How Long Will Last This New Disastrous Period? 17.1.4> 8

[marybluesky]

The new chain of unpleasant events in my life seem to have started:

* My sister's partner has developed serious mental problems, something like schizophrenia- of course I'm not a doctor & professional diagnostic is needed. He is loved by my family as a tender, sympathetic person. He's been going through stressful situations about money & in his family, but we couldn't expect such a big turn. I worry about my sister: we're very close. She's younger than me only by 3/5 years, however her problems disturb me like, I guess, a mother. They love each other very much and had no problems. He was like a family member. I'm troubled since learning about the news.

* My attempt to start a relationship with a friend was unsuccessful. I don't go into details now. Another romantic failure.

* After trying and trying, I finally met a new friend with whom I felt happy and comfortable. She's been left by her BF of 9 years 3 months ago, and understandably, is pretty sad. I want to meet her more, and she's not in the mood. If I had a wider social circle it would've been OK, but now... needless to say.

* On the other hand, I ended my friendship with an old friend who lives in another city. We hadn't much in common anymore, plus I had residual anger towards him. It ended badly, as I talked about the things that bothered me and he refused to accept.

* As a French teacher, I give mostly online lessons beside a couple of private courses in place. Most courses being online because of Covid, I'm in home much more than I want & it isn't good for me. I need to meet people in person, I need to be in direct contact with society, and my current situation doesn't satisfy these needs. Bad for my mental health.

* Two of our distance relatives have died since the beginning of April. It didn't affect me much, however I wonder who's the next??

I asked the I Ching: How Long Will This New Disastrous Period Last? Answer: 17.1.4> 8

I don't think it's a direct answer to my question; it rather invites me to change my heart & join with others (who are the others then?? sigh), seek union. I don't know what's the message of 17.4 though- maybe it says go after connections, they help you, even if they don't last.

Any ideas?

 

[rosada]

8. Seeking Union seems to focus attention on partnership which from reading your post it appears that finding/having partners/friends and also who and what you give your attention to is the main issue here.

I think 17.1 is saying every day is a chance for a brand new start and 17.4 is saying take things ("Follow" your path) one day at a time.
So it reads to me as if to say you are indeed entering a new period but not necessarily a disastrous one - more like a feeling of having to start from scratch and therefore not to be hard on yourself or anxious, new friendships, new life!, takes time.

So to turn things around I think you gotta just throw a lot of spaghetti on the wall and see what sticks. Try different things, see some good in each day and eventually a new pattern emerges.

I'm sure there are ways to figure out timing using the I Ching but I don't know them. Instead I use astrology and set up a chart for the moment I ask a question and then check out what the Moon is up to. In this case the Moon was 2 degrees from a contact with Mercury and 10 degrees away from a contact with Pluto which could indicate some sort of major shift in 2 to 10 weeks. I think the Pluto aspect really emphasizes a new life forming for you here so while you may continue to feel isolated for a bit I think you will find that as you use this period to stabilize what's true and important for you then totally new connections will appear as the world mirrors your new self. So what ever wants to go now, let it go, clean out your closet - you're on to a new wavelength and those old colors don't suit you anymore!

 

[dfreed]

Would you share the words/text of the lines you got, and also whose translation you used?

 

[dfreed]

Also, are you just wanting to know the ‘timeline’ - e.g. it will be over soon, in a month, never - or are hoping for a bit more advice / insight into your situation, like “tell me more about ____ or what might be a suggested ____ .”?

 

[marybluesky]

Thanks dear Rosada!

I don't know if the companionship is the main issue. Of course having others who make my life fuller & funnier will helps, hence the message of 17.1 & 8.

I wonder if you see the brand new period in the reading or it's more of an astrology thing. I called it another disastrous time as I had a long one last year & wrote about it in Clarity. I was just gathering myself up & regaining happiness while the new unpleasant events started to come one after another.

And I have a question about the astrological transitions: they are meant to affect everyone's lives, and we know that different people experience different things at a given time. How it works?

 

[marybluesky]

@dfreed ,
I used Hillary's translation:

17.1
'An official has a change of heart. Constancy, good fortune. Going out of the gates, joining with others, there is achievement.'
17.4
'Following makes a catch. Constancy, pitfall. With truth and confidence, holding to the path with clarity, How can this be wrong?'

And while my question was about the timeline, I'm open to receiving any other useful information.

 

[rosada]

I'm seeing brand new beginning in the hexagrams. 17.1 Dawn, brand new day. 17.4 Wanting security but the path demands being guided moment by moment.

