Phrasing a question re: salary increase

[elizabeth]

can you explain how you arrived at that particular week? and doesn't it in any case still piont to me waiting (longer term, like minimum one month, max until next year)?

 

[willowfox]

Hi,
I quickly knocked up a chart for your question and it gave me those dates as good but if you want to wait longer then no problem, another window would open in December. It is around those dates, like maybe 3 days either side, or less.

 

[jesed]

Hi willowfox

First, I hope you don't take this as an attack. But just a way to bring objectivity to this discussion

As i always had say: reality (facts) is the best teacher.

Let's see one fact:
a) When elizabeth asked if she would get a rise if she ask for it BEFORE the end of september..you answered.."go for it". (It means, ask before the end of september)

b) Then, when Elizabeth talked about why she was in doubt, you answered "don't be a chicken"

c) Then, I suggested to her that asking before the end of september would be futil...and suggested her to made a "dialogue".

d) From that dialogue, I suggested october-novemeber; and you predicted february. (There is a diference between suggest and predict)

e) Now, you say October 12 or December.

So... you first say..ask now (as a definitive fact), don't be a chicken...and then you recogniced that now is not a good time for ask.

Therefore:
1) You made a definitive advice (go for it), and then you needed to change your advice (february), and change it angain (October 12).

b) You DID insult the consultan (dont' be a chicken...for not following your advice)

Of course, I must recognice (and I had no trouble to do it) that myself had made mistake in my interpretations ( I recall one case in this forum, about someone that wanted to move into an apartment; and one case in the forum where I belogn about the name of the sucesor of Pope JPII). I recognize this, to show that this is not an ego issue, just to be honest with reality.

Best wishes

 

[willowfox]

Hi jesed,

yes, you are quite right about the answer that I gave to Elizabeth, about the first increase question. I did indeed say go for it, I will explain more fully later, we thought everything was okay where she worked, when in actual fact it wasn't. Trouble with wages, contract, which she did not mention until later. Anyway, if you study the hex that she received, you will see that no harm would have befallen her had she asked, straight away, but she did not. But it was only later that we all learnt that she could not ask for a raise anyway because her boss is in the USA. Chicken has no serious implications or meanings in the context used here, she said that she was afraid of being rejected, she needed encouragement to face her own doubts.
Okay, then she asked about time, and I gave her the best time using my methods. Then she asked a third question, which gave the answer, that if she waited, then her chances of success would be assured.
What you don't know and I didn't mention was when I used another divinatory method it showed quite clearly that she would not receive a raise anytime soon, therefore by telling her to go for it, I knew nothing was going to happen with the raise, it was all talk and no action. Basically by saying yes to her question, it gave her something to work towards. She knew that she will indeed get a raise but now the problem of when and how entered her mind. Elizabeth is not a person who jumps without thinking, so please rest assured that no harm would have befallen her, for the simple reason, I knew that she would not act straight away.
Yes I gave her definite advice to go for it but it was a seed, something to sort out for herself, something to aim for. When Nasa said they would go to the Moon, they did not go the next day, they waited and made a plan, so it is with Elizabeth. She maybe hasty in thought but she is not hasty in deed. She is careful in her actions.

 

[willowfox]

Hi again jesed,

I have just noticed that you have made a mistake, October the 12th (and December) is NOT about wage increases, it is about the right time to approach the owner of the apartment where she is now living with a view to discussing the purchase of that apartment. Please read my posts more carefully.
Hex 23.4 indicates the time between 28th of Sept and the 4th of October, it is inauspicious. Elizabeth said that she planned to talk with her landlady that week about purchasing her apartment. I think it is a bad idea, that is why I suggested that she should wait until to around the 12th of October, say between the 10th to the 14th. December is just another good time to approach the landlady, thats it.

 

[elizabeth]

HI there-

Willow fox, you just answered one question that I had in reading these last posts, and that was whether the Oct 12 date was for the raise or the apartment issue. Not to confuse things -- this thread and these hexes were only aimed at answering the raise question, and I didnt mean to intertwine the two.

