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Resigning ourselves to four more years of Trump. 13.1 > 33

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Freedda

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In another thread about Trump's breakfasts, someone postulated that perhaps ... 'the healthiest thing for people to do is to resign ourselves to four more years of Trump.' Based on this, I decided to pose a new query:

Tell us what we need to know about 'resigning ourselves to four more years of Trump'

13.1 > 33 - People in Harmony - Retreating

Hexagram 13, People in Harmoy

The oracle for 13 says, 'People in harmony in the wilds: creating success. Fruitful to cross the great river. A noble one's constancy bears fruit.' Line 13.1 say 'People in harmony at the gate. Not a mistake.'

33 the resulting hexagram says, 'Retreat, creating success. Constancy yields a small harvest.'

Altogether this sound like the Yi is suggesting that we all need to resign ourselves to four more years of Trump.

We need to be behind our prez. - in fellowship with him - both at home and abroad: in the wilds and at the gates. The 'gates' suggest to me that by resigning ourselves - and by 'retreating' from our petty, biased gripes about Trump - that we can gain a new perspective, so we can be ready for when the gates open to new opportunities and also to new challenges (at our gates a.k.a. our borders!); we need to support him as he faces the biased media and those liberal, socialist globalist who want to weaken our nation.

So, with our support, Trump's 'constancy bears fruit.' And if the liberals continue to fight him, he will still achieve victories for our great nation, but they will not be as great (and that hurts us all).

Best, D.
 
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moss elk

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Freedda,
I'm concerned you may be getting too far in to character and that we'll have to get out the butterfly net and tranq you for your own safety.
 

foxx777

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I hope everyone realizes that I never said anyone should rally behind him. Resigning yourself to 4 more years (as I recall doing with W Bush) is a far cry from rallying. I’ve spent my life resigning myself to situations which were horrendous and wrong, and that I would have changed in a heartbeat if I could have.

In any case all are welcome to keep fighting Trump, but that’s certainly no guarantee that we’ll be rid of him before 2024.
 
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Freedda

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I hope everyone realizes that I never said anyone should rally behind him.
I'ts good that you're clariftying your postion, but I never meant for my reading to imply anything about what you said. I just thought it was an interesting idea, and therefore decided to do a new query about it. I did it in a new thread so I wouldn't 'muddy the waters' - as they say - of the other discussion.

Best, D.
 

Trojina

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Freedda,
I'm concerned you may be getting too far in to character and that we'll have to get out the butterfly net and tranq you for your own safety.


I think that time is already upon us. Who's going to shoot the tranq dart you or me ?
 

moss elk

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Let's ask the president to do it,
he says he has the bestest aim of anyone in history, and that his darts are the most darty of any darts in the world.

Not unlike a fart, this rotten man-child has permeated everywhere and everything.
 
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Freedda

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Freedda, I'm concerned you may be getting too far in to character and that we'll have to get out the butterfly net and tranq you for your own safety.
Well, isn't that just like a liberal to want to trap and tranquilize someone for expressing their opinions! o_O But not to worry, my deeply-held liberal, left-wing roots (and wings) are still intact and don't need clipping.

What I am doing here, or trying to do:

1) ... is show how people often bring their own biases to a reading, so much so that they don't pay any attention to what the Yi is saying - as I did in my Trump's Breakfast thread. I hope that at least a few people saw the disconnect between what the Yi's response was, and what I was making it say (and 'disconnect' is way too weak a word for the BS I was spouting!).

But I fear, before the day is done, we'll get another 'my opinion = the Yi's' thread, again bashing trump, or johnson, or whomever we think the 'other' or the barbarian is, e.g. not of our tribe. And I'm sure that all my comments, and protests, and ironic threads about it are not going to change that: people are still going to make the Yi be their sock puppet. and say what they want it to say.

