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The Difference of Yarrow Stalks, Three Coins, and I Ching Numerology

water 0n earth

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Perhaps now a day there would be millions of people all over the world consult I Ching Oracle; however, not too many people know the difference between them. They use the I Ching Tex to read them all in the same way. That is sad.

Yarrow Stalks Method:

The following instruction everybody should learn from any yarrow stalks divination book.

“One takes fifty yarrow stalks, of which only forty-nine are used. These forty-nine are first divided into two heaps (at random), and then a stalk from the right-hand heap is inserted between the ring finger and the little finger of the left hand. The left heap counted through by fours, and the remainder (four or less) inserted between the ring finger and the middle finger. The same thing done with the right heap, and the remainder inserted between the forefinger and the middle finger. This constitutes one change.
Now one is holding in one's hand either five or nine stalks in all. The two remaining heaps are put together, and the same process is repeated twice. These second and third times, one obtains either four or eight stalks. The five stalks of the first counting and the four of each of the succeed countings are regarded as a unit having the numerical value three; the nine stalks of the first counting and the eight of the succeeding countings have the numerical value two.
When three successive changes produce the sum 3+3+3=9, this makes the old yang, i.e., a firm line that moves. The sum 2+2+2=6 makes old yin, a yielding line that moves. Seven is the young yang, and eight the young yin; they are not taken into account as individual lines”.

However, not too many people know the reason behind the ritual of the Yarrow Stalks Divination. Let us explain why the ritual of Yarrow Stalks based on the nature of this world and Lou Shu Diagram or the New I Ching Matrix System.

Using 50 stalks represent Earth 5 (5x10=50) is the number adopted from Lou Shu Diagram. Take out 1 and use only 49, for the reason 1 represent Thái Cực (Tai Chi) – Oneness, Wholeness. Take 49 stalks divide into 2 heaps, represent the Yin and Yang – Heaven and Earth after Thái Cực (Tai Chi) is already exist. Next, take 1 stalk from the right-hand heap and insert between the ring finger and the little finger of the left hand, represent Heaven, Earth, and Human, now 3 are existed. Then, the left heap count through by 4, represent the 4 Seasons of the year and the remainder of 4 or less inserted between the ring finger and the middle finger from the two heaps, represent the two leap months. Repeat 6 times to get 6 lines – to form the Hexagram. Hence, if one wants to use the text of I Ching the Book of Changes, should use the Yarrow Stalks. Using this method with sincere we should have a correct answer 70% easily. However, we could not tell what will happen and the time it will happen.

There are 7 rules regularly use when consulting Yarrow Stalks Oracle:

1. If only 1 line is changing just use the line of the original Hexagram for the reading
2. If 2 lines are changing then use both lines of the original Hexagram for the reading, but use the line on top for the main reading (top line more important)
3. If 3 lines are changing then use the Judgment of the original Hexagram and the Judgment of the changing Hexagram. However, the Judgment of the original Hexagram is more important for the reading
4. If 4 lines are changing then use the two unchanging lines of the changing Hexagram for the reading. Use the line at the bottom as the important line for the reading
5. If 5 lines are changing then use the unchanging line of the Changing Hexagram for the reading
6. If 6 lines are changing, then use the “Use of 9 line” at the end of Hexagram 1 and the “Use of 6 line” at the end of Hexagram 2 for the reading.
7. If no changing, line then use the Judgment of that Hexagram for the reading.

These 7 rules are what everybody needs to abide but there are exceptions sometimes. It is so sad that not many people know how the Creator of Yarrow Stalks Divination came up with these 7 steps. These are basic theory of Yin and yang, anybody who understand the basic Theory of I Ching would know.


Three Coins Method:

The Three Coins Method came a little over a thousand years after Yarrow Stalks Method to substitute the inconvenience of Yarrow Stalks Method. It is the quickest, easiest, and most popular by far, supplanted the Yarrow Stalks Method. Using 3 coins, represent Heaven Earth and Human, without 4 Seasons or month. Throw the Coins 6 times represent 6 lines of Hexagram. Because the 4 Seasons and month is not included in the Method; therefore, the creator of 3 Coins Method name Jing Fang (78-37 BC) use the 12 Chinese animals and 6 Stars of animals imbed into the 6 lines of a Hexagram. The Lunar Calendar of Month and Day using the 5 Elements of the branch of month and day must use to do the reading. Of course, with any book writing about the Three Coins there will be a notice: “Do not use the I Ching Text to consult the Oracle”.

Writing to this point, luckily enough I search about Jing Fang and this is what we got from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Ching_divination to support what we are talking here.
“This method goes back to Jing Fang (78–37 BC). While a hexagram is derived with one of the common methods like coin or yarrow stalks, here the divination is not interpreted on the basis of the classic I Ching text. Instead, this system connects each of the six hexagram lines to one of the 12 Earthly Branches and then the picture can be analyzed with the use of 5 Elements (Wu Xing).
By bringing in the Chinese calendar, this method not only tries to determine what will happen, but also when it will happen. As such Wen Wang Gua makes a bridge between I Ching and the Four Pillars of Destiny”.
How did Jing Fang imbed the twelve animals into the 64 Hexagram? He followed the Law of Nature of the things already in existent, not newly created.


As we know, there are 12 Chinese animals: Mouse (1), Ox or Water Buffalo (2), Tiger (3), Cat (4), Dragon (5), Snake (6), Horse (7), Goat (8), Monkey (9), Chicken (10), Dog (11), and Pig (12); and 6 lines of a Hexagram. Mouse (1), Tiger (3), Dragon (5), Horse (7), Monkey (9), and Dog (11) is all Yang animals; and Water Buffalo (2), Cat (4), Snake (6), Goat (8), Chicken (10), and Pig (12). As we see the 12 animals above, all odd numbers are Yang, and the even numbers are Yin.

Let us look at the Yin and Yang of the 8 main Hexagrams of the same Inner and Outer Trigrams.
1 . 2 . 3. 4. 5 . 6 . 7 . 8
☰ ☱ ☲ ☳ ☴ ☵ ☶ ☷
☰ ☱ ☲ ☳ ☴ ☵ ☶ ☷

1. Chamber 1 (Heaven), 6 lines are all Yang considered Yang Hexagram. Jing Fang imbedded Mouse(1) in the first line, line 2 Tiger (3), line 3 Dragon (5), line 4 Horse (7), line 5 Monkey (9), and line 6 Dog (11). All Yang numbers animals sign going from line 1 upward to 6.

2. Chamber 2 (Swamp) considered Yin Hexagram because of 1 Yin control 2 Yang, Inner and Outer Trigrams. Jing Fang imbedded Goat (8) in the Sixth line, line 5 Chicken (10), line 4 Pig (12), line 3 Water Buffalo (2), line 2 Cat (4), and line 1 Snake (6). All Yin numbers animal signs start from line 6 downward to line 1.

3. Chamber 3 (Fire) considered Yin Hexagram because of the same reason as House 2. Jing Fang imbedded Snake (6) in the sixth line, line 5 Goat (8), line 4 Chicken (10), line 3 Pig (12), line 2 Water Buffalo (2), and line 1 Cat (4). All Yin numbers animal signs start from line 6 down to line 1. All Yin numbers animal signs start from line 6 downward to line 1.

