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Is Jesus Physically Coming Back Soon?

eden

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I used to be really involved in christianity; the last few years i have kind of forgotten about it and with the chaos and stress of everything i've gone through, I pushed it aside.
But today, was sitting here looking at old bookmarks re:hebrew texts and did kind of a flippant on the fly reading about it, not really expecting any kind of serious answer...
I thought I'd get the fool hexagram..lol
but anyways..

is jesus physically coming back soon?

Your reading resulted in the following hexagrams:

63 changing to 24

Hexagram 63, Already Across

Key Questions

What is decided?
What now?

Oracle

‘Already across, creating small success.
Constancy bears fruit.
Beginnings, good fortune – endings, chaos.’

You have committed yourself and made a transition. Even if the change so far is internal, a resolve formed or decision made, there is a sense in which everything is in place. Now you create success in small ways and in small things: you attend to details, working with what you’ve already decided or achieved. In following through, you stay loyal to your original reasons for making the crossing.

The Zhou forded the river and overthrew the Shang dynasty. As they established their rule, they had in mind how the Shang once received the Mandate of Heaven to replace a corrupt dynasty. Now the Shang had forfeited the Mandate and were ending in chaos, while the Zhou enjoyed fortunate beginnings. Might the story repeat itself? It’s easier to create new, clear-cut patterns for living than to live by them.

It’s not that what you have begun here must inevitably fall apart. Only if you feel as if you’ve ‘arrived’ already and let yourself come to a halt, then you lose your path and then it all falls apart. Work with what you’ve accomplished so far, and keep your momentum: keep on beginning.

Image

‘Stream dwells above fire: Already Across.
A noble one reflects on distress and prepares to defend against it.’

Sequence

Already Across follows from Hexagram 62, Small Exceeding:
‘Going past others naturally means crossing the river, and so Already Across follows.’

Pair

Already Across is paired and contrasted with Hexagram 64, Not Yet Across
‘Already Across: calm and settled.’
‘Not Yet Across: exhaustion of the male.’

Changing Lines

Line 3

‘The high ancestor attacks the Demon Country.
Three years go round, and he overcomes it.
Don’t use small people.’

Line 5

‘The neighbour in the East slaughters oxen.
Not like the Western neighbour’s summer offering,
Truly accepting their blessing.’



Hexagram 24, Returning



Key Questions

What is just beginning to germinate?
How can you follow your sense of direction more closely?
Where might the path lead now?

Oracle

‘Returning, creating success.
Going out, coming in, without anxiety.
Partners come, not a mistake.
Turning around and returning on your path.
The seventh day comes, you return.
Fruitful to have a direction to go.’

Your journey leads you out and home again, through the turning points on your way. Vigour and authenticity return in the still moments of those turning points; life regenerates from the roots, and light returns.

By walking constantly to and from your source, you participate in a two-way flow of creation You go out and rediscover your own way; you return through an open door to your home and relationships. This is a living motion, like breathing, that revitalizes and restores. Relaxed and spacious, it allows time for the path’s natural meanderings, never creating resistance.

Since you are in motion, helpers of all kinds come – travelling companions who walk alongside you for a while. (If someone is meant to be with you, you will never need to leave your path to chase after them.) Just as any road can be travelled in two directions, your path also leads both out and back again, and so – in the fullness of time and following a natural progression – there comes a moment to turn round.

Through all this going and coming and starting afresh, it is good to have an overarching direction and purpose to guide you. The quality of Returning is alive, growing and dynamic – a good time to rediscover your own deepest intent and its harmony with the Dao.

Image

‘Thunder dwelling in the centre of the earth: Returning.
The ancient kings closed the borders at winter solstice.
Itinerant merchants did not travel,
The prince did not tour the regions.’

Sequence

Returning follows from Hexagram 23, Stripping Away:
‘Things cannot be completely used up. Stripping Away comes to an end on the outside, and there is turnaround on the inside, and so Returning follows.’

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I found the changing lines interesting..
especially the high ancestor attacking demon country :p
and the other changing line, the neighbour from the east slaughtering oxen, reminded me of this...
" Who is this who comes from Edom, from the city of Bozrah(to the east of israel), with his clothing stained red? Who is this in royal robes, marching in his great strength?"

interesting...whatchu all think? :)
 

gene

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While I don't believe in asking these kind of questions, the philosophical underpinnings of the question are quite interesting. And as far as my answer is concerned, I would just say, "I wish I knew." I wish I knew because while, long ago, I stopped believing in literal translations of biblical stories, it seems, as I have found throughout my years, that while the literal story is not generally important, often, literal interpretations do turn out to have some validity.