2) I was also trying to show how quite often, when it comes to politics and Trump in particular, that the people reading and responding to a thread also don't pay any atttention to the reading, but instead take it as an opportunity to further their own views and agendas.

3) ... with this specifc reading, I was trying to point out how, even in a serious and legitimate way, we can make the Yi match our own opinions and views. I don't really think that we should resign ourselves to four more years of Trump, but at the same time, I can say it was not really a 'stretch' to come up with this reading, and I think that my interpretation has some basis in the Yi's response, and is certainly more legitimate than many that I've read bashing Trump.

When I see how divisive our nation and world has become, I can't help question if what I'm seeing on this forum is adding to that, even if it's based on opinions I might agree with? There seems to be some group-think here that assumes that we are all liberal, Trump- and Johnson-haters and that it's okay to freely bash these people.

And I wonder, if Trump and company are really being as divisive as we say they are, aren't we just stooping to their level? I mean, what if there was somone here who happend to be less liberal than I, or even supported Trump - do I think that all we're spouting here would either change their mind or make them feel welcome on this forum?

I have, for example, been called out a few times - and rightfully so - for making comments that were attacks 'to the person' (ad hominem) on this forum, and were not about legitimately questioning what others were saying. That said, it feels to me that much of the Trump, Inc. bashing I see here has some of the same feel as my inappropriate postings do. But then again, maybe the 'lessons' - whatever they are, and which I think others should be learning from - are really meant for me?

Best, D.
 
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Freedda

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Freedda said:
it's okay to freely bash these people ...
Bashing Trump is a sacred duty.
Hello Moss Elk. Actually, what I said is ...
'....There seems to be some group-think here that assumes that we are all liberal, Trump- and Johnson-haters and that it's okay to freely bash these people ....'

I don't mind that we discuss and / or argue these points. I'd only ask that you not quote me out of context.

And to clarify, I know that we bring our own understanding, and world views, and slant on things to our queries. But my objection is when we are so biased or prejudice that we turn the Yi into a 'sock puppet' and have it mimic what we want it to say - and we pay no attention to what it is actually saying.

I'd like the Yi to remain the Yi, and not become a Lambchop to my Sherri, nor a Monk to my Nina Conti! That's what I think Trump might do.
 

moss elk

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Hi Freedda, I didn't intend to put meaning in your mouth.

I simply latched on to that phrase,
and since rump isn't a forum member,
exercised my freedom to enthusiastically bash him.
 

beatpoet

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One thing is for sure... The translation of Yi of "noble one" is sure to give anyone liberal or otherwise a pause...

:)

beatpoet.
 

Lavalamp

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"What do we need to know about 'resigning ourselves to four more years of Trump'?"
13 -- Union of Forces
13.1 - Commentary -
Legge: Line one shows the first attempts at union. It is dynamic, but in the lowest place, and has no proper correlate above. There is however, no selfishness in his intent. He has all the world before him with which to unite. Selfish thoughts concerning union have no place in him.
Siu: At the outset, attempts are made at open friendship.
Wing: The times are such that a group of people all shares the same needs. They can come together openly with the same goals in mind. This is the beginning of a fellowship. Until the interests of the individuals become divergent all will go well.

33 - the context is "Retreat."

So maybe go camping ( or a spiritual retreat) and be kind to people. Try cooperation. Accept that we are all in this together, and have to work together. He isn't there for selfish motives.

- LL
 

moss elk

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He isn't there for selfish motives.

This statement is Truly worthy of ridicule.
Everything the man has ever done is for his own enrichment at the expense of others.

Speaking of which,
two of Giuliani's pals just got arrested:

 
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my_key

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Tell us what we need to know about 'resigning ourselves to four more years of Trump'

13.1 > 33 - People in Harmony - Retreating

The question from my perspective looks to be focusing more on the 'resigning ourselves' element as opposed to what may happen in the 'four more years' or indeed any comment on the efficacy of Trump as a President.

