life path

[hilary]

Willowfox, please see this thread, or any of my recent private messages.

 

[willowfox]

Willowfox, please see this thread, or any of my recent private messages.

Yes, lovely but why does this prevent me from giving my polite opinion just like everyone else can.

I like to call a spade a spade and a lump of earth a clod.

 

[hilary]

Absolutely nothing prevents you from giving a polite opinion just like everyone else. I'd be very happy if you would.

 

[lucia]

Trojan

Some people find a particular direction early on, some don't because their way does not include slotting into a preexisiting socially recognised career path.

whoa....... who said anything about slotting into a "pre-existing socially recognised career path"?? Is that what my ex-husband did? He plays (primarily) jazz/rock in an African band is that a "pre-existing socially recognised career path"? Certainly didn't seem like it when we were young and it wasn't fashionable and the whole world was telling him to get a 'proper job' .

The place you work sounds dreadful to me...buts thats another story

I am a broadcast journalist in international news and current affairs and documentary. I am also an anthropologist and photographer - I try to mix the lot and so run media projects for Africans to learn media skills and pass them on to other Africans, make rather political films, often experimental. I work towards creating my own news outlet - in the recent invasion of Gaza I ran a blog with Palestinians to counter the bullshit that there was no accurate news coming from inside the occupied territories - is that a pre-existing socially recognised career path? Is that dreadful? (OK maybe it is to some people ..........)! By the way I am not offended or criticising I am just challenging the reverse stereotypes that get chucked around by many baby boomers and their offspring in general.

One of the things I love about the years of work I have done in India and Africa is the completely different attitude there is there to studying. We live in the over rich "west" we are spoiled and hung up about it (eg new age nostalgia is one example...) - some of my friends have had to milk the goats before they could even go to school or have had to support families because of AIDs as well as study when they themselves are still only children. And yes at this point retrovirals are more helpful to them than bach flower remedies

I once had to council an 11 year old street child in India that he had to get a job. He refused to go home, he refused (wisely) to go to the charity home and really all he wanted to do was go to school but that was not an option. My own son was the same age it was a poignant moment.

I also work in Southern Europe (I live between 2 counties) with African migrants - they knowingly risk their lives in tiny boats to get to Europe for work and education the majority have an unswerving conviction about this and endure all kinds of hardships, language learning, racism, living without official papers and in many counntries healthcare and so on but they keep to their direction. They have a direction and that is what sustains most of them. Is that a "pre-existing socially recognised career path"?

That is why I used the word "DIRECTION" - but I don't recall defining it in any way. My own CV is extremely colourful to say the least and I left school at 15 with nothing - not so much as a piece of paper. Who says anyone has to conform to anything? But likewise when someone has drive and passion and committment for their chosen direction why should they conform to other people's hang-ups about qualifications or life paths or indeed so-called "western" medicine?

For me in Rose's reading 61.2 was what I referred to as "a calling" - 18.6 which was about her interview behaviour (not her direction) I referred to as vocation - something a bit different to calling.

But for me the defining thing in Rose's thread is her passion, committment and great intelligence in her chosen direction and that made me smile - like I said it is delightful and will get her where she wants and indeed needs to go. And to me it appears the lines echo that.

Or I suppose we could tell her to give it all a miss and try reiki

nice to see you back Trojan.........

Lucia

 

[meng]

Or I suppose we could tell her to give it all a miss and try reiki

Or i ching consultant. :bag:

Sure would be nice to hear more from Rose.

 

[willowfox]

Sure would be nice to hear more from Rose.

Why? Rose knows exactly where she wants to go and what she wants to achieve, so what more do you want to hear or know?

 

[hilary]

Oh, come on, Willowfox. See the name of the forum, and work it out.

 

[ginnie]

I love quietly passionate, dynamic, somewhat driven people - channelled wisely it is an amazing force to contend with and oh so creative. I work in a profession where putting words like obsessive and driven on your CV will get interest... people who don't work like that are amazed that these things are seen as a plus.