It is an interesting question for this time period because, whether Jesus is coming back or not, prophecy is turning out to be very literal, and prophecied things are beginning to happen right before our eyes. The book of Daniel tells us that the final battles will be caused by a situation involving Persia, which is modern day Iran. There is a very high possibility that world war three will start next year if the issues between Iran and Israel are not solved.

Now, I personally do not believe Jesus was the "literal son of God, and that he lives forever, but I have been wrong before. And going to the next step, I personally do not believe in an immanent rapture, but I could be wrong about that too. Too many of the fundamentalists beliefs are based on fallacies purposely perpetrated by the church in the early centuries. However, sorting things out is almost impossible.

Then, along these same lines, the governments of the world have become extremely sophisticated at directing misinformation at their own people. Rome and the Church of Rome were experts at this, but we have it down to a science now. And many conspiracy theories, such as the one that teaches "we never went to the moon," we actually created by the government in order to confuse people, and when the theory is proven false, no one believes in any conspiracy theory any more. They do the same thing regarding religion, and conspiracy theories abound about the coming of Christ, the coming of the Anunaki, and who is the good guy and who is the bad. So we are going to have to watch and see what really happens, and try very hard to be attuned to the real truth, because we are under constant and severe attack when it comes to receiving honest communication.

So, the problem is, it would appear that God is not coming back, but the "gods" are. Now, the "gods are not necessarily godly. They have their own agenda. So are they good for us, or are they not? And I think it is very evident that the gods, or some form of God, is coming back. Ancient civilizations all over the world have believed this for thousands of years, and it is built into the description of the last days of the Mayan calendar, as it is as well predicted for this very time period from almost all ancient civilizations. This cannot be by accident.

After 40 or 50 years of study, I am convinced that there are two bloodlines on this earth, one created by a more devious god, and one by a less deviant god. They are coming back for their offspring. What will be the outcome? I don't know. But we are in for a very unusual ride, and we can see things unfolding right now. It may not be what we think. Will there be a first invasion by the lesser gods, then a second by the more "righteous" aliens? Or what is going to happen? As usual, the government, and others in authority are going to do everything they can to deceive us and keep us in the dark. Keep your eyes and ears open, because the earth is about to go through a very rocky ride, and it won't be pleasant, although I am firmly convinced the outcome eventually will be quite pleasant.

"The high ancestor attacks the demon country." The highest gods attack the deceit that is being poured out on humanity that keeps them in the dark, and believing the party line given to us by those who are secretly the true earthly masters. The one in the East is deceived. The one in the west still has a true heart, and will sort out the information from the disinformation. And the earth and the governments of the world will return to their true glory, and their rightful owners.

Gene
 

ginnie

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Did you know that A Course in Miracles is a book believed to be authored by Jesus (channeled material). In that sense, Jesus has already come back in physical form. The philosophy of the Course has to do with transcending the worldly battlefield and finding the peace of God for ourselves.

In terms of your reading, some people believe that 63.3 is a fight that has already been fought. So, while there is no need to fight it again, perhaps some adjustments need to be made to contain or even appease those barbarians who have been conquered and banished. And 63.5 means, to me, "don't slaughter an ox." Don't make inappropriately large sacrifices or hold huge ceremonies. Just hold fast to sincerity in your heart. And that's all it takes. No matter what happens on earth, the Kingdom of Heaven is always within us.
:)
 

bradford

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Santa will be coming back in December, and the Easter Bunny in the Spring.
You may need to be satisfied with that.
 

mryou1

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So, the subject of your question is Jesus. The ruler of the hexagram 63 is the second line, this shows that Jesus is focused on earthly affairs, giving up his duties to mankind, which is in a temporary state of prosperity. Now, lines 3 and 5 change, yang turns to yin, the day turns to night, and so Jesus must set aside his ruling in line 2, and completely move over to line 1, which represents a beginning, the physical return you speak of. All this is very Book of Revelations-ish... Apocalypse indeed.

However, I'm of the opinion that with questions like these, the full answer isn't only given to one person. That's why I'm going to take it upon myself to ask the exact same question. I should note here that I see Jesus more as a powerful, spiritual metaphor than anything else, and I do not consider myself a Christian by any means. So without further ado:

Is Jesus physically coming back soon?