4. Chamber 4 (Thunder) considered Yang Hexagram because of 1 Yang control 2 Yin, Inner and Outer Trigrams. Jing Fang imbedded Mouse (1) in the first line, line 2 Tiger (3), line 3 Dragon (5), line 4 Horse (7), line 5 Monkey (9), and line 6. The reason for this is the Tai Chi considered Yang start from 11 PM of the night before as the first hour of next day, as the hour of the Mouse, and to 10:59 Am the next day as the Yang hours, and from 11 AM to 10:59 PM as Yang hours. However, from the 6 Yang hours there are 3 Yang and 3 Yin. The hour number (1) Mouse, (3) Tiger, (5) Dragon are considered Yang, and the hour number (2) Water Buffalo, (4) Cat, (6) Snake are considered Yin. A Yang House has to imbed a Yang numbers animal signs only. All Yang numbers animals sign going from line 1 upward to 6.

5. Chamber 5 (Wind) considered Yin Hexagram. Jing Fang imbedded Cat (4) in the sixth line, line 5 Snake (6), line 4 Goat (8), line 3 Chicken (10), line 2 Pig (12), and line 1 Water Buffalo (2). All Yin numbers animal signs start from line 6 downward to line 1.

6. Chamber 6 (Water) considered Yang Hexagram because 1 Yang line controls 2 Yin lines. Jing Fang imbedded Tiger (3) in the first line, line 2 Dragon (5), line 3 Horse (7), line 4 Monkey (9), line 5 Dog (11), and line 6 Mouse (1).

7. Chamber 7 (Mountain) considered Yang Hexagram. Jing Fang imbedded Dragon (5) in the first line, line 2 Horse (7), line 3 Monkey (9), line 4 Dog (11), line 5 Mouse (1), and line 6 Tiger (3). All Yang numbers animals sign going from line 1 upward to 6.

8. Chamber 8 (Earth), 6 lines are all Yin considered Yin Hexagram. Jing Fang imbedded Goat (8) in the sixth line, line 5 Snake (6), line 4 Cat (4), line 3 Water Buffalo (2), line 2 Pig (12), and line 1 Chicken (10). All Yin numbers animal signs start from line 6 downward to line 1. Look at House 2 and House 8 using the same animals sign for the same reason like House 1 and House 4. The only difference is Yin instead of Yang.

As we can see from the infrastructure of the 8 Chambers, Yin moves counter clockwise, while Yang moves clockwise as the nature of Heaven moves forward and the Earth moves counter clockwise if look from the North Pole. Lou Shu Diagram South is on top and North at the bottom, the Creator is looking at it from the North Pole.

Now let us look at Chamber 1 Heaven, 6 lines are all Yang, so Jing Fang imbedded Mouse(1) in the first line, line 2 Tiger (3), line 3 Dragon (5), line 4 Horse (7), line 5 Monkey (9), and line 6 Dog (11). After the 6 Chinese animals Yang numbers being imbedded, Jing Fang also created the Self Line and the Yielding (or Surrounding) Line, to see whom is the Self, and what is it concerning. The Self is considering the last line that changed. For instant, when we form a Hexagram, we start at line 1 and up to line 6; thus, line 6 is the last line that changed to form that double Trigrams of the same outer ☰ and inner ☰. Use line 6 to imbed The Self Line and line 3 as the Yielding or the Surrounding line. Next Jing Fang use Lou Shu Diagram, which designated the 5 Elements from the table above and created the family relationship and Money/Wife/ Love and Power/Job/Law Suit/Illness.

He used Chamber 1 Heaven as Metal Element from the Post-Heaven 8 Trigrams above, so the Self Line (line 6) is Metal. When the Self is Metal, Brother/Sister is the same Element- Metal because come from the same parent. The Money is Wood because metal can chop wood (money is what we can use as we wish because it is our), Wood is also our Wife because Metal control Wood (eastern way of living); the offspring of Metal would be Water (Children/Luck). Fire is our Job/Career (because 3000 years ago a job considered working for the government, or the king, and if something was wrong a person can be jailed or killed at any time, no matter what rank he held); thus, Fire control Metal and also our Power, Disaster, Illness, and Worry. The Parent of Metal is Earth (Metal is Earth offspring).

This is how the Chamber 1 (Heaven) and 7 other changing Trigrams come from it look like.

Heaven (Càn) qián
--- Parent Earth (Dog) /SELF
--- Brother Metal (Monkey)
--- Career/Job Fire (Horse)
--- Parent Earth (Dog) / YIELDING
--- Wife/Money Wood (Tiger)
--- Children/Luck Water (Mouse)

Hexagram 1 Heaven after 7 changes changing to Hexagram 44 - Cấu (gòu). As we see that after 6 changes, we have Heaven (Càn) with all Yang in 6 lines. Now the 7 changes line 1 Yang changing to Yin, so we have Hexagram 44. Now the SELF is at line 1, and the Yielding is on line 4. Now first line ☰ changing to ☴ we can use the Inner Trigrams of House 2 to plug in the animal signs and adjust the Elements to the correct Family Relationship as follow.

Hexagram 44 - Cấu (gòu)
--- Parent Earth (Dog)
--- Brother/Sister Metal (Monkey)
--- Career/Job Fire (Horse) / YIELDING
--- Brother/Sister Metal (Chicken)
--- Children/Luck Water (Pig)
- - Parent Earth (Water Buffalo) /SELF

Hexagram 33 Độn (dùn)
--- Parent Earth (Dog)
--- Brother/Sister Metal (Monkey) / YIELDING
--- Career/Job Fire (Horse)/
--- Brother/Sister Metal (Monkey)
- - Career/Job Fire (Horse) /SELF
- - Parent Earth (Dragon)

Hexagram 12 (Bĩ) pǐ
--- Parent Earth (Dog) / YIELDING
--- Brother/Sister Metal (Monkey)
--- Career/Job Fire (Horse)
- - Money/Wife Wood (Cat) / SELF
- - Career/Job Fire (Snake)
- - Parent Earth (Goat)

Hexagram 20 (Quan) guān
--- Money/Wife Wood (Cat)
--- Career/Job Fire (Snake)
- - Parent Earth (Goat) /SELF
- - Money/Wife Wood (Cat)
- - Career/Job Fire (Snake)
- - Parent Earth (Goat) / YIELDING

Hexagram 23 (Bác) bō
--- Brother/Sister Metal (Monkey)
- - Children/Luck (Mouse) /SELF
- - Parent Earth (Dog)
- - Money/Wife Wood (Cat)
- - Career/Job Fire (Snake) /YIELDING
- - Parent Earth (Goat)

Hexagram 35 (Tấn) jìn
--- Career/Job Fire (Snake)
- - Parent Earth (Goat)
--- Brother/Sister Metal (Chicken) / SELF
- - Money/Wife Wood (Cat)
- - Career/Job Fire (Snake)
- - Parent Earth (Goat) /YIELDING

Hexagram 35 is a special form of Jing Fang Study. As we know that, any Hexagram comprises of 6 lines. From line 1 to line 5 of Hexagram Heaven is over, if we change line 6 then it would become Earth 6 Yin lines. Therefore, Jing Fang instead of changing line 6, he moved it back down to 4 to form a different Hexagram, and called it Soul Liberation, which means that ☲ and ☷ is the New Soul has nothing to do with outer ☰ inner ☰ now come into play and Liberate from the Old Soul ☰. Because of this reason whenever this Hexagram come to play, most of the times, it has something to do with going somewhere, or the question is about something away, not in town.