Lucia

We are not all the same

 

[ginnie]

For me in Rose's reading 61.2 was what I referred to as "a calling" - 18.6 which was about her interview behaviour (not her direction) I referred to as vocation - something a bit different to calling.
Lucia

A calling in the sense of 61.2 is a quality of communication, like a tone. Rose's writing called out to us and touched our hearts.

 

[lucia]

Ginnie

We are not all the same

What a strange thing to say - whoever has said that we are all the same? Certainly not me so what is your point may I ask? Or am I missing something?

Lucia

 

[bamboo]

We are not all the same

Indeed,we re not.

BUt a passionate calling is always a possession in great measure. It flies on the wings of inspiration and enthusiasm. An I ching reading ought NEVER to be interpreted as saying "give up your passion"...only examined for what one needs to know while they pursue it.

 

[ginnie]

What a strange thing to say - whoever has said that we are all the same? Certainly not me so what is your point may I ask? Or am I missing something?
Lucia

I mean I am trying to read the lines of the I Ching. I don't know Rose, but I believe I know quite a bit about the lines the Yi gave to Rose. I haven't ever met Rose. I don't know what country Rose lives in or hardly anything about her. I cannot personally counsel Rose, in other words. But I believe that the I Ching can help Rose, just as it has helped me.

Everybody dreams of being happy. And most people dream of being happy sometime in the future. Don't we already know that a career cannot bring happiness and that external circumstances don't make a person happy? Please don't get me wrong. I don't have anything against passionate drives, obsessions, careers, or people making their dreams into realities. It all depends on what's underneath all the words.

There are so many factors contending here at the same time that it must make it seem to newcomers that the I Ching is nonsense and not worth pursuing, when we all know that is not true.

 

[ginnie]

BTW I'm saying this out of context of Roses situation just wanted to pick up on your comment about taking 41 in very different ways. I used to think it meant 'sacrifice something for this goal' and now i see it more as sacrifice the goal itself and diminish your passion over the goal

Yeah, I'm seeing it that way more now, too.

Regarding the cell phone thing: I only wanted a cell phone because other people have them. I'm already paying for a land line and I mostly work from home. Nobody has any trouble reaching me.

There are still a few holdouts like myself who realize we don't actually need cell phones. My husband and a lot of health professionals think people will all be getting brain tumors from them. I don't have an opinion about that. If I buy a cell phone in the future, I'll wear it on my hip. The way I see people always holding these glowing devices in their hands everywhere they go, even in darkened movie theaters, it reminds me of the way people used to take their cigarettes everywhere they went . . . We used to smoke in the movies at one time, too.

 

[lucia]

Well, I still dont get why you quoted me with something unrelated to your comment and I also don't get why you think that "competing factors" are a problem (whatever they are supposed to be - do you mean people who disagree with you) ?

I always thought they are a part of the forum deal and I just ignore the extreme ones or the wacky ones If you invite everyone to tea you will always end up with at least some fruitcake and occasionally a slice of lemon! C'est la puta vida no?

Are you saying we should all conform to one particular definitive interpretation for fear of putting off the new ones? And whose interpretation would that be?

Don't we already know that a career cannot bring happiness and that external circumstances don't make a person happy?

I don't recall anyone talking about happiness in this thread only about reasons for interview flunking etc. And one doesn't have to know Rose or her blood group to see her commitment and passion and intelligence for her chosen field. That's what her questions were about. She also has used her thread well and reaffirmed her motivation by gracefully bouncing off the negative responses. Cool.

And whilst we're at it what the hell is happiness () ?- Lots of things make me happy and dare I say it some of them are deliciously external.................

but now this thread's gone way off track

ho hum tumty tum

Lucia

 

[ginnie]

Putting Our Heads Together

I also don't get why you think that "competing factors" are a problem (whatever they are supposed to be - do you mean people who disagree with you) ?