Maybe the response says something like:

We need to know that by resigning ourselves to this situation it'll create a picture like we are walking away and turning our backs on what is happening (33). We have to wash our hands of this situation because things cannot go on as they are, and this is best going to happen through connection and sharing of new ways to bring harmony between people (13).This movement is beginning to happen and cannot be ignored, so rise up and join with this and take a step forward into change (13.1).

....or maybe it's nothing like this at all.

Good Luck
 

rosada

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13.1 - 33. Realize we are not robots, all men are equal, and we cannot be made to support programs we don’t believe in,
 

Trojina

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This was a spoof thread isn't that obvious or do you really think it's serious ?

I didn't think the reading was even real - just any reading will do to make something up about Trump.
 
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rosada

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Thinking more about this.

What we need to know about resigning ourselves to four more years of Trump:
13.1 Fellowship before the gate.
I see this as describing the moment when people are still independent of each other. Agreements have not yet been made. People are free to come or go, agree or disagree and so people are advised to be very conscious now of what they are committing to, to know what we all are committing to. I see this as describing the next Inauguration and Trump swearing to uphold the Constitution. As long as he remains true to this oath all will go well.
33. Retreat
Of course, is quite likely Trump will interpret his power and his role as President differently than many of us do, in which case the odds are against us should we try to oppose him. Retreating physically - that is, leaving the country - is one option but another is to retreat into oneself. "Sustain your dignity and remain alert, and although you are retreating, in this way you will be able to keep the pressure on your opponent, making every corresponding advance on their part difficult and dangerous." -Guy Damian Knight.
 

Lavalamp

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This statement is Truly worthy of ridicule.
Everything the man has ever done is for his own enrichment at the expense of others.

Well you can of course ridicule the Yi if you wish but that is unlikely to enlarge your understanding of anything at all.
Unselfish is in fact what the commentaries say.
"Legge: ...There is however, no selfishness in his intent. He has all the world before him with which to unite. Selfish thoughts concerning union have no place in him."

- LL
 
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foxx777

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Well you can of course ridicule the Yi if you wish but that is unlikely to enlarge your understanding of anything at all.
Unselfish is in fact what the commentaries say.
"Legge: ...There is however, no selfishness in his intent. He has all the world before him with which to unite. Selfish thoughts concerning union have no place in him."

- LL

His rally is on right now and he’s spewing vitriol.
Maybe beneath all of that his intentions are pure? :unsure:

Are Trump’s intentions pure?
From the response of Yi (32.2>62) I think it says that Trump has found the due mean and can hold long to it: 32=permanence line 2= regrets vanish but he must fly low(62)
Notice that Yi did not give the negative line of 3 which indicates unsteady and false character.
32.2>62

Legge:
The second line, dynamic, shows all occasion for repentance disappearing.
Wilhelm/Baynes: Remorse disappears.
Blofeld: Regret vanishes.
Liu: Remorse vanishes. [A stable situation is now possible.]
/Karcher: Repenting extinguished.
Shaughnessy: Regret is gone.
Cleary (1): Regret disappears.
Wu: Regret disappears.

Confucius /Legge: He can abide long in the due mean.
Wilhelm/Baynes: It is permanently central.
Blofeld: The line implies ability to remain upon the middle path. [I.e. To avoid extremes and cleave to the golden mean. This is suggested by the position of the line which is central to the lower trigram.] Ritsema/Karcher: Ability lasting, centering indeed. [The ideogram: field divided in two equal parts. Image of hexagram 61.]
Cleary (2): One can remain balanced.
Wu:
(He) can remain in the central position for a long time.
Legge: Line two is dynamic, but in the place of a magnetic line. However, because of his central position he holds fast to the due mean.