One thing does concern me though: what I include in my posts, intentionally, is minimal personal details/ information bc I want to see what the Yi says. Obviously, I know the details of my own situation -- to list them all on the board incites people to give me personal advice -- and, while grateful for any support given, I'm actually really more interested in what the Yi has to say, cut and dried, black and white (or as defined as possible) without the details of my situation intruding on the interpretation. I mean I am happy to provide context if it will clarify a reading or help me define how to ask the Yi a question but... for example:

My boss is in the USA. But so what? He is there, will be there, and I can stay in this job for ten years and he will still be there and I will (if i stay in the job) still be here. THe reality then is that this doesnt affect my question at all, because it is already a given constant. Because regardless, I will have to ask for a raise -- or for anything else-- via phone or email. Therefore I wanted to know (still want to know) when the best time to ask for a raise from him is...Do you see what I'm getting at? His being there doesnt relate to the hexes unless the hex were to say something that told me I can only ask him in person..which would tell me to book a flight to the US...etc. Does this make sense?

Also, just for the record, I'm not interested in taking advice from astrology at this time. I have nothing against it -- but I'm on this board for the Yi Ching, so I really want to keep the focus of my readings on what it has to say as opposed to other forms of divination.

Anyway -- again thanks for the help with interpretations. Jesed, check your personal email. Happy weekend to all!

Cheers,
Elizabeth

 

[willowfox]

Hi Elizabeth,


you completely misunderstood why I brought your boss into the conversation with jesed. I was talking to jesed about the time factor in your question about a raise, how it was impossible for you to ask for a raise straight away because there was nobody to ask. Please read what jesed wrote and then reread my answer to him, then you will get a better understanding of what I was on about.
October 12th (10th-14th) the time to talk to your landlady, only, nothing else.
We have both given you what we consider good times to ask for a raise, what more do you want to know? If you are in another country then you approach via mail. Jesed has his method and I have mine, which says for you to wait until next year. Of course, it is your discision at the end of the day.

 

[jesed]

I want to say 3 things

1.-
Willowfox wrote:
"Anyway, if you study the hex that she received, you will see that no harm would have befallen her had she asked, straight away, but she did not"

I fully disagree; even I told about the risk in my first comment:

In traditional teachings, 42 points that you have reached the top of what you can achieve. So, you have 2 choices: a) conserve what you have..or b) decay

The attempt to get more that what you have, when you are in "42" is go beyond the middle way, is an excess...and decay comes.

Decay is harm.

2.- I didn't need to know anything about the concrete situation (the boss in other country) to wrote:

4.- The aspect that represent the boss is the father aspect (autority). It is Rooster and it is hidden under line 3. That means the boss is like absent for the issue

3.- Say to someone "don't be a chicken" is calling her/him a coward. That is an insult

But, for me, that's it in this thread. Elizabeth has the choice...actually, she always had it (not because we say so, but because that is reality)

Best wishes

 

[willowfox]

Hi jesed,

it seems to me that it is you that are changing your interpretation of hex 42.

What are *you* now saying? That Elizabeth will not get a raise? Are you now saying no raise for Elizabeth because a time of decay/ harm has come? Please tell her this answer.

I also disagree with you because decay does not set in straight away but after a period of time, it is important to work to make the best use of the time because as I see it, after she gets the raise, then the story is ended (decay of the story if you like, completed).

I would be very interested in learn how you find your months and years in the hexs because I have studied Chinese astrology and the only way it works is to know the time of birth, the day, month and year of birth. Are people giving you this information secretly or something? Please explain. If you do not have the personal details of the querant, then the results that you may get are completely meaningless. How do you get roosters, cows, snakes etc from the lines of the hex?

We all know that the boss was somewhere else, but how is line 3 involved and where did you get a rooster from?

Why are you still talking about the chicken issue after I expained to you very carefully that it was not meant as an insult, please read my explanation again.

Also, are you now happy with the business about October, December and February, they are two seperate issues.

 

[jesed]

1.- If you read carefully, I didn't change my interpretation. 42 was about asking BEFORE the end of septemeber; and I wrote not ask before the end of septemeber.

2.- Chinese astrology is one of the 5 arts; Yijing is another one. It is an error to mix them. In traditional teachings, there are 3 kinds of "luck": Heaven (astrology), earth (feng shui and geomancy) and man (yijing)

For astrology, there are several methods: the 2 most importants are Ba Zi (called the 4 pillars of destiny), Zi Wei Do Shou (called Purple Star). For those methods, you need to know the year, month, day, hour, place and gender of birth.

