, that looking at a reading about a dream tends to mean lots of hard work. Since I don't like hard work, I'm disinclined to ask about the deeper significance of No Tomato Tins In The Pantry.

Upon reading this, I thought of 44.4 - 57. Seems to be penetrating the feeling through bringing up to the surface of consciousness, symbols, expressing themselves in the form of feeling. I agree, that sometimes feeling is the point in itself, but I'm usually interested in knowing where that feeling came from, what was it saying, in more palpable terms.

I agree: to understand a dream is optional. Wrote these lyrics to express that, back when.

If all the dreams of a crazy man
seem far away,
then I say to listen to the wind,
as it begins to tell you of life,
and what it means to be a crazy man,
to understand a dream.
 

Trojina

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Recurring dreams strike me as particularly good ones to ask Yi about. The reading can change the recurrence or dissolve it altogether - maybe an example of reading-as-event rather than message?


Can it ? I've personally never known it to have you ? Recurring dreams might vanish for 6 months, even a year or more but they tend to come back I find.
 
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hilary

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I suppose it's impossible to say anything's gone for ever. I know someone who says a recurrent nightmare went away after a Very Big Reading cast light on it. I haven't actually tried really determinedly tackling a recurring dream with a reading, not yet. I did cast the other day for a theme that's been on loop for a while - will see how that evolves.

I just found this archive post on dream sharing - http://dreamstudies.org/2009/07/29/dream-sharing-the-foundation-of-dream-work/
I have a feeling there's a lot more to be said about that, just as an important mode/ level of communication between people.

Svenrus - I'm pretty sure rooks are very wise, and to be on the verge of understanding their conversation would be tantalising.
 
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meng

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midnight ramble

A rook of quail make a ruckus at my glass door every morning, but only because of the seed I throw on the ground.

I think we can tempt the Creative. I've never perceived the Receptive way to be passive, but Receptive. To be Receptive is to have ones antennae out, and to play a creative role, through a display of openness to the Creative. Lighting incense at a shrine, or applying a touch of seductive perfume to allure, are the same. What they attract is what they offer.

I think this is something the dream and the Yi share in common. I recall, it was always Jung's assertion that, in the end, it is always the Conscious mind which must be responsible and accountable. Therefore, luring the creative is itself a creative act, even if the expression of creativity is receptivity. One can not only consciously influence sub or unconscious activity - which I believe any divination relies upon - one can teach themselves to wake up while dreaming, and dream walk or travel, and be lucid as though awake. However, since dealing with the Creative should not be a game to compete, but a dance to dance, it is important for the receptive to follow the Creative. Otherwise, neither dreams nor readings have the slightest influence.
 

hilary

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Bruce, it is beyond strange that you start writing about tempting the creative. My guidance-reading for starting this thread: 1.2.5.6 to 55. I could imagine this dragon bringing dreams to the fields.
 

meng

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Interesting reading as the precursor to this thread.

It's subject I get excited about, Dreams and Yi, together, and I can relate to your reading because of that alone. But as for the content: the nature and commonality of a partnership with a dream and a reading has always been like the sun at midday for me.

Even presenting the topic was luring the dragon. I think dragons feed most pleasurably on curiosity. They eat mengs for breakfast :eek:
 

meng

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then, there's this..

maskedmarvel.jpg
 

rosada

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I had a lucid dream just last night of my husband who passed away over a year ago. I had been aching to see him one more time and at last my wish was granted: he appeared in a dream. It brought me a tremendous sense of peace. I asked the I Ching what the dream meant and received 14.6, a blessing from Heaven and the reassurance that "Everything is unfolding in accordance with the way of the cosmos." (Hilary's I Ching)

rosada
 

hilary

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That's beautiful, Rosada - dream and reading both. Thank you for sharing.
 

hilary

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Some recommended reading!

Enhance your dream life by Ryan Hurd, available from
http://dreamstudies.org/subscribe-to-dreamstudies/
in return for your email address.

I downloaded this a while back, but only just read through it. It is good.

Things I like...

The defence of dreamers it starts with:

"To be called a “dreamer” is to be out of touch with reality. And “You’re dreaming” literally means “your ideas aren't relevant.”

But the dreamers I know are actually more in touch with reality. We are in touch with two worlds simultaneously: the “real world” that we all share, and the private dream world where the real work is done."
The aspiration to 'build bridges' and 'invite' dreams into waking life.

The basics... he starts off with sleep science, eating habits and then dream-supporting herbs and supplements.

Mindfulness techniques to prepare for dreaming - I'm going to use the 'backwards day' one tonight. (The idea is to do the mental work that would otherwise need to be done by tedious 'rehearsal' dreams and free up the dreaming mind to go deeper.)

Good stuff on journalling, including its limits and keeping it manageable.

Quotable things about honouring dreams:
"Dreams are actual experiences, not just metaphors. In other words, they are as psychologically real as any important memory we hold. So the real trick to valuing a dream is to know how to respect the song of a dream without tearing it apart. Instead, let it sing."
or
"The more we focus on our dreams, the more our dreams will focus on us."
(You could pretty much substitute 'readings' for 'dreams' without changing much, couldn't you?)

Also a section on lucid dreams (without completely idolising them as a goal in themselves, hooray, it irritates me when people do that...), and a section on dream incubation I'll be coming back to...

So yes... recommended. A good mix of the immediately do-able and the more challenging. Have a look, let me know what you make of it.
 

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