Here he is holding fast to the due mean:

 
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rosada

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The question was What do we need to know about resigning ourselves to 4 more years of Trump? 13.1 describes conditions before there is close fellowship. People mingling outside before entering in. I see it as referring to us all, Democrats, Republicans, Independents alike and not a reference to Trump or any other one person. It's a call for a sense of neutrality and good will, a feeling of a time when all rights, rules and commitments are supposed to be out in the open and mutually agreed to. Then 33. Retreat is about refusing to go along with rules one has not agreed to. Together they say that if Trump is elected it is appropriate that people have an attitude of willingness to keep their commitments to the laws of the land - give the man a chance again if he wins the election fair and square. But keep an eye on things, if the election is fraudulent or if Trump over reaches his authority then people need to push back. So we need to know that in resigning ourselves to four more years of Trump we are not to just say "Oh well" to kids in cages and mocking handicapped people etc. etc. So I guess what we need to know about resigning ourselves the answer is, "Don't."
 

rosada

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Are Trump's intentions pure? I think 32.2 - 62 says yes. However, it doesn't tell us what his intentions are! Or maybe it does, maybe it's saying his core, pure intention is to Endure in office - the rest is just Details!
 

Lavalamp

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Oh come on. Ya'll sound like a heartbroken querent straining against the Yi giving them a reading saying their love is gone and they should just let go. But, but...!
Maybe that kind of heartbreak is actually beneficial, as it teaches one to have some humility when being told what you do not want to hear.
It was just like this in 2016 when all the Yi readers were comparing notes and, to the consternation of many, the Yi was predicting "Wonderful news!" Trump the Great man is going to win the election and drain the swamp!"
Lol... You guys. When you cast the Yi you have to always be ready to be told you are wrong, or you cannot accurately read. You have to find a place in yourself exactly in the Middle, totally receptive to what the Yi wants to say, uncolored by personal bias. And everyone has bias, so we all have to do the same work to get back to the middle line, to the Middle Way.
You cannot see a clear reflection in muddy water.

- LL
 

rosada

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I’m saying what I see in these hexagrams. Other people may connect the dots differently. I’ don’t mind reading other people’s interpretations even when they differ from my own because often I learn something this way.
 

my_key

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Are Trump's intentions pure? I think 32.2 - 62 says yes. However, it doesn't tell us what his intentions are! Or maybe it does, maybe it's saying his core, pure intention is to Endure in office - the rest is just Details!

Hi Rosada
I'd agree with you when you say 'yes' here.

An intention is a plan or a goal that is being aimed for. In respect of the purity of his intentions, to my way of looking at it, a pure intention is one where actions align with words.

Trump has a direction to go, is being consistant and is repeatedly making offerings to his plan ( new schemes, new diversions, new tweets etc,) therefore his approach is smack on a description of 32 behaviour. He is certainly aligning himself with the best practice words of the verse:
A noble one stands firm and does not change his bearings.’

Trump has very little time for regrets around the things he says or does and therefore stays at the centre of his own belief system - he is constant in his self belief i.e. what he says and does is absolutely right for him, and for the things he holds to be true. (32.2)

(62)The bigger picture of all this though is that the way he behaves could be linked to how his own vulnerabilities, which he is unwilling to reveal to the world, are ruling him. What he sees as largesse and power, in the way he acts and speaks, are little more than exaggerations intended to defend the smallness inside, that he holds inside. To feel safe, the little bird keeps flying in the eye of the storm that is raging all around. Manipulating the edges of the eye ( this is fake news) and the magnitude of the storm ( Turkey) to shore up the defence of his 'pure intention', In the grand scheme of things he is only able to engage with 'smallness', the lower details of his character, as seen from a Yi perspective, and reflect these externally. He is not able to transition towards embracing any of the more 'great affairs' that could be available for him on a personal level and which if allowed could expand outwards to become a more magnanimous and beneficent global presence.

He is being true to what he holds true in himself. What he holds true to himself through is small, in many ways. By continuing to retain the stance he has his worlds ( inner and outer) could become more challanging for him. Exterior events might even bring up in him embryoic new ways of being that have, to date, been so small for him as to have been invisible, If he is able to connect with the grief and poverty he holds deep inside then his 'pure intentions' may develop to become more fitting and sincere.