But in my comments I don't use astrology calculations, so I don't need to know those facts of birth

2.- About how I made calendaric calculations, that depends on the method I use to undertand a Yijing answer.
I use 2 methods: traditional (based on the text analysis) and mathematical (based on 5 stages of change, 10 heavely branches and 12 earthly stems)

I had posted several times in this forum how I derivate calendaric calculations in traditional method (seek it with the search tool)

About the mathematical method, (and there is where you use the 12 animals, linked to the 12 earthly stems), you can start studying it with the book of Master Raymond Lo, or better with the 1-year teach of Master Joseph Yu.

Best wishes

 

[willowfox]

Hi jesed,

I am afraid that I still disagree because you are using Chinese astrology (heaven), the branches, stems etc. are to do with astrology. Anyway, the Chinese astrology which you are using cannot be used for asking flimsy questions about something that a person is only thinking about. That is why the Chinese use the I Ching and some other oracles because there is no need to take the question of time into consideration.

If a person tells you that they asked the question at 9pm, then you must find out where in the world they live because of the time difference. 9pm where they live maybe 9am where you live. If you gave them an answer based on the 9pm the the answer that you gave would be very wrong. As I told you before, I have studied Chinese astrology (heaven) and it certainly does not work by taking any time at random.

I also asked you to explain how a single line can represent a snake or rooster but you did not tell me. I understand that the trigrams can represent animals ,time and many other things but not a single line. And as for each line representing a month etc, I am sorry but I don't think that is correct.

You will find, if you check, that a large number of Chinese diviners completely disagree with Raymond Lo's method, they say that it has no base in reality, ie not correct. Anyway, Raymond Lo is a Feng Shui adviser not really an astrologer at all. So are you now hinting that you are using Feng Shui to answer questions about peoples lives. Are you using Feng Shui to do your forecasts? Or are you using astrology(heaven)?

As for Joseph Yu, he has written the following two books, "A Complete Idiots Guide to Feng Shui", and "A Complete Idiots Guide To I Ching". I am afraid that many critics do not think highly of these books, in fact knowledgable people would never ever consult these types of books that are aimed at the public who know nothing about Feng Shui or the I Ching. His books are a whitewash of the subjects he is writing about, in fact they have no substance, no depth, they are not to be taken seriously at all. They are for the masses who find the real I Ching and the real Feng Shui far to difficult to comprehend, thus the title "A Complete Idiots Guide". Again, basically another Feng Shui artist.

Originally Posted by jesed
"In traditional teachings, 42 points that you have reached the top of what you can achieve. So, you have 2 choices: a) conserve what you have..or b) decay
The attempt to get more that what you have, when you are in "42" is go beyond the middle way, is an excess...and decay comes."

This says to me that you are now saying that she will not get a raise. You are saying she has reached the top of what she can achieve, gone beyond the middle way. The attempt to ask for a raise is an excess, to do it brings decay/harm.
It is you that who are changing their interpretation. You said that she would get a raise but the above statement quite clearly says that you are now saying that she will not get a raise, and to ask would harm her position in the job.

 

[willowfox]

Hi jesed,

I have read your explanation about calendar calculations.

You are dividing 365 days by 8 ( the 8 trigrams) this gives an answer of 45.625 days for each trigram. Why 8 when the Chinese use the Moon? You go on to say that this time period of 45.625 days, trigram, represents exactly the same months for every year. But that is wrong because the Chinese calendar is a floating system, not a fixed system like the western calendar. Therefore, the time periods would most certainly vary from year to year, each year the months would be slightly different, giving different answers. You cannot mix the Chinese and Western calendars together, one is lunar and the other is solar. Also, how in your method do you narrow the time down to be more precise? 45 days is a lot of days for doing something in. As you may know, that not everyday is a fortunate day and some of the days in that 45 day period will be really unfortunate for any undertakings of any kind. There is no such thing as a blanket of 45 days of pure good luck. Every important action requires a time, a few days, a day, an hour but you cannot extend this period to 45 days. If I wanted to open a new shop, your system would give me 45 days to do it in, well that is complete nonsense. And in your system, if my trigrams indicated bad luck for 90 to say, 180 for days for instance, then it would mean that I would be unable to open my shop for a very long time. Hmmmmm.

No where does it state in any text books, that each line can represent months and also rooster, snakes etc. like you have stated.