 

[dfreed]

How Long Will This New Disastrous Period last? 17.1.4> 8 .... my question was about the timeline, I'm open to receiving any other useful information.

In one way, 'this period' is going to last forever - in that our lives are made up of both good and bad stuff, though at times it leans more towards one than the other. In you reading you have:

17.1 'official(s) change(s) ... Constancy, good fortune. Going out ..., joining others, ... achievement.'

and, 17.4 'Following makes a catch. Constancy, pitfall. With truth and confidence, (and) holding to the path with clarity, How can this be wrong?'

It seems to be a mixed bag here, with 'constancy' - staying on the road your on, doing what you are doing - being both good and also a pitfall.

I've always thought that the question in 17.4 was more rhetorical, e.g. Jewish Mother asks, 'we've got chicken, vegetables, noodles, broth ... oiy, how can this be bad? what's there not to like? But maybe it is just a question: staying on this path, how can this be wrong? Answer: maybe nothing, or maybe lots of things ....

Looking at the trigrams, in 17 you have Thunder below and Lake above. Here you are wanting a change - maybe even drastic or shocking (thunder-like) changes as a way to get back to your 'happy place' (Lake), but whatever strategy or actions you're doing, may not be working. So you ask" How is this wrong? Or, maybe another way of saying it: what do I need to do to make this right, correct, more joyful?

With the first moving line, Thunder becomes Earth: to consider that there are ways to approach your situation(s) that are not so demanding, or shocking, or so demanding of change. Maybe it's a call to develop a more accepting, caring attitude towards yourself and others - e.g. friends you can't quite connect with; x-lovers, your sister, etc. It very much reminds me of "joining (with) others" - and that for me, this is the "achievement" you may need right now. (So, we can join with others and the world even just within our hearts and minds, as well out in the world - both approaches work.)

With the fourth moving line, Lake become Water - maybe a 'solution' here is that you need to go more deeply into 'the abyss' - into your emotions, feelings, and not try to find ways to get out of them. Or .... Water also has an aspect of acceptance (like Earth) - to go with the flow, etc.

Typical of the Yi - I often believe that improving our situation means changing our outlook, approach, or attitude (though it can also mean changing the outer as well).

Best, D

 

[legume]

if i was using the lunar calendar with Yi i'd read this as this period lasts from month 1 (feb 12) - hex 17, until month 3 (may 11) - hex 8, so maybe it's already over? i think 17.1 might also be saying things are already changing, it's good to "go out", maybe in the sense of getting out of the fixed mindset of seeing it as a disastrous period and line 4 warns about misfortune when persevering, maybe in that mindset, as if it could then become a self-fulfilling prophecy, which it doesn't have to be. i got hex 8 re seeking union in many different ways, about connection with my grandma, my country and also some men, but it's very broad and never really "easy".

 

[rosada]

I was thinking of 17.4 as meaning "it's not a straight path, be willing to make adjustments" but now I really like that insight that 17.4 could represent a warning not to continue with a fixed mindset.

Also, rather than thinking of 8. meaning a specific companion, I'm thinking of 8 as saying how you relate to the world in general is what's going through a transformation at this time. Notice how 7.6 tells how the leader, after conquering the territory, does not try to be the one supreme being, but delegates responsibilities to other leaders and now in 8. the image says the next step after founding these new households is coming to agreements with these new household heads. So when you ask, "when will this phase be over?" 17.1.4>8 could be saying, " 17.1 When you get out and see new things, people etc. 17.4 Don't hold to old attitudes. 8.Connect with everyone and everything what's happening in new ways."

I wonder if there might be some benefit in asking, "What should be my attitude about what is going on in my world right now?"

About the astrology. Yes, transits affect everyone but in different ways. The Sun rises every day - it "transits the ascendant" - but it connects with each individual's personal horoscope in a different way. However with the slower moving planets like Saturn you can see long term trends that affect everyone in very similar manner. Like Saturn right now is in Aquarius, the sign of independence and equality so we in the United States we are seeing issues that affect a lot of people around fairness in pay and equality and respect for all races. and also people insisting they be independent and free to choose whether or not to wear masks. Saturn is retrograde much of this year meaning it appears to be moving backwards so everyone is feeling stalled somewhere in their lives or seeing things moving much more slowly than anticipated - such as the world looking to recover from covid and realizing it's gonna take a lot longer.