I always thought they are a part of the forum deal and I just ignore the extreme ones or the wacky ones If you invite everyone to tea you will always end up with at least some fruitcake and occasionally a slice of lemon! C'est la puta vida no?

Are you saying we should all conform to one particular definitive interpretation for fear of putting off the new ones? And whose interpretation would that be?
Lucia

I do see your point, Lucia. You prefer contentious Internet environments . . .

I'll put myself in the shoes of a newcomer. My goal in posting any question here is to get some clarity, some direction, about a burning issue in my own life. Why do newcomers show up here? To witness altercations taking place between people claiming how right they are and how other people are wrong?

Beginners often think the I Ching is incomprehensible. Yi will give the beginner the same lines that it would give you or me. I have never seen Yi condescending to anybody. It can tell me to go when I don't feel like moving. More often it will tell me to wait when I'm all fired up with enthusiasm to get going. It gives messages that can be distinctly counter-intuitive.

This being the case, since there are always going to be differences of interpretation, I consider myself to be a perpetual learner, a perpetual student of the I Ching, helped by others who have worked on these issues, too. Most days when I sit down with the I Ching, I have to hand maybe fifteen or twenty versions, translations and commentaries, to use. They are all valuable to me and I learn constantly from each and every one of them, without exception.

 

[bamboo]

Dear Rose, if you are still here!.....

In your response as to why you didnt make the interview, I see the 18 with all those lines being more about a solid message for needing to repair the techniques for interviewing...51..it was a shock to blow it.

as for 61.1.2.6 to 8
Well there are some who advise that in three changing lines, the middle one is most important....61.2 (a true calling from the heart) changing to 8 (joining the group)
I would see this as very positive.

as for the 41...well you asked about what you needed to know about the 8...To me, IMO, line 41 is about paring down to the essentials. I love the way 41 and 61.2 seem to blend....when there is a call from the heart, everything else must take second place. 41 is very rarely about a resigned sort of 'giving up' in my experience.In fact, to me it is more often about the pure heart, the plain and simple truth, the true love that is a humble lowborn thing, "a thing to walk with hand-in-hand through the everydayness of this workday world...letting not one heartbeat go astray..."

If this field is your passion, the voice you hear calling for you, then you go for it! you'll get there. next time you interview, you will have repaired the leaks and you can succeed.
all the best!

 

[rose]

What does it mean.

What does it mean.

What does it mean.

For everyday that I have not replied in this thread, this has been my thoughts before I drift to sleep and there in my waking moments. I have been a silent observer of my own thread. Honestly, the comments have overwhelmed me. I still do not understand what Yi tells me. I have not gone Aha that’s what Im being told by Yi. What do I react to? In my quest for my dream I do not want to be blind to things I do not want to see. There is none so blind than the man who will not see. I do not react as I do not want to give power to negative thoughts. One thing my dad thought me to use in the face of negativity ages ago was to silently say “Just because you say so does not make it so”.

I have laid bare my dream, it’s my dream. It deserves no justification. More than a dream, I feel a calling. Felt it for far too long. A decade has passed, this is not about career or happiness or money. This is about my life purpose. I don’t have an answer why Im drawn to this. This is one thing I feel so passionately about. I have faced ups and downs, but this dream has stayed. It is part of who I am. And I believe in it. Yi to me is a benevolent oracle. I do not believe it will ask me to give up my truth. If at all, it has taught me that myself is what I can work on. I have asked relationship Q’s asking “Will xyz and I get back together” and I know that Yi answers straight. There has to be respect for free will, I cannot ask for advice on how to change someone’s feelings for me. Just believing with all my heart xyz and I should be together doesn’t make it so. I know I cannot undermine the free will of others, which is why I believe greatly in mine. I only have the power to change my course.