33.1.2.6 > 43

This was a very interesting result. I took it as, in 33 the ruler is in line 5. Jesus is in heaven. He is retreating from the first two lines. This whole scene could represent his crucifixion. Now, the first two lines change, to be on his side. Mankind becomes 1/3 Christian, and there is no more persecution of Christians. Mankind is, essentially on Jesus' side. However, the higher ideals, in the sixth place are turning bad. Perhaps this stands for the following of the Old Testament beliefs, of persecuting others, of constant wars, etc. Mankind joins with Jesus, to take on the sixth place. This is the "physical" return of Jesus. People partaking in the compassion he preached.

So, two completely different answers. Of course, this is just my take on both of the castings, and someone else might have something else to point out. Also, maybe someone else would like to ask the I Ching this question.
 

eastern_girl

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This is definitely one of the most unusual questions I've seen on this forum. And I don't know how accurate and serious Yi's answer could be, with a question not related to someone's own life and personal experience. It's a big question and, for some people, maybe even a funny one. If every christian on Earth asked the same question, the results would probably be different, because none of us has access to the whole truth, whatever that may be. The answers could also reflect personal beliefs.

So, while I'm no expert in I Ching, rather a beginner, I couldn't help asking the same question. As I expected, Yi's answer to me was different: hexagram 53.3.5 changing to 23. The two moving lines refer to the birth of a child, which is not unusual given that we are talking about a physical comeback. But is this THE ANSWER? I'm not even a practicant christian, I have my doubts, so why should I be given...the secret? :)
 
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Trojina

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I used to be really involved in christianity; the last few years i have kind of forgotten about it and with the chaos and stress of everything i've gone through, I pushed it aside.
But today, was sitting here looking at old bookmarks re:hebrew texts and did kind of a flippant on the fly reading about it, not really expecting any kind of serious answer...
I thought I'd get the fool hexagram..lol
but anyways..

is jesus physically coming back soon?

Your reading resulted in the following hexagrams:

63 changing to 24

Hexagram 63, Already Across

Key Questions

What is decided?
What now?

Oracle

‘Already across, creating small success.
Constancy bears fruit.
Beginnings, good fortune – endings, chaos.’

You have committed yourself and made a transition. Even if the change so far is internal, a resolve formed or decision made, there is a sense in which everything is in place. Now you create success in small ways and in small things: you attend to details, working with what you’ve already decided or achieved. In following through, you stay loyal to your original reasons for making the crossing.

The Zhou forded the river and overthrew the Shang dynasty. As they established their rule, they had in mind how the Shang once received the Mandate of Heaven to replace a corrupt dynasty. Now the Shang had forfeited the Mandate and were ending in chaos, while the Zhou enjoyed fortunate beginnings. Might the story repeat itself? It’s easier to create new, clear-cut patterns for living than to live by them.

It’s not that what you have begun here must inevitably fall apart. Only if you feel as if you’ve ‘arrived’ already and let yourself come to a halt, then you lose your path and then it all falls apart. Work with what you’ve accomplished so far, and keep your momentum: keep on beginning.

Image

‘Stream dwells above fire: Already Across.
A noble one reflects on distress and prepares to defend against it.’

Sequence

Already Across follows from Hexagram 62, Small Exceeding:
‘Going past others naturally means crossing the river, and so Already Across follows.’

Pair

Already Across is paired and contrasted with Hexagram 64, Not Yet Across
‘Already Across: calm and settled.’
‘Not Yet Across: exhaustion of the male.’

Changing Lines

Line 3

‘The high ancestor attacks the Demon Country.
Three years go round, and he overcomes it.
Don’t use small people.’

Line 5

‘The neighbour in the East slaughters oxen.
Not like the Western neighbour’s summer offering,
Truly accepting their blessing.’



Hexagram 24, Returning



Key Questions

What is just beginning to germinate?
How can you follow your sense of direction more closely?
Where might the path lead now?

Oracle

‘Returning, creating success.
Going out, coming in, without anxiety.
Partners come, not a mistake.
Turning around and returning on your path.
The seventh day comes, you return.
Fruitful to have a direction to go.’

Your journey leads you out and home again, through the turning points on your way. Vigour and authenticity return in the still moments of those turning points; life regenerates from the roots, and light returns.

By walking constantly to and from your source, you participate in a two-way flow of creation You go out and rediscover your own way; you return through an open door to your home and relationships. This is a living motion, like breathing, that revitalizes and restores. Relaxed and spacious, it allows time for the path’s natural meanderings, never creating resistance.

Since you are in motion, helpers of all kinds come – travelling companions who walk alongside you for a while. (If someone is meant to be with you, you will never need to leave your path to chase after them.) Just as any road can be travelled in two directions, your path also leads both out and back again, and so – in the fullness of time and following a natural progression – there comes a moment to turn round.