Hexagram 14 (Đại Hữu) dà yǒu
--- Career/Job Fire (Snake) /YIELDING
- - Parent Earth (Goat)
--- Brother/Sister Metal (Chicken)
--- Parent Earth (Dog) / SELF
--- Wife/Money Wood (Tiger)
--- Children/Luck Water (Mouse)

Hexagram 14 is another special form of Jing Fang Study. After created Soul Liberation then created Soul Recovery to finish House 1. Soul Recovery, which means that keeping part of ☲ the New Soul and changing the three lines of the Inner Trigram ☷ back to ☰. The third line considered last changed; hence, the SELF imbedded on third line. Now ☰ comeback into play; thus whenever this Hexagram come to play, most of the times, it has something to do with going somewhere and coming back, or the question is about going out of the country is hard to go, most of the time will stay put.

Followed the rule of Changing from Chamber 1 above, and the example of the other 7 Chambers, we should be able to have 64 Hexagrams.

With 3 Coins Method, even if we have the same Hexagram, in a different day we could have an opposite answer. No need to mention if it is in a different month.

Using this 3 Coins Method a normal person can get 60-70% answer correct, not too hard. A Master of 3 Coins School of Study, usually can get 80-95% correct for all answers including the month it happen. However, to predict the day and the hour it will happen maybe only 60-70% correct.

All explanations for the 3 Coins Method is from my insight, and this is the first time I write about it in English on line, beside at my own Vietnamese website. No book that I know of, ever tried to explain how Jing Fang created his 64 Hexagrams. (If there is, maybe nobody can get a hold of it any more). There are books with 64 hexagrams already prepared, not with explanation. Just like there are many I Ching books show us how to read I Ching, but not many book show us how to create I Ching into any I Ching School of Study we want.

Next, I will explain why using the date and time to cast Plumb Blossom Numerology or I Ching Numerology cannot use the I Ching Text. If we do, we should not get more than 30-40% correct. Of course, there is a very deep reason for that, just like 3 Coins Method.
 
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peterg

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Are you familiar with the work of Wang Yang of Chongqing who uses similar non text i ching methodology ? He wrote a wrote a book for Western audience in association with Jon Sandifer.He is clearly a master diviner who can predict for example , exact times, dates, amounts, and he explains how he does it.
I suspect that Eastern people would pick up this methodology quickly enough, but for Westerners to become proficient would probably take years of hard study. Personally I find the whole mix of elements, calendar, astrology etc. quite difficult to absorb.
The basic text combined with intuition and analysis is much easier to use, with the emphasis on intuition.
 

bradford

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These 7 rules are what everybody needs to abide but there are exceptions sometimes. It is so sad that not many people know how the Creator of Yarrow Stalks Divination came up with these 7 steps. These are basic theory of Yin and yang, anybody who understand the basic Theory of I Ching would know.
You should probably be made aware that the current Yarrow method you describe here is less than ten centuries old. It is a re-invention attributed to Zhuxi of the Song Dynasty, as are these rules for understanding multiple changing lines.
It is very doubtful that this was the method of Yarrow divination used in the Yi's first thousand years. In fact, a preliminary statistical analysis that I did of Pre-Qin divination results suggests that the original method produced 6,7,8,9 probabilities very similar to our current coin method (1/8, 3/8, 3/8, 1/8).
Someone should also let you know that the original authors of the Yi did not have a theory of Yin and Yang. This came along 500 years later.
 

water 0n earth

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Are you familiar with the work of Wang Yang of Chongqing who uses similar non text i ching methodology ? He wrote a wrote a book for Western audience in association with Jon Sandifer.He is clearly a master diviner who can predict for example , exact times, dates, amounts, and he explains how he does it.
I suspect that Eastern people would pick up this methodology quickly enough, but for Westerners to become proficient would probably take years of hard study. Personally I find the whole mix of elements, calendar, astrology etc. quite difficult to absorb.
The basic text combined with intuition and analysis is much easier to use, with the emphasis on intuition.
Peterg,

I do not even know his name - Wang Yang, until you mention of it. Since he is teaching at the university, I believe that he is more of a researcher not the practitioner. However, as a master of three Coins School, we all can do what you said, “he can do”. We can even predict the weather of our own city or country. That is normal to us. Like in 2005, during Hurricane Rita, most people evacuated from Houston before it hit. I, on the day Rita hit Houston, moving to my new house and finished 3 hours before it came. I even wrote on my website that Rita is no danger to Houston. Called all my friend and advice them not to evacuate, but they all did.

Since you mentioned of his name and Jon Sandifer, I searched online and here are two more links could support what we are discussing here.

http://www.biroco.com/yijing/najia.htm

Harmen think Wang Yang is blah blah. I have no comment because I have not read the book, but I believe that book of Wang Yang contained all or most of the examples from the Three Coins Bible.

http://www.biroco.com/yijing/eh.pdf

On the other hand, I do not think Harmen is blah blah, but think that he only wrote from what was given before, not from a derivation from Jing Fang Study to create 3 Coins Divination. Actually, he did not know what I am talking about here today; even most modern Easterners do not know he is no exception. Nevertheless, I think he did a very good job as a Westerner, I cannot expect anything more.

Well, you can also go to my website www.tuvilyso.net, ranking within 150,000 in the world, traffic sometimes over 5000 hits a day, with over 6000 members, that I created in 2002. We have about 100 Books of I Ching, Feng Shui, Polaris Star Astrology… that you can download FREE anytime. We do have FREE I Ching Class of 3 Coins School, “Plumb Blossom Numerology”, and Feng Shui, from beginning to advance. Everything is FREE from A to Z. If you cannot read Vietnamese, using Google translation to translate you should understand few things. I hope that the translation will be better soon.

Water 0n Earth
 

water 0n earth

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Bradford,

Thank you for sharing your thought and the information.

Originally Posted by water 0n earth
These 7 rules are what everybody needs to abide but there are exceptions sometimes. It is so sad that not many people know how the Creator of Yarrow Stalks Divination came up with these 7 steps. These are basic theory of Yin and yang, anybody who understand the basic Theory of I Ching would know.
You should probably be made aware that the current Yarrow method you describe here is less than ten centuries old. It is a re-invention attributed to Zhuxi of the Song Dynasty, as are these rules for understanding multiple changing lines.
I guess you missed my point maybe because I did not make it clear. However, my point is, can you explain to me how they came up with these 7 Steps? Not when or where. How? What did they based on? Can you do that for me, Braford.

It is very doubtful that this was the method of Yarrow divination used in the Yi's first thousand years. In fact, a preliminary statistical analysis that I did of Pre-Qin divination results suggests that the original method produced 6,7,8,9 probabilities very similar to our current coin method (1/8, 3/8, 3/8, 1/8).
Yes that is true. They both are similar. However, using that method if it is correct, then you should know every little thing that happen to you in your life, if you want to know. Or at least you should know 70% of everything going on in your life, your family, your love ones, or anybody who ask you. Can you do that? Or just sometimes right and sometimes wrong? Or sometimes you do not even know what is going on? If so, don't you think it is something to think about? (You do not need to tell me, this is the truth that you should know by yourself. We can hide from people but not ourselves).