 

[bologna_tendra]

17.1 in Wilhelm says "we must go out and mingle freely with all sorts of people, friends or foes. That is the only way to achieve something" - you mention residual anger at an old friend who doesn't see things the way you do - is Yi hinting something here do you think, that a change in attitude in your can be a key to unlock some door enabling you to "To go out of the door in company" ?
17.4 - have you become accustomed to things that you now can't do without?

 

[marybluesky]

17.1 in Wilhelm says "we must go out and mingle freely with all sorts of people, friends or foes. That is the only way to achieve something" - you mention residual anger at an old friend who doesn't see things the way you do - is Yi hinting something here do you think, that a change in attitude in your can be a key to unlock some door enabling you to "To go out of the door in company" ?
17.4 - have you become accustomed to things that you now can't do without?

To be honest I'm not the type to mingle with "all" people. I don't enjoy it.

I can't say what attitude I should change, or to what things I'm accustomed. If it was clear to me I didn't post the reading on the thread,

About the friend, you're so quick to assume that he has done nothing wrong & I've been mad at him just for seeing the things in a different way. Although it ended badly, I feel no guilt, he even didn't let me tell what had annoyed me and accused me to be lying. I have no desire to resume that friendship.

 

[dfreed]

17.1 in Wilhelm says "we must go out and mingle freely with all sorts of people, friends or foes. That is the only way to achieve something"

That's what Wilhelm says in his commentary, but the words of 17.1 are:

'Going out of the gates, joining with others, there is achievement.'

If I got this line, my general sense might be that when I'm out in the world I should bring or cultivate an attitude of openness, a willingness to make connections and be connected with.

It could be - and I have taken the Yi's suggestions this way - that just having this attitude is all that is required: that just my attitude, thoughts, outlook, etc. are what heals me, and lets me see new possibilities .... Or, I might choose to go sit outside at a cafe, instead of staying in my home or attend a party I was invited to.

In other words, 'how' this magic and these connections actually happen can be very broad and varied. But it does not necessarily mean that I must do what Wilhelm says in order for the alchemy to work.

Best, D

 

[my_key]

Hex 17 has a meaning of 'leaving the old grounds for dissention behind': Hex 8 has a meaning of 'delight'. So this reading could well mean the joy experienced through living in pastures new and so could be very like Rosada's comment of "......how you relate to the world in general is what's going through a transformation at this time.

The best advice (image) you could follow with Hex 17 is that when things begin to get dark just go and seek peace inside of yourself. Stop trying to second guess all that is going on around you. Make no mistake, the things that are going on around you, the trials you are facing will be the impetus for your fruitful and successful change (judgement).

So, step outside of the barricades you have put up, with a view to allowing the fresh air to invigorate your world (17.1). Sticking to your old view and perspectives is doing just that.....keeping you stuck. Time for an overdue spring clean ......(whether you want one or not) (17.4). Let the fresh air bring with it new perspectives that you can use as the backbone of your next phase in life (8).

....or it might be nothing like this at all.

Good Luck

 

[rosada]

Someone once asked Oprah how to get into show business and her first advice was it didn't matter how gifted or talented they were, they needed to move to Los Angeles or New York. I think we see that same message in 17.1 - you have to get where the action is. (And you don't have to be all buddy-buddy with any of these people!)

Awhile back we were posting song lyrics that expressed the meanings of the lines. I think the advice in hexagram 17.1 is summed up in Cabaret:

What's the use of sitting alone in your room?
Come hear the music play!
Life is a cabaret, Old Chum.
Come to the cabaret!

Further thoughts:
Noting how 17.1 follows hexagram 16.6 which talks about "deluded enthusiasm" - like after all the Enthusiasm and hoopla, Peggy Lee wonders "Is That All There Is?" and the party ends on a somber note but next morning 17.1 says the sun rises again so time to get back in the game. Maybe this is what Legume was picking up on with the suggestion that perhaps 17.1 means the worst is over already. Hope so!

 

[bologna_tendra]

About the friend, you're so quick to assume that he has done nothing wrong & I've been mad at him just for seeing the things in a different way. Although it ended badly

Dear Mary Bluesky, I am not assuming anything. I don't believe Noble Yi talks about "right" and "wrong" but rather talks about what "works" and what doesn't "work". You threw the coins I guess because something is not working. You are feeling something you don't want to feel. And you feel it might be better if you felt differently. I take from your account that you would prefer something to be different in that situation as you list it in the things that have been a part of this painful time.

Yi is hinting you are "inside" and it would work for you to be "outside". You speak of being physically inside, literally due to Covid etc. And we can be mentally or spiritually "inside", perhaps sometimes for years, and then we may realise we have passed "outside" of this.