So here is the case,

as to why I didn’t get through at that institution, I clearly understand it as corruption from within at various levels leading to shock. 18.6 might indeed ask for me to consider where this path might lead…but this Q was in regards to not getting into this particular institution…so I wonder might it be a question of the path at this particular university. I felt they were looking for set answers at the interview, and not interested to know me for who I was. I had a feeling about this after the interview and recall thinking how miserable it might be involving myself in this sort of group.

Whenever I think of Hex 41, and decrease I cant help but feel it points to some sort of sacrifice. Studying for the exam again requires me to give up so much. My free time, my weekends, money, there is SO much of sacrifice involved, studying and preparing for the exam, joining a study group etc will indeed be a time of decrease for me. I have to go quiet and focus on my studying. If Yi wanted to give me Hex 41, it would have done it straight up. I got Hex 41 after asking for clarifying on Hex 8, joining the group. To join this group, it’s indeed true much sacrifice in a period of decrease is called for.

Maybe I shouldn’t have asked if I would get into Med in 2011. It’s like asking to know the future…

I think the most important Q is if it is the right path for me. It was scary to ask that Q cos what if it wasn’t? 13(4,6)--> 63 still doesn’t resonate with me yet. I still cant make the connection. Im hoping one day it will.

xx
rose

 

[willowfox]

Most days when I sit down with the I Ching, I have to hand maybe fifteen or twenty versions, translations and commentaries, to use. They are all valuable to me and I learn constantly from each and every one of them, without exception.

I seriously doubt that you do learn anything from your 15 to 20 books, judging by some of your replies.
A million books won't help you find the answer if you plainly don't understand what even a single text is telling you.

The answer ultimately lies in one's brain and not on a piece of paper.

 

[maremaria]

Im hoping one day it will.

xx
rose

Hi Rose,

Can't offer you any answer to your questions , sorry, but wanted to tell you that I like a lot your post. You expressed your self in a beautiful way and I believe, if i'm allowwd to say that, that you will find the answers. From here it looks that you have already find some of them.

Good luck !
Maria

 

[ginnie]

What does it mean.

A decade has passed, this is not about career or happiness or money. This is about my life purpose.

. . I wonder might it be a question of the path at this particular university. I felt they were looking for set answers at the interview, and not interested to know me for who I was. I had a feeling about this after the interview and recall thinking how miserable it might be involving myself in this sort of group.

I think the most important Q is if it is the right path for me. It was scary to ask that Q cos what if it wasn’t? 13(4,6)--> 63 still doesn’t resonate with me yet.

Regarding your interview: An interview works both ways. White the medical school people were interviewing you, you were also interviewing them. Looks like they failed the interview in your eyes. Therefore: Is there another school you might apply to that is run along different lines, a school more in accord with the way you see yourself and your mission in life?

13.4.6 > 63 is indeed very interesting, about your path in life.

13.4 speaks about a wall. You climb a wall. Why do you climb a wall? Because you have disagreements with other people. If you climb a wall to protect yourself, then you will be unassailable. Nobody will be able to get to you. You know you are right, and the enemy cannot get to you. Understanding the nature and strength of the enemy, you find yourself unable to attack. So you settle down in that position. You are an upright person in a somewhat difficult position. However, nobody will be able to get you off that wall.

13.6. This is how I interpret this line, Rose:

Male medical students often get married and start to have children even when they are still doing their residencies. Since you are a woman, you must realize that you are not going to be able to have children while going to medical school. If you become a physician, you may never have time for a husband and children.

Of course, these days many alternative lifestyles are possible and Yi hasn't said this specifically. But I feel Yi is trying to bring some of these issues out into the open so that you will know the implications of your decisions. Your calling in life may carry you far beyond traditional family life to a place we call the fellowship of man, or the unity of all men. Even though your natural desire for close association may never be fulfilled, line 13.6 says that you will end up with feeling no regrets about this.

Let nothing remain in the shadows. Yi can be your constant companion and assistant.