Someone should also let you know that the original authors of the Yi did not have a theory of Yin and Yang. This came along 500 years later.
Like I said before, when Fu Shi came up with the 8 Trigrams that were all, NO Words, Symbols only. Why there was No Words? Well, at that time everybody knew what it meant, they do not have to say it out loud. The Yin and Yang was already inscribed in that 8 Trigrams. Hundreds of years later people begin to not understand then book of theory came out. Otherwise, if you think Fu Shi did not based on those Yang line and Yin line with the 8 Trigrams, then what did you think he based on? What do you call the long line, and broken line? What does it represent if not Yin and Yang?

Sorry to ask you too many questions, but I study I Ching like Newton ask about the apple, why fall down not up?

Once again thank you for sharing. I hope that we will learn a lot from one another.

Water 0n Earth
 
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peterg

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We should't use the text with the 3 coin method ?

Also, do you use the 'Forest of I Ching' by Jiao Gan ?
There is a lot of interest in the west in the Yi Lin, although it hasn't been translated yet.
 
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There are 7 rules regularly use when consulting Yarrow Stalks Oracle:

1. If only 1 line is changing just use the line of the original Hexagram for the reading
2. If 2 lines are changing then use both lines of the original Hexagram for the reading, but use the line on top for the main reading (top line more important)
3. If 3 lines are changing then use the Judgment of the original Hexagram and the Judgment of the changing Hexagram. However, the Judgment of the original Hexagram is more important for the reading
4. If 4 lines are changing then use the two unchanging lines of the changing Hexagram for the reading. Use the line at the bottom as the important line for the reading
5. If 5 lines are changing then use the unchanging line of the Changing Hexagram for the reading
6. If 6 lines are changing, then use the “Use of 9 line” at the end of Hexagram 1 and the “Use of 6 line” at the end of Hexagram 2 for the reading.
7. If no changing, line then use the Judgment of that Hexagram for the reading.

These 7 rules are what everybody needs to abide but there are exceptions sometimes. It is so sad that not many people know how the Creator of Yarrow Stalks Divination came up with these 7 steps. These are basic theory of Yin and yang, anybody who understand the basic Theory of I Ching would know.
I was just wondering where you got this information from water On earth.
 

peterg

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methods

The Classical text - based method is well known in the west.
Not so well known are two other methods well used in China as described by Wang Yang in The Authentic I Ching :
The Mei Hua Method - Plum Blossom - creates the hexagrams by time data calculation , the four pillars of hour, day, month, year, and analyses the elemental relationship between the trigrams over time.
The Na Jia Method - Matching Lines - where the hexagram lines are matched with the twelve animals of astrology , the six relatives (parent, officer, brother, wife, offspring ) and the six 'constellations' ( green dragon, red bird, gouchen or polaris, flying snake, black tortoise )

They might be difficult to pick up from books but would be much more managable in classes or correspondence - online courses.

I'm curious about the reason for not using the text in conjunction with some of the methods.
 

water 0n earth

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I was just wondering where you got this information from water On earth.
answeredquestions,

It is from a book named I Ching Dictionary (a book contains almost everything you want to know about I Ching) in my library, for fast use. Wow, if your books do not even have this, then let me give you two more that comes from me not from books.

8. If 6 lines are changing and it happen to be the Hexagram 1 Heaven, use the Text of Hexagram 2 and the “Use of 6 line” at the end of Hexagram 2.

9. If 6 lines are changing and it happen to be the Hexagram 2 Earth, use the Text of Hexagram 1 and the “Use of 9 line” at the end of Hexagram 1.

I hope this would help.

Water On Earth
 

water 0n earth

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pertg,

We should't use the text with the 3 coin method ?
I will answer this from the similar question from your next post.

peterg said:
Also, do you use the 'Forest of I Ching' by Jiao Gan ?
There is a lot of interest in the west in the Yi Lin, although it hasn't been translated yet.
Yes, I have it but I do not use it, but one time. I am not too interest in any Chinese Divination that take too much time to cast a Hexagram and that could not answer when things would happen.

Jiao Yanshou - Tiêu Diên Thọ (焦延壽) is the author of Yi Lin, an I Ching Grand Master. He is Jing Fang's teacher.

At one time, there is a Vietnamese person very arrogant about his knowledge of I Ching at my website; however, he could not figure out the infrastructure of the 4096 Dodecagrams of Yi Lin. I read over 200 Dodecagrams, and then I know exactly how Jiao Yanshou Tiêu Diên Thọ (焦延壽) came up with it. So I teased him, if he "beg" me I will explain it to him. In another word, if he asks me to explain it he has to accept me as his teacher :rofl:. He was really pissed. After that, I gave him a hint, but I guess he is the type that only learn I Ching by words, not understand the meaning and the Law of Nature; he could not figure out the Infrastructure of Jiao Yanshou - Tiêu Diên Thọ (焦延壽) still. That is the only time I really pay attention to Jiao Yanshou study.

Maybe after I open www.IChingnumerology.com an English website, I will have my students, friends and Admins to start writing software for it, if that is something the Western really like.

Water On Earth
 
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water 0n earth

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Peterg said:
We should't use the text with the 3 coin method ?
Peterg, if I tell you we never use it is not true. Occasionally, Modern Three Coins Masters will use it, but less then 20-30% of all their readings, as a small part of the reading only. When do we use it? Only when we see the question reflects the Oracle.

As a master, one should be able to tell the inquirers what is his question or questions, not the other way around. Usually, the master has to do the job himself, which is casting the coins. Those masters usually read only few times a day for money. Of course, if a master wants to charge money for it, then it is his job to tell us what we want to know. Why should we tell him? It is also a good way to check his ability. If he does not know what we want to ask, how can we believe that his predictions will come true?

People like us, reading Oracle for free would have lots of people asking for consultation because of our reputation; normally, we read 1-15 times a day or even more, on the street, at a meeting, no office, then we cannot casting the coins ourselves. If we have time we will tell them what are their questions and start our prediction and tell them what month it should happen, or what day or what hour of the day that should happen; If not, for time consuming, we will ask for their questions and then do the prediction.

Occasionally, everybody should miss the question, because of the inquirers are not sincere with the divination itself, or within him, or with the question itself. Such as the Hexagram 13 of the mother asked, “If she should go to Vietnam and is it good or bad”, I wrote in the topic of “answeredquestions” is a very good example. Also, like a person consult an Oracle and we get an answer of his/her divorce at a certain month. However, his/her question is about money. Then, we look at his/her money and see that the money will be dividing between both of them. So finally, they have to admit that they are on the way to divorce and he/she wants to liquidate the assets under his/her name before the court will divide it evenly… Sometimes, they ask about divorce, but we see that they commit adultery, then we have no choice but tell them about how their relationship with their lovers going to be later, rather than their divorce. Things like this happen all the time.

Also, sometimes the I Ching spirit wants to tell something more important to the inquirers then the present question. For instant, a person asked me about her job for the year of 2010. From the reading, I told her about her job and her interaction with her colleagues, her boss… even her children, all no big deal. However, the big deal is her dad’s health. It should be very bad. In hope that, he would make it through the fall, then he should be ok. Unfortunately, he passed away in late fall of Lunar calendar.

Peterg said:
I'm curious about the reason for not using the text in conjunction with some of the methods.
For the reasons above, we sometimes use it in conjunction with other methods as we see it is a clear and definite answer, but no more than 30%, and just as a part of the reading not the main reading.
Especially, with the Plum Blossom Numerology we will not use more than 10-20%. What is the reason for this?