Some say we are living in Kali Yuga, maybe we are, if so don't take it personally, it's not an easy time for mankind, go easy on yourself, and I'm sure you have a lot to give the world, and a lot of love, and your time will come to give that love.

Best, Bologna Tendra

 

[marybluesky]

More than 6 weeks have passed & no progress, no dawn. Shocks continue to happen. No social life ( despite trying to connect several ppl; oddly, no one seems eager), no love life, a mediocre professional life with low irregular income (I hardly find new students despite presenting myself in different mediums), disturbed family life.

I just found escapade in some movies & music as I couldn't do anything in outside world.

F.... this stale sickening life.

 

[redoleander]

More than 6 weeks have passed & no progress, no dawn. Shocks continue to happen. No social life ( despite trying to connect several ppl; oddly, no one seems eager), no love life, a mediocre professional life with low irregular income (I hardly find new students despite presenting myself in different mediums), disturbed family life.

I just found escapade in some movies & music as I couldn't do anything in outside world.

F.... this stale sickening life.

It's terrible to be in a holding pattern when things are bad, I'm sorry you're going through that. This seems to be a theme for many people recently. I hope you don't mind if I reply with an astrological perspective... the astrology has been full of roadblocks and more of a "stuck" nature. The Cancer New Moon provides a bit of liberation from that (moon is tomorrow, at least on U.S. time). Looking back at your reading, it seems like it might be calling for a totally new strategy or approach or something? Which, admittedly, might feel exhausting or even bad. Definitely not trying to put a pretty bow on a difficult time in your life; but that said, maybe you can have a strong prayer with the new moon for something NEW anything that will bring you in to different experiences or open to uncovering a different approach that can provide some relief or, further down the road, destination.

 

[redoleander]

Also, to be fair, I think the two changing line readings where the lines contradict are some of the most difficult! Just from that, it can often seem to indicate 'stalemate' of some kind. Hopefully you just won't have too much longer of that.

 

[marybluesky]

So it reads to me as if to say you are indeed entering a new period but not necessarily a disastrous one - more like a feeling of having to start from scratch and therefore not to be hard on yourself or anxious, new friendships, new life!, takes time.

So to turn things around I think you gotta just throw a lot of spaghetti on the wall and see what sticks. Try different things, see some good in each day and eventually a new pattern emerges...

In this case the Moon was 2 degrees from a contact with Mercury and 10 degrees away from a contact with Pluto which could indicate some sort of major shift in 2 to 10 weeks. I think the Pluto aspect really emphasizes a new life forming for you here so while you may continue to feel isolated for a bit I think you will find that as you use this period to stabilize what's true and important for you then totally new connections will appear as the world mirrors your new self. So what ever wants to go now, let it go, clean out your closet - you're on to a new wavelength and those old colors don't suit you anymore!

I'm seeing brand new beginning in the hexagrams. 17.1 Dawn, brand new day. 17.4 Wanting security but the path demands being guided moment by moment.

Nearly 5 months have past: now I can see how this predictions came true.

I past through hard, tense days; which can be described as moving in a forest being ruined by fire, amidst smoke & haze that burn and disturb the sight, on a shaky ground where things behind crack & disappear at every step. I just looked for a cooler place, as I couldn't prevent the destruction- however I don't see these happenings as merely destructive, rather a series of thunders & earthquakes that shook & burned, stopping the older patterns without allowing the new ones to fully emerge- we know that the forest fires are beneficial in their own way. I indeed had to adapt myself to the situation & find solace in little things day by day: nothing big nor reliable.

The shocks have been happening in my life since a while, as many of you know. That said, I see the date of this post- the last decade of May 2021- as the start point of new area; the dawn. New patterns emerged slowly as I found "my places" in the burnt forest to take breath. These are what I remember from the past five months. It was hard & stressful, it felt hopeless many days, but now that the feelings are gone I don't see the period as disastrous, not at all, rather interesting, and definitely, an important beginning. The major shift occurred, but I couldn't see it then.

Almost everything from the past stopped to work, I was somehow "forced" to let them go. I even changed my clothing style & closet!!! nine weeks later; as explained in this post! (I had forgotten Rosada's prediction while writing it).

The astrology (like the I Ching) had accurately pointed this change. I find it surprising & magical to come true, as I didn't believe it myself.

All this reminds me of the of Pink Floyd's first album , "Piper at the Gates of Dawn" (I'm a classic/psychedelic rock enthusiast if you didn't know).

P.S: Sting has also an album called "Brand New Day", but that's another story