Through all this going and coming and starting afresh, it is good to have an overarching direction and purpose to guide you. The quality of Returning is alive, growing and dynamic – a good time to rediscover your own deepest intent and its harmony with the Dao.

Image

‘Thunder dwelling in the centre of the earth: Returning.
The ancient kings closed the borders at winter solstice.
Itinerant merchants did not travel,
The prince did not tour the regions.’

Sequence

Returning follows from Hexagram 23, Stripping Away:
‘Things cannot be completely used up. Stripping Away comes to an end on the outside, and there is turnaround on the inside, and so Returning follows.’

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I found the changing lines interesting..
especially the high ancestor attacking demon country :p
and the other changing line, the neighbour from the east slaughtering oxen, reminded me of this...
" Who is this who comes from Edom, from the city of Bozrah(to the east of israel), with his clothing stained red? Who is this in royal robes, marching in his great strength?"

interesting...whatchu all think? :)
I like the answer but find ithard to put into words. Its like already here (63) is always here (24) the physicality aspect of it you asked about I'm not sure of. 63.5 makes me think it is not necessary for him to incarnate at this time...its already been done. Whatever the incarnation bought is already in the world (63) and also at the source (24) and whatever issues the incarnation bought are still being worked out (63.3)


Now can I ask what all the quoted stuff is from ? Whose commentary is it ? I like to know whose view of the I Ching I'm reading. Is it Hilarys ?
 

Trojina

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This is definitely one of the most unusual questions I've seen on this forum. And I don't know how accurate and serious Yi's answer could be, with a question not related to someone's own life and personal experience. It's a big question and, for some people, maybe even a funny one. If every christian on Earth asked the same question, the results would probably be different, because none of us has access to the whole truth, whatever that may be. The answers could also reflect personal beliefs.

So, while I'm no expert in I Ching, rather a beginner, I couldn't help asking the same question. As I expected, Yi's answer to me was different: hexagram 53.3.5 changing to 23. The two moving lines refer to the birth of a child, which is not unusual given that we are talking about a physical comeback. But is this THE ANSWER? I'm not even a practicant christian, I have my doubts, so why should I be given...the secret? :)
I agree to an extent but think for a moment. why would Yi take this question less seriously than "what does he think of my email ?" or "what does he think of me ?" (the most popular questions from females here)

I wonder why anyone would think these questions would be taken more seriously than this one.


Also the objections raised here in the thread generally, that if we all ask this question we will be given a different answer so how valid is it ?....well the same is true of many political questions posted here yet no one brings it up on american politics threads that have been around lately.


Recently there was a few questions about the american election....all taken very seriously. All the time I thought of this same point . Why would an answer by one individual mean anything at all for anyone except that person. I just wonder why its all accepted for political questions (and in general politics for me is the greatest fantasy of all, this naive belief a man at the top can make it all okay and then shock when he doesn't :eek:).


I'm just noticing the incongruity of it. That this is seen as a weird question but asking about Obama's impact etc etc isn't :confused:

Incidentally overall I noticed much better questions here lately.
 

Trojina

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eastern_girl

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You're right, Trojan. I didn't want to sound rude or presumptuous, of course every question is serious, especially when you are really expecting a serious and clarifying answer and not just playing. It's just that this is such a big question, that one finds it hard to believe a satisfying answer, covering the whole picture, would ever be given. I took it seriously myself when asking the same question and I don't think Eden's cast is not important, the reading actually sounds very interesting. Just that, being a matter that involves the whole Christianity, I think more questions could give more angles of the same picture. That's all.
 

1eleven

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Some food for thought... I'd try asking the same question with "Jesus of Nazareth"

In the remote viewing community, topical searches of "Jesus of Nazareth" produced data that describe a real person, while topical searches on "Jesus Christ" produce data of a more symbolic nature.

I have little experience with RV but it has taught me to be very specific in the question. For kicks, I may try a reading with the RV cue, Jesus of Nazareth / now. And/or, Jesus of Nazareth / present location.
 

Trojina

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Eastern Girl..... I wasn't meaning to critisize you personally in anyway I was more making a general point. I wasn't suggesting you were rude at all, more using your post to illustrate. Anyway I agree with you, I know what you were trying to say :) yes everyone could ask that question and get a different answer. My general point was in political questions such as I lnked to on Obama everyone seems to take the first answer as the real one and doesn't question it. I feel thats a prejudice towards politics being so real and important, which I question, and the kind of question put here That point is a general observation of that thread and this one....not a pot shot at you.