Well, Plum Blossom Numerology comes from the He Tu – Lu Shou Diagrams and the Pre Heaven – Post Heaven Eight Trigrams and the Matrix Numbers System, called the "Image and Numbers" school of study. Numbers from the He Tu came first, Fu Shi then from the numbers of that Diagram created Pre-Heaven Eight Trigrams and this in existent long before the I Ching Text came along. Master Shao Yong considered one of the greatest Master of I Ching, and he made clear of this point, by a notice, “Plum Blossom Numerology is the study of Pre-Heaven, at the time of NO TEXT. We cannot use the Text of I Ching to predict something before the Text itself”. In order to accommodate for using the Text of I Ching, he came up with Post-Heaven Numerology in his book, too. Here is how to cast the Post-Heaven Numerology study:

Use the image of things that suddenly caught our attention to cast the top Trigrams, and the directions of where the things come from as lower Trigrams. For example, on the day of Yin Earth/Chicken at the Cat hour (=4), there was an old man came from Southeast Direction. He looked worried and different. When he was asked, “What worried you”? He said, “I had not thing to worry”. So curious, Master Shao Yong, cast a Hexagram. He used old man = ☰ top Trigram; and used Southeast direction as ☴ for lower Trigram. He then used ☰ = 1 and ☴ = 5; 1 + 5 + 4 (Cat hour) = 10/6 = 4 changing line.

☰ => ☰ => ☴
☴ => ☰ => ☴

Text of Hexagram 44 Kou, line 4: “wrapping no fish, (or no fish in the bag, kitchen), which creates misfortune”. There were many Metal Trigrams at the time of strong Metal that would kill the Wood, no chance of living. He then used the total number of 10/2 = 5. The reason they were walking, it was the image of fast coming. He told the old man, “Within 5 more days, what ever you do, going in or out, you should be careful. Disaster will come upon you”. Actually, 5 days later, the old gentle man went to a feast, and choked on the fish bones and died.

Look at another example of a cow suddenly roaring with a sorrowful voice, on day Yin Water Cat, at Horse hour, from the North direction. The Cow = ☷ = 8 as top Trigram, and ☵ = North = 6 as lower Trigram. He used 8 + 6 + 7 (Horse hour) = 21/6 = 3 Changing line.

☷ => ☷ => ☷
☵ => ☳ => ☴

Text of Hexagram 7 Shi, line 3: “As if the army move back, on a wagon carry dead body, dangerous”. Water in this case had Earth dried the water up and water already weak used for watering the 2 Woods; that was no chance to live. He predicted that, “within 21 days (which is the total number above) the cow would be killed”. Actually, 20 days later, people bought the cow to kill for food to celebrate their own festival.

On Yang Wood Monkey day at Cat hour, from Northwest direction a rooster crowed in a very said and painful sound. Rooster is ☴ = 5 (things or animal with wings) for upper Trigram; and Northwest = ☰ = 1 for the lower Trigram. He took 5 + 1 + 4 (cat hour) = 10/6 = 4 Changing line.

Hexagram 9 Hsiao Ch'u, line 4: “Sincerity and trust to get rid of the blood, and out of fear and worry. No fault (or no blame). He predicted that, “The rooster would be killed with 10 days”. Actually, 10 days later the rooster was killed by cutting the vein on his neck for blood; and both the blood and meat used for food to serve the visitors.

Lastly, on a Yang Earth Mouse day at Dragon hour, Master Shao Yong was walking down the street, a dried branch of a tree fall down at the West direction from him without any wind. Dried branch = ☲ = 3 for upper Trigrams; and West direction = ☱ = 2 for lower Trigram. He took 3 + 2 + 5 = 10/6 = 4 Changing line.

Hexagram 38 K'uei, line 4: “Isolated through opposition, running across a big man...”. In addition, K'uei means opposition and changing to Hexagram 41 Sun means decrease, diminish, cut down… He predicted that, “The tree will be chopped down with 10 days”. Actually, people chopped the tree to build a house for a high ranked officer, which the Text said “Big Man”.

If we use the I Ching Text, we should use it like the four examples above. Use it and know exactly what is happening, rather than use the Text but still have the slightest idea.

For this reason, when using the Pre-Heaven like my I Ching Numerology or Plum Blossom Numerology, absolutely do not use the I Ching Text. However, I myself occasionally use the Text for Numerology only when it is saying exactly what my question is. However, no more than 10-20%.

Beside your question, sometimes we use the 3 Coins style of 12 animals with the I Ching Numerology too, but still no more than 10-20%, when our intuition tell us to do so.

Well, many of you might think I am crazy, why do I have to learn everything from the root. However, the reason is, I cannot remember any type of study if I do not know it like the creator. The funny thing is in the Zi Wei Dou Shu (Astrology); I explain it from A to Z and recreate my own School of Study, and relocated of about 15 stars on the chart, because it was either typo, or after a thousand year people do not remember it correctly. Nevertheless, there are only 4 moving Stars that changes from 10 Stems of the year, I could not figured how the creator came up with it. Twenty years passed, I still do not remember where it would be located without the book, and there are 40 cases out of 518.000. However, the question I always ask is, “what if 40 of these cases happen to 1 of the Birth Chart that I am reading and it is wrong? How do I know if it is”? The lucky thing is up to this point none of it was ever wrong yet. I guess in this case their locations are correct.

I hope it at least help you in some way.

Water On Earth
 
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water 0n earth

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Peterg said:
We should't use the text with the 3 coin method ?
Peterg, if I tell you we never use it is not true. Occasionally, Modern Three Coins Masters will use it, but less then 20-30% of all their readings, as a small part of the reading only. When do we use it? Only when we see the question reflects the Oracle.

As a master, one should be able to tell the inquirers what is his question or questions, not the other way around. Usually, the master has to do the job himself, which is casting the coins. Those masters usually read only few times a day for money. Of course, if a master wants to charge money for it, then it is his job to tell us what we want to know. Why should we tell him? It is also a good way to check his ability. If he does not know what we want to ask, how can we believe that his predictions will come true?

People like us, reading Oracle for free would have lots of people asking for consultation because of our reputation; normally, we read 1-15 times a day or even more, on the street, at a meeting, no office, then we cannot casting the coins ourselves. If we have time we will tell them what are their questions and start our prediction and tell them what month it should happen, or what day or what hour of the day that should happen; If not, for time consuming, we will ask for their questions and then do the prediction.

Occasionally, everybody should miss the question, because of the inquirers are not sincere with the divination itself, or within him, or with the question itself. Such as the Hexagram 13 of the mother asked, “If she should go to Vietnam and is it good or bad”, I wrote in the topic of “answeredquestions” is a very good example. Also, like a person consult an Oracle and we get an answer of his/her divorce at a certain month. However, his/her question is about money. Then, we look at his/her money and see that the money will be dividing between both of them. So finally, they have to admit that they are on the way to divorce and he/she wants to liquidate the assets under his/her name before the court will divide it evenly… Sometimes, they ask about divorce, but we see that they commit adultery, then we have no choice but tell them about how their relationship with their lovers going to be later, rather than their divorce. Things like this happen all the times.

Also, sometimes the I Ching spirit wants to tell something more important to the inquirers then the present question. For instant, a person asked me about her job for the year of 2010. From the reading, I told her about her job and her interaction with her colleagues, her boss… even her children, all no big deal. However, the big deal is her dad’s health. It should be very bad. In hope that, he would make it through the fall, then he should be ok. Unfortunately, he passed away in late fall of Lunar calendar.