(NB: I've brought in a few themes from Nuclear (43 - Deciding and Parting), Paired (31 - Influence) and Opposite (42 - Increasing) hexagrams to weave a bit of a story here, but they all seem to mingle and I can't decide on where to put the brackets with the hex number in. So I've left them out - a bit of a Where's Wally / Waldo test .)

....and of course it may be nothing like this at all.

Good Luck.
 
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rosada

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Thanks for thinking this through and writing it out for us. I was listening to an interview with Rex Tillerson, the former Secretary of State, and he commented that Trump doesn’t read or listen to other people but he has great instincts for what to say to get him through the moment. Sounded like 32.2 - 62:
Enduring one Tiny Sound Bite at a time.
 

foxx777

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Hi Rosada
I'd agree with you when you say 'yes' here.

An intention is a plan or a goal that is being aimed for. In respect of the purity of his intentions, to my way of looking at it, a pure intention is one where actions align with words.

Trump has a direction to go, is being consistant and is repeatedly making offerings to his plan ( new schemes, new diversions, new tweets etc,) therefore his approach is smack on a description of 32 behaviour. He is certainly aligning himself with the best practice words of the verse:
A noble one stands firm and does not change his bearings.’

Trump has very little time for regrets around the things he says or does and therefore stays at the centre of his own belief system - he is constant in his self belief i.e. what he says and does is absolutely right for him, and for the things he holds to be true. (32.2)

(62)The bigger picture of all this though is that the way he behaves could be linked to how his own vulnerabilities, which he is unwilling to reveal to the world, are ruling him. What he sees as largesse and power, in the way he acts and speaks, are little more than exaggerations intended to defend the smallness inside, that he holds inside. To feel safe, the little bird keeps flying in the eye of the storm that is raging all around. Manipulating the edges of the eye ( this is fake news) and the magnitude of the storm ( Turkey) to shore up the defence of his 'pure intention', In the grand scheme of things he is only able to engage with 'smallness', the lower details of his character, as seen from a Yi perspective, and reflect these externally. He is not able to transition towards embracing any of the more 'great affairs' that could be available for him on a personal level and which if allowed could expand outwards to become a more magnanimous and beneficent global presence.

He is being true to what he holds true in himself. What he holds true to himself through is small, in many ways. By continuing to retain the stance he has his worlds ( inner and outer) could become more challanging for him. Exterior events might even bring up in him embryoic new ways of being that have, to date, been so small for him as to have been invisible, If he is able to connect with the grief and poverty he holds deep inside then his 'pure intentions' may develop to become more fitting and sincere.

(NB: I've brought in a few themes from Nuclear (43 - Deciding and Parting), Paired (31 - Influence) and Opposite (42 - Increasing) hexagrams to weave a bit of a story here, but they all seem to mingle and I can't decide on where to put the brackets with the hex number in. So I've left them out - a bit of a Where's Wally / Waldo test .)

....and of course it may be nothing like this at all.

Good Luck.
Excellent analysis; thank you so much for taking the time to share it! :giggle:
 

beatpoet

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Hmmm. It's a charged word--"resigning"--isn't it?

Random thoughts:

Resigning is more of a description of an attitude, I think. I am wondering whether Yi is telling us about that more than anything else, like what happens if people do resign themselves to four more years, rather than speaking about Trump specifically.

"People meet at the gate." There's not fellowship as much as commonality in being in the same location. The gate sort of reminds me of election booths--we all go to them, but we may not all agree on the same person, same things.

To me, it suggests that if people resign themselves to four more years and the background is retreat, then there will be those who are in varying stages of retreat or perhaps large segments of the population who don't even bother to participate? Or even vote??? Or there won't be a clear consensus among constituents on the way forward?

beatpoet.
 

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