What exactly is a "general diagnosis" question? Post heaven order? One having fire to the south? What have these things to do with forecasting the time when something may happen or it is a good or bad time to start an undertaking.

 

[willowfox]

Hi jesed,

the method that I use, when using the hexs to represent time, is attributed to Fu Hsi and his circular diagram. It is based on the Chinese calendar. This method can give you a six day period of time that is not fixed from year to year. It can on occasion be narrowed down to give a single day for an answer.

Horary astrology which I also use can give you a very specific time to use. Horary astrology gives a picture of the position of the planets at the time of the understanding of the question. Chinese astrology has no such method. Again, that is why the Chinese use the I Ching and other oracles to answer such questions of the mind.

 

[willowfox]

Hi,

I just noticed that you have made yet another mistake.

The correct way is 10 heavenly stems and 12 earthly branches ( animal signs). You have got it the wrong way around.

Zi Wei Dou Shu is the purple emperor (not purple star)and is a lunar astrology system.

Feng Shui uses 360 degrees of a circle, it also uses 8 directions but when you divide 360 by 8 it gives a clean answer of 45 degrees. How is it possible to use the 8 different directions to get 8 trigrams which represent 45 days? How is it possible that you have turned the 45 degrees of a circle into 45 days? How is it possible to take the hour and day and year of the *question* and somehow get an answer using your heavenly stems and earthly branches? Stems and branches are found from the date and place of birth of the person, not of a question. How come you never need to know where the person is in the world when you are answering their queries using astrology/feng shui.

Also, every Chinese year starts with a different animal and element, so every year is not fixed like you say.

 

[jesed]

Hi Willowfox

You are right, I mixed the names (branches/stems) due to my lack of English (as anyone can see only with reading my comments, English is not my natural lenguage)

About the way you confuse Astrology, fengshui and Yinjing, I started another thread.

Best wishes

 

[willowfox]

Hi jesed,

seen new thread and answered, thank you.

Can you please answer the problem that I am having with you interpretation.

Originally Posted by jesed
"In traditional teachings, 42 points that you have reached the top of what you can achieve. So, you have 2 choices: a) conserve what you have..or b) decay
The attempt to get more that what you have, when you are in "42" is go beyond the middle way, is an excess...and decay comes."

This says to me that you are now saying that she will not get a raise. You are saying she has reached the top of what she can achieve, gone beyond the middle way. The attempt to ask for a raise is an excess, to do it brings decay/harm.
It is you that who are changing their interpretation. You said that she would get a raise but the above statement quite clearly says that you are now saying that she will not get a raise, and to ask would harm her position in the job.

 

[jesed]

I had already answered that

42 was the answer about asking BEFORE the end of september. So, my comment was not ask BEFORE the end of september.

That doesn't imply that she can not get a rise LATER the end of september

I understandthe answer at the light of the question. If the question includes a time refence, the answer aplies only during that time reference. In this case, 42 is only for the time before the end of september.

When she made a more open question, not narrowed to a time reference, she got a positive answer.

Best wishes

 

[willowfox]

Hi jesed,

hex 42 does not signify a time before the end of September. In fact hex 42 signifys a time in January. But you said that she could not get a raise because now decay had set in. Decrease is not followed by increase. The answer given hex 42 is an open answer, there is nothing here to say what time is right or wrong. So where does it say not get a raise in September?
Therefore, you are sayings not to chase after a raise, you wrote; "Originally Posted by jesed
"In traditional teachings, 42 points that you have reached the top of what you can achieve. So, you have 2 choices: a) conserve what you have..or b) decay
The attempt to get more that what you have, when you are in "42" is go beyond the middle way, is an excess...and decay comes."
Yes, you answered the question but your interpretation says no but your mouth now says yes, which is correct.

 

[jesed]

Not, the time reference (as I had told you many times) was in the original question:

"If i ask my boss for the salary increase to X amount before the end of September, will it be completely successful"

So, the time reference of the answer was narrowed by the consultant; and therefore, more open tools for time calculations don't apply.

That is a basic rule¡¡

My answers had been consistent. Not ask before the end of september; ask later (best posibility between october-november; but in any case no later than January 31, 2007)

Read better, my friend

Best wishes

 

[willowfox]

Hi jesed,

I lost my glasses the day of the question, my eyesight is not so good theses days.