Peterg said:
I'm curious about the reason for not using the text in conjunction with some of the methods.
For the reasons above, we sometimes use it in conjunction with other methods as we see it is a clear and definite answer, but no more than 30%, and just as a part of the reading not the main reading.
Especially, with the Plum Blossom Numerology we will not use more than 10-20%. What is the reason for this?

Well, Plum Blossom Numerology comes from the He Tu – Lu Shou Diagrams and the Pre Heaven – Post Heaven Eight Trigrams and the Matrix Numbers System, called the "Image and Numbers" school of study. Numbers from the He Tu came first, Fu Shi then from the numbers of that Diagram created Pre-Heaven Eight Trigrams and this in existent long before the I Ching Text came along. Master Shao Yong considered one of the greatest Master of I Ching, and he made clear of this point, by a notice, “Plum Blossom Numerology is the study of Pre-Heaven, at the time of NO TEXT. We cannot use the Text of I Ching to predict something before the Text itself”. In order to accommodate for using the Text of I Ching, he came up with Post-Heaven Numerology in his book, too. Here is how to cast the Post-Heaven Numerology study:

Use the image of things that suddenly caught our attention to cast the top Trigrams, and the directions of where the things come from as lower Trigrams. For example, on the day of Yin Earth/Chicken at the Cat hour (=4), there was an old man came from Southeast Direction. He looked worried and different. When he was asked, “What worried you”? He said, “I had not thing to worry”. So curious, Master Shao Yong, cast a Hexagram. He used old man = ☰ top Trigram; and used Southeast direction as ☴ for lower Trigram. He then used ☰ = 1 and ☴ = 5; 1 + 5 + 4 (Cat hour) = 10/6 = 4 changing line.

☰ => ☰ => ☴
☴ => ☰ => ☴

Text of Hexagram 44 Kou, line 4: “wrapping no fish, (or no fish in the bag, kitchen), which creates misfortune”. There were many Metal Trigrams at the time of strong Metal that would kill the Wood, no chance of living. He then used the total number of 10/2 = 5. The reason they were walking, it was the image of fast coming. He told the old man, “Within 5 more days, what ever you do, going in or out, you should be careful. Disaster will come upon you”. Actually, 5 days later, the old gentle man went to a feast, and choked on the fish bones and died.

Look at another example of a cow suddenly roaring with a sorrowful voice, on day Yin Water Cat, at Horse hour, from the North direction. The Cow = ☷ = 8 as top Trigram, and ☵ = North = 6 as lower Trigram. He used 8 + 6 + 7 (Horse hour) = 21/6 = 3 Changing line.

☷ => ☷ => ☷
☵ => ☳ => ☴

Text of Hexagram 7 Shi, line 3: “As if the army move back, on a wagon carry dead body, dangerous”. Water in this case had Earth dried the water up and water already weak used for watering the 2 Woods; that was no chance to live. He predicted that, “within 21 days (which is the total number above) the cow would be killed”. Actually, 20 days later, people bought the cow to kill for food to celebrate their own festival.

On Yang Wood Monkey day at Cat hour, from Northwest direction a rooster crowed in a very said and painful sound. Rooster is ☴ = 5 (things or animal with wings) for upper Trigram; and Northwest = ☰ = 1 for the lower Trigram. He took 5 + 1 + 4 (cat hour) = 10/6 = 4 Changing line.

Hexagram 9 Hsiao Ch'u, line 4: “Sincerity and trust to get rid of the blood, and out of fear and worry. No fault (or no blame). He predicted that, “The rooster would be killed with 10 days”. Actually, 10 days later the rooster was killed by cutting the vein on his neck for blood; and both the blood and meat used for food to serve the visitors.

Lastly, on a Yang Earth Mouse day at Dragon hour, Master Shao Yong was walking down the street, a dried branch of a tree fall down at the West direction from him without any wind. Dried branch = ☲ = 3 for upper Trigrams; and West direction = ☱ = 2 for lower Trigram. He took 3 + 2 + 5 = 10/6 = 4 Changing line.

Hexagram 38 K'uei, line 4: “Isolated through opposition, running across a big man...”. In addition, K'uei means opposition and changing to Hexagram 41 Sun means decrease, diminish, cut down… He predicted that, “The tree will be chopped down with 10 days”. Actually, people chopped the tree to build a house for a high ranked officer, which the Text said “Big Man”.

If we use the I Ching Text, we should use it like the four examples above. Use it and know exactly what is happening, rather than use the Text but still have the slightest idea.

For this reason, when using the Pre-Heaven like my I Ching Numerology or Plum Blossom Numerology, absolutely do not use the I Ching Text. However, I myself occasionally use the Text for Numerology only when it is saying exactly what my question is. However, no more than 10-20%.

Beside your question, sometimes we use the 3 Coins style of 12 animals with the I Ching Numerology too, but still no more than 10-20%, when our intuition tell us to do so.

Well, many of you might think I am crazy, why do I have to learn everything from the root. However, the reason is, I cannot remember any type of study if I do not know it like the creator. The funny thing is in the Zi Wei Dou Shu (Astrology); I explain it from A to Z and recreate my own School of Study, and relocated of about 15 stars on the chart, because it was either typo, or after a thousand year people do not remember it correctly. Nevertheless, there are only 4 moving Stars that changes from 10 Stems of the year, I could not figured how the creator came up with it. Twenty years passed, I still do not remember where it would be located without the book, and there are 40 cases out of 518.000. However, the question I always ask is, “what if 40 of these cases happen to 1 of the Birth Chart that I am reading and it is wrong? How do I know if it is”? The lucky thing is up to this point none of it was ever wrong yet. I guess in this case their locations are correct.

I hope it at least help you in some way.

Water On Earth
 
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water 0n earth

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On April 4, 2011 (Lunar: March the 2nd), my brother asked me to pick up a check for him after delivered 3 loads of Scrap metals and he said it sold for $310/ton, so the check would be about $3000.00. I went there but the check was not ready. It was 3:25 PM and I suddenly want to know, “How much is check, and how many tons should be the total of 3 loads”?

4+3+2 = 9/8 = 1 = ☰
9 + 8 = 17/8 = 1 = ☰
17/6 = 5 Changing line

☰ => ☰ => ☲
☰ => ☰ => ☰


☰ Hexagram 1 is Heaven and ☰ is metal. ☰ = 1 + 1 = 2; second Hexagram is also Heaven = 2; third Hexagram is Hexagram 14 大有 (dà yǒu), "possession in great measure", ☲ = 3 + ☰ = 1; the total would be 8.

There should be 8 tons plus changing line 5 equal 5 is use as the decimal digit number, it should be more or less of 8.5 tons. If 8.5 (tons) x 310 = $2635.00.

Checking the money itself is also the same: First Hexagram Heaven adds up equal to 2 (☰ = 1 + ☰ = 1), that is $2,000.00; adding the 4 Hexagrams in the back for the hundred-digit number equal to 6 (☰ = 1 + ☰ = 1 + ☲ = 3 + ☰ = 1); and line 5 changing should be the 10-digit number = 5. The total amount should be $2650.00.

After checked back and forth several times, I concluded that, the check should not be $3000.oo, but only more or less of $2635.oo-2650.oo because there was only about 8.5 tons.

Finally, they gave me a check of $2666.oo and the paper work of 3 loads as follow: 4.01 + 2.38 + 2.21 = 8.60 (tons) x 310 = $2666.00.