 

[ginnie]

The answer ultimately lies in one's brain and not on a piece of paper.

This is true.

The I Ching is really a series of dots and dashes, like the Morse Code, isn't it? No words at all! It took Chinese priests several thousand years to write down what they thought the patterns meant, and in the process they invented writing and literature in China.

I just happen to like books. I'm not saying that everybody has to like them.

 

[ginnie]

Rose is already a writer

Hi Rose,

Can't offer you any answer to your questions , sorry, but wanted to tell you that I like a lot your post. You expressed your self in a beautiful way . . .Maria

I know that Rose wants to be a doctor, but she is already a writer. Maybe she's a poet. Everything Rose writes goes straight to the heart.

 

[maremaria]

I think its because she talks straight from her heart. ( 61.2) And everything that springs from there is nothing less than a masterpiece

 

[willowfox]

T
I just happen to like books. I'm not saying that everybody has to like them.

And when you learn something then you will be able to helpfully comment on peoples readings won't you?

Until then, keep up the reading but try and understand what you are reading as well.

 

[willowfox]

This is true.

The I Ching is really a series of dots and dashes, like the Morse Code, isn't it? No words at all! It took Chinese priests several thousand years to write down what they thought the patterns meant, and in the process they invented writing and literature in China.

I see that you have no understanding of even what I wrote by your silly answer, so how on earth do you think that you understand the I Ching?

Your misunderstanding of even the most simple of things is appalling for a person who is supposed to be giving advice. Then you stubbornly stand by your mistakes.

Giving negative advice when the situation is positive is not on and then rudely asking all kinds of personal questions of Rose is absolutely distasteful.

I just cannot sit idly while you roam around this forum giving BS advice, you are getting more outrageous with each reading you attempt.

When I gave Rose a positive reading you quickly followed me with a very negative reading, I suspect you did this on purpose to hurt, but luckily, Rose did not go down your path of doom and despondency and I am so glad.
Others on here also can see that the advice you have being giving and still are giving is highly suspect and not to be listened to.

 

[ginnie]

And when you learn something then you will be able to helpfully comment on peoples readings won't you?

Until then, keep up the reading but try and understand what you are reading as well.

I regard those as being hostile comments directed towards me personally.

Why does Wf hate every single post I write?

Is that my problem?

 

[bamboo]

If you become a physician, you may never have time for a husband and children.

I have to object, Ginnie, that this is just NOT true. MY gosh, I have contless examples of women I know who combine family life with being a physician. It is absolutely possible and from what i see, even can be fun. some couples I know have joint practices out of their home offices

 

[willowfox]

I regard those as being hostile comments directed towards me personally.

Why does Wf hate every single post I write?

Is that my problem?

Yes, it is your problem, just look at bamboo's post above. Making a sweeping statement that Rose would have no time for romance or family is simply outrageous.

Each post you say something really strange and "wrong".

I am not alone with my criticism as we all can see, but I suppose Hilary will delete my posts yet again and gloss over your obvious mistakes and the wrong advice that you keep handing out, and your sarky replies when you are taken to task over your words.
You have a habit of giving doubtful advice, I can show numerous examples but people here can look back and see for themselves.

 

[rosada]

Sounds like a good question for the I Ching, Ginnie!

Meanwhile perhaps it would be helpful to look at it this way:
Willowfox's comments are obviously so inappropriate that if she meant for you to take them personally she would be banned from this site. As she is still allowed to post, this must be a sign her comments are not intended for you or any of us to give any personal attention to. Just read them and wonder at the many faces of God...

Rosada

Bamboo,
Thank you for your straight forward counter to Ginnie's interpretation. You've given us a much needed example of how we can debate messages without shooting the messenger.
r.

 

[hilary]

I regard those as being hostile comments directed towards me personally.

Why does Wf hate every single post I write?

Is that my problem?

No, it really isn't.