I feel Eden got a real answer, thats how I feel as it was asked sincerely and its a great answer....I don't have the full idea of it because its a big answer but i do feel it was an answer.

ETA an answer, not the only answer. But the question originated specifically from a POV of one persons consciousness that appears to me to have come from clarity. I couldn't ask this question because it wouldn't really mean anything to me so I doubt I'd get a clear answer
 
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meng

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"I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End." Rev 22:13

Loved your answer. 24 - yang enters from below = new beginning.

On the cross he shouted, "It is finished!" John 19:30

Theologically, he has already returned in the form of the Holy Spirit, ushering in a dispensation of Grace.

His Disciple, Thomas, recorded a key verse differently than his peers: His disciples said to him: "On what day will the kingdom come?" <Jesus said:> "It will not come while people watch for it; they will not say: Look, here it is, or: Look, there it is; but the kingdom of the father is spread out over the earth, and men do not see it." Thomas also recorded Jesus as saying "The Kingdom of heaven is within you."

So in light of these things, he's returned already and dwells in the heart of believers, more or less like Santa Clause or the Easter Bunny, except nowhere is it written that redemption or deliverance comes through them. Whether this is intended strictly as metaphor, or if it physically manifests, I have no idea. But I recall once when Rosada asked the question of Yi: Who is Jesus? and received 40. That fits the Bible's description of him perfectly, and his own description as well.
 
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It's interesting that 24, which is associated with the winter solstice, is the zhi gua. The winter solstice marks the day that light's gradual lengthening begins. Which is often anthropomorphized into Jesus (along with many other religious figures). The Sun is the physical return of the light.
 

gene

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The main problem with asking this kind of question is that it concerns billions of people, and if they all asked you'd have as many different answers as is possible for the I Ching. That is why questions have to be personal. I just found it an interesting subject, and added what I could, but that is not a lot.

The same applies to questions about politics. If multiple people ask you get multiple answers. Which one is correct? All questions should be very, very personal.

Gene
 

gene

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I've got bad news for you Bradford. You ain't gonna see Santy or Bunny either.

Gene
 

pocossin

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Is Jesus physically coming back soon?
63.3.5 > 24


I understand Jesus to be our ability to humanize the universe. If we take "the Devil's Country" as the present condition of the earth and suppose that Jesus is now active, "three years" suggests a long delay, so no time soon.
 

TwoGeese

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Recently there was a few questions about the american election....all taken very seriously. All the time I thought of this same point . Why would an answer by one individual mean anything at all for anyone except that person. I just wonder why its all accepted for political questions (and in general politics for me is the greatest fantasy of all, this naive belief a man at the top can make it all okay and then shock when he doesn't :eek:).


I'm just noticing the incongruity of it. That this is seen as a weird question but asking about Obama's impact etc etc isn't :confused:
Agree with the above. Well put.
 

meng

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Is Jesus physically coming back soon?
63.3.5 > 24


I understand Jesus to be our ability to humanize the universe. If we take "the Devil's Country" as the present condition of the earth and suppose that Jesus is now active, "three years" suggests a long delay, so no time soon.
Interesting. I think of it more as heaven's ability to divine us, and to give humanity divinity.

"Devil's Country" .. Jesus rose in three days, first descended into hell to set captives free.

People are free to make what associations they personally see, largely based on their own experiences. It really could be like the Easter Bunny. What's so bad about that? Kids think its pretty cool. Suffer not the kid.

But I like the association you've made with Devil's Country. I regard that respectfully in terms of credible mythology, in both cultures; possibly all cultures.
 

pocossin

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But I like the association you've made with Devil's Country. I regard that respectfully in terms of credible mythology, in both cultures; possibly all cultures.
Thanks, Meng. I was thinking of Satan as the god of this world from 2 Corinthians 4:4

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
 

meng

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Thanks, Meng. I was thinking of Satan as the god of this world from 2 Corinthians 4:4

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
Yes, I've considered that as a possible meaning and reference to the verse, "and men do not see it". I've also considered the possibility that he may have been referring to the subatomic world of quantum mechanics. So rather than an admonition, a science lesson, but one that he knew they could not yet understand.

But more than these, I view it as a sardonic statement, as though to ask 'What the heck do you people want from God, for crying out loud! Look around you. He/she created all of this! The Kingdom has come already! Is this Creation not miraculous enough for you?! Oy! So hard to please these spoiled kindela.
 

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