This is the second times I came to this Scrap Yard and had my calculation correct again. The first time was on December 17 2010 at 2:12 PM with the same reason (11-12-Year of the Tiger).

3+11+12= 26/8=2 = ☱
26 + 8 = 34/ 8 = 2 = ☱
34/6 = 4 Changing line

☱ => ☴ => ☵
☱ => ☲ => ☱


☱ Hexagram 58 兌 (duì) is Joyous and ☱ is metal; therefore if ☱ = 2 + ☱ = 2 was only 4 tons, that could not make us happy.


☱ Hexagram 60 節 (jié), "limitation", decreases. In this case, I did not use the Interchanging Hex because the changing Hex is more important, so I had no choice but to use Hex 60 and add both upper and lower trigrams together to get the tonnage (☵ = 6 + ☱ = 2) => 8 tons. Hexagram 60 is decreasing, therefore, I took 8 tons subtract for 2 (☱ = 2) or 6 (☵ = 6) because 2 and 6 is the changing upper trigram and it should be equal to 7.8 or 7.4 tons. However, because of Hexagram 60 is decreasing it should be 7.4 tons.

They gave me the check and the paper work of that one load, which is 7.41 tons.

Things like these examples anybody study I Ching Numerology should be able to predict. When toppled the Shang Dynasty, the Zhou Dynasty under King Wu took an Oracle and predicted that his Dynasty would last 800 years. His prediction was correct. If he could do that, can we do the same? If we cannot do it, did we ever ask ourselves, “why not’? Now a day, people study I Ching seems like just for fun. They do not know or even think an Oracle would be able to predict something more than 12 years. That is sad.

Actually the people who Study Three Coins I Ching has the ability to tell a whole life of a person about his wealth; his health; his longevity; how many wives he will be married; his parents’ health, and wealth…; how many children he would have and their health, wealth. However, most of the times, it cannot tell how much money a person has in his bank or from his assets through out his life. It can tell of a specific day’s weather sunny, rain, cloudy or not within 1 month, but no longer than a month; nevertheless, it can tell the time of disasters like tornado, flood, sickness, the president or king, the local government of a country or the world in a particular year. (This part is almost the same as I Ching Numerology can do).

On the other hand, the people who study Plumb Blossom Numerology, or I Ching Numerology would be able to tell if someone ask of a day from 500 or 5000 years later, rain, cold, windy or sunny. It can tell about how much money a person would have through out his life, or how much he has at the time in his bank, how many wives, or husbands, how many children… However, it can only answer one or few things at a time, not the whole family at a time, but it can come up with the definite numbers while the 3 Coins Study cannot for most of the times. Obviously, I Ching Numerology concentrates in single object or subject, while 3 Coins Study is concentrating in multiple objects and subjects. However, if a birth chart of a person were known, then using I Ching Numerology or Plum Blossom Numerology in conjunction would be a very effective way of reading. One thing both methods have in common is being able to tell about the people one encounter like boy friend, or girl friend, partners, enemy, is truthful, trust worthy, bring good luck, or bring bad luck, what is his intention…

Of course, if a person who know these two methods, as a master, then he should be able to know everything about his life, if he wants to know, like reading his own palm. Nevertheless, when a person has the ability as such, he would let his life decided by the nature because he knows the Natures Law.

Water On Earth
 
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water 0n earth

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It has been a while now, so I try to come up with a different type of I Ching reading from Pre-Heaven form, so here is my offer to anybody who wants to check out my new study.

Here is the way to consult an Oracle:

A. Use 8 pennies, and take one penny then mark it with a marker on both side

B. You can ask about anything in your life or anybody else life with a specific question and write it down

1. To cast the first Trigram just put all 8 pennies in your palm then shake it and concentrate on the question you have just written down; when you feel like the coins speak to you, you put all of them in one hand and close your hand so you cannot see the pennies, then start pick out one by one, until you pick the Marked penny. If the Marked penny happen to be the first time you pick, then write down 1. (It can only be 1 to 8).

2. Put 8 pennies back in your palms and shake it and repeat step 1 to cast the second Trigram. If it is 5th time you pick the Marked penny, and then write down 5.

3. After you get both Trigram, take away 2 pennies, then put all 6 pennies in your palms and do the same way like the first two times. If you pick out the 5th time, then write it down 5.

When your question and the answer have nothing to do with each other, I would tell you, that you are lack of concentration and you should do it again. If you concentrate and have faith in it, we should have at least 9 correct out 10 times and the answer is straight up to your question.

Keep in mind this is only work with the 8 pennies, not apply with any other methods or 3 coins. It is compatible with Plum Blossom. Try it to believe it!

Basically, from the 3 examples above we have 1, 5, and 5 which is:

☴ Hexagram 44, changing line 5.

Water On Earth
 

peterg

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44.5

Isn't 44.5 associated with August ?
In 2008 friends of mine named Mellon went on a trip abroad on August 8th.The cast ( using dice ) was 44 .2 .5. - 56
That was the opening day of the Beijing Olympics : 8.8.2008
Mellon can be written in Chinese as two 8 side by side ( Marshalls Msandate page c.205 )
The Weaver girl festival suggested by the ' osiery ' is celebrated on the 7th day of the 7th moon which was the August moon.I think it fell on the 7th day that year ?

pg
how true even today
 

water 0n earth

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Hi guys,

Isn't 44.5 associated with August ?
In 2008 friends of mine named Mellon went on a trip abroad on August 8th.The cast ( using dice ) was 44 .2 .5. - 56
That was the opening day of the Beijing Olympics : 8.8.2008
Mellon can be written in Chinese as two 8 side by side ( Marshalls Msandate page c.205 )
The Weaver girl festival suggested by the ' osiery ' is celebrated on the 7th day of the 7th moon which was the August moon.I think it fell on the 7th day that year ?

pg
how true even today
According to the Pre-Heaven form of Prediction, which is when we cast the first Trigram set on the top and the second Trigram set on the bottom then the Hexagram 44 is in the May Moon which is sometime in June-Jully. However, if we separate the two Trigrams of upper and lower, then Upper ☰ (Qian) is strong and should happen in Autumn the strong time for Metal; on the other hand lower (☴) Xun is strong and should happen in Spring. Using the 7 rules of moving lines so we use line 5 from Qian for Autumn. (This is talk after the fact, to me doing this is BS = Bachelor Degree of Sickness) :rofl:

However, your friend used the dice or three coins then it is easier to explain.

Cấu - Gou (44) ---------- Lữ - Sojourning (56)

--- parent (Dog)
--- sibling (Monkey) 0 ------ Parent (Goat)
--- occupation/disaster (Horse)-Yielding
--- sibling (Chicken)
--- offspring (Pig) 0 -------- occupation/disater (Horse)
- - parent (Ox)- Self

Even we did not know the date your friend consult the oracle, we still can see that line 5 Sibling (Monkey) - Monkey the 7th month of Moon is moving. It is right on the dot!

Also we see that Cấu-Gou (44) - coming to meet, means that a meeting is away from home and Sojourning means traveling; both means that your friend traveling afar for a meeting or for a spectacular event, which is Olympic.

However, if we know what day and what month your friend consult the oracle then, of course, we can go in details such as what happen to him/her on their way, or while they were there...

Why China Olympic is on August 8 2008?

It is on the 7th month of the year, and the 8th day of the month. The year 2008 is the year of the Earth/ Mouse, the month of the Metal/ Monkey, and the day is Metal/ Dragon which combines to be the Monkey Mouse Dragon Triads of Water, which is Strong and unlimited Metal to provide water constantly. This is a part of Feng Sui date choosing. If for any reason one wants to know how many medals China would get from the time and date it opens using Plum Blossom I Ching he would be able to tell.

When I write this it reminds me of July 17 2011, when my two friends and I met at a coffee shop, suddenly a friend of mine (he is a fortune teller himself) was watching TV asked me: "American Women Soccer team and Japanese Women Soccer team which one will win? He added, now the J.W.S team just scored 2-2 even, they will go into overtime".

I told him: "I have nothing to do with it, I do not feel a thing to consult an oracle, but since you have asked I would be able to give you an answer". Even though he is a fortune teller himself, but he is not able to answer things like such.

I said:
- "According to the time and date we have Li (30) - The Sun changing to Đại Hữu - Ta Yu (14) - great gain or possession; Li is the sign of the Japanese flag changing to great gain, so the Japanese team will win and they will win at the penalty kick off, not at the overtime; the score is either 3 or 5. Li = 3, and in order to win it either 3-1, or 5-3".

He asked:
- "Why can we say America is bigger and greater possession, because America had won the past 12 years, since this is the first time for Japan; and conclude that America will win".

- "No. I am sorry, even we are American we should believe and wish for our team; however, heaven's will have nothing to do with us. Li represents the Japanese flag". I told him.

So we keep on talking and forget about the Oracle, and suddenly he cursed and told me American team lost by penalty kicks of 1-3.

- Sorry dude! I did not mean to ruin your day. It has nothing to do with me. :rofl:

If you guys recall the Hexagram Li (30) about the Radio Active Reactors in Japan, I was on the target. So this one would not make any different.

Water 0n Earth
 
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peterg

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illness

Hi Water O Earth
You mentioned sickness in the first paragraph.
I had sudden abdominal trouble on Aug.1st. Had to call an ambulance. Ok now.
pg
 

water 0n earth

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Peterg,

We are glad that you are ok!

Were you born on the year of the Chicken, Dog, or Mouse or the year of the Metal?

Water 0n Earth
 

peterg

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dragon

Dragon , as in 2012.

Some recent casts that seemed to be about illness :
59 - 1 , 18 - 15 , 48 - 11.

8 coin method : the trigrams are cast from the top down ?
unlike the lines which are cast from the bottom up.

regards
pg
 

water 0n earth

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Dragon , as in 2012.

Some recent casts that seemed to be about illness :
59 - 1 , 18 - 15 , 48 - 11.
What type did you use for these casts?
What were the questions for your casts?
And what was your answer for these casts?

8 coin method : the trigrams are cast from the top down ?
unlike the lines which are cast from the bottom up.
pg
Yes. It based on "Heaven came first on top, earth came second at the bottom". All Pre-Heaven I Ching forms are like that. Post-Heaven forms like Yarrow, Coins, Dice which created by human after I Ching Bible was written, first line start from the bottom up.

Water 0n Earth
 

peterg

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methods

Hi Water on earth.
Since you asked :There were no questions , just casts.
59 - 1
July 7. Yarrow 48 (+ 2 ) Coin odds.
With the benefit of hindsight :
59.0 Spreading infection.
59.1 Get help.
59.4 Retreat to hilltop. Contemplation.
H1. A fresh start.
A household key given in case of emergency.
A significant date. Aug 1.
18 - 15
late july. Russells virtual online yarrow.
18.0 Illness.
18.2 Unable to divine due to illness.
18.6 Withdrawal from public affairs ! due to illness . Focus on private issues.
48 - 11
aug 10. Yarrow 48.
48.5 Cold limpid springwater taken in.
After illness I started drinking a lot of refrigerated bottled springwater instead of my usual tapwater.

regards
pg
 
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water 0n earth

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Peterg,

Like I said before, using I Ching Bible for prediction by Yarrow method is a trust worthy one. You have proved that. However, the only thing about it is, it does not tell you about your sickness and when your sickness will happen like 3 coins method.

Water 0n Earth
 

meerkats64

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method of coin tossing

i find coin tossing handy i don t have all day to shuffle yarrow stalks the hexagrams you get are correct right at approx after the time you ask just make sure you phrase the question correctly in right tense with no ambiguity also if anyone wants to understand www.superiching.com by alex chiu just e mail me at meerkats64@hotmail.co.uk for i ching zip folder which will easily make sense of it for you. i have given it to other people already such as peter grant and hilary bennet and loads of others before them if you want it e mail me
 

peterg

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Medical Divination

Herman Mesker's paper on The Eight Houses ( palaces ) is well worth a print out ( 22 pages close print ) for closer study. It looks complicated and requires close reading first time but its actually well written and easy to follow. See post 4, second link.
It is of special interest from the point of view of medical divination.

The 8 palaces consist of 8 groups of hexagrams .
The palace hex. of each group is the trigram doubled.
The 7th hex. is the 'you hun' wandering soul ( lines 1.2.3.5. change to give the palace hex.) and
the 8th hex. is the 'gui hun' returning soul ( line 5. changes to give the palace hex . as the resultant hex.)

Traditionally ( he quotes strong sources ) the 'you hun' and 'gui hun' hexagrams are considered bad omens esp. in relation to health matters. If these boys show up in the context of an illness , play safe and see the doctor.They have death or near death associations ( the soul returning to source ) so the problem needs careful handling.

In late June - 5 weeks before major abdominal pain & calling an ambulance - I cast 17.5 - 51 , yarrow : thats a gui hun hexagram changing to a pure hexagram.

My next cast using 18 coins from the petty cash 6 x 3 format was : 57.5 - 18
Thats the reverse of what were talking about here (18 - 57 ) but still interesting.

My next cast ( 18 coins ) was 47.3.4 - 48.
In Karcher Ritsema 47.4 the word amble is used.The next line includes a metal chariot. The word amble has the same Latin root as ambulance : ambulare , to walk and ambulans , walking.The original idea was a mobile or field ambulance wagon or cart which followed the army.
I've also got this line for a job offer , slow in coming and involving a lot of commuting (chariots) which was far from ideal or appropriate , but thats all there was on the table.

I also cast three hexag. 32 unmoving ( 18 coin ) which was somewhat reassuring.

A psychic fortune-teller then told my sister that someone around her was going to need a bit of medication but that no one was going to die on her.( there were two ill relatives )
There were some other casts which I wrote about in an earlier post.


Meerkats64
I got an interesting looking file from Albert and can see the contents but it is wps and needs software to open so I cant comment as yet.
Albert correctly predicted the winner of the All Ireland football final weeks in advance and it was a tough one to call.
Albert is a prolific emailer.
All the movements of yarrow are automatic to me and I regard them as an exercise in meditation. i sometimes use other methods such as coin variations.
regards
pg
 

peterg

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My last cast in the month of July ( 18 coin ) was 53.5 - 52
Another gui hun hexagram changing to a palace hexagram.

Herman discusses the na jia method and Alex Chiu's superiching in post 4 , first link.

pg
 

peterg

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Herman. Harmon. Harmen.

Herman. Harmon. Harmen.
I think I've got it now.
Although I'll bet that when I drop my guard I'll still fall into the Herman trap.
 

sparhawk

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Herman. Harmon. Harmen.
I think I've got it now.
Although I'll bet that when I drop my guard I'll still fall into the Herman trap.
A little visual aid will help you, I'm sure... :D


 

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