do you belive in DESTINY?

[rosada]

Very interesting ideas here. They seem to me to fit with hexagram 14. Possession in Great Measure which I read as being about finding and developing one's talents and using them to fulfill one's destiny.
Rosada

 

[sooo]

Everything is destiny when un-scrolled from end to beginning.
Everything new is redundant in retrospect.
We star in our own movie, which we watch from end to beginning.
Starting... now!
​

 

[cesca]

I don't believe in gene memory in families i think it more likely we often reincarnate within the same family...you know like my grandfather is reborn as my son then my son seems to know all about the life of his grandfather... because he was his grandfather. There is much evidence of this from many people

Several years ago I spent some time with an African healer who believed that reincarnation is not linear; in his culture, a grandson could be the reincarnation of his grandfather while the grandfather was still alive, and could learn from the grandfather and carry on his knowledge.

I find that a fascinating idea. My son grew up halfway around the world from my father and saw him for a fortnight every three years, yet they had the same interests, attitudes and mannerisms. They first met when my son was eight months old; he was a shy baby, and refused to be held by people outside our immediate family. When we stepped off the plane on our first visit to my father, my son literally leapt out of my husband's arms and into my father's. Something was going on there, but I can't pretend to know what it was.

 

[cesca]

But the point is I personally don't think we arrive as blank slates and i personally feel there probably are certain key experiences we can't avoid in this lifetime.

I never quite buy the idea of a specific purpose in each life or that it can be known. In the end the only purpose of being is....being. Everything serves that.

I agree that the only purpose of being is being ... but that's huge. Each of us arrived in this human life with unique potentials, and we fall on more or less fertile ground to develop those potentials. We have choices, some of them seemingly tiny and insignificant, but if we make our choices in the direction of living out our own unique nature, the vista opens up. **** may still happen, but our experience of life can change.

(Since when does "****" get automatically edited?!?)

 

[Trojina]

Several years ago I spent some time with an African healer who believed that reincarnation is not linear; in his culture, a grandson could be the reincarnation of his grandfather while the grandfather was still alive, and could learn from the grandfather and carry on his knowledge.

I find that a fascinating idea. My son grew up halfway around the world from my father and saw him for a fortnight every three years, yet they had the same interests, attitudes and mannerisms. They first met when my son was eight months old; he was a shy baby, and refused to be held by people outside our immediate family. When we stepped off the plane on our first visit to my father, my son literally leapt out of my husband's arms and into my father's. Something was going on there, but I can't pretend to know what it was.

Yup I doubt there is anything linear....its just we are confined to the limits of our human perceptions and words. Had a dream i was several women and we were discussing how it felt to be embodied in the persona of one of us, it was very real and feasible. LOL in dreamtime there was no problem with that and it seemed perfectly normal to be have a group discussion about the embodiment of oneof us

 

[Trojina]

I agree that the only purpose of being is being ... but that's huge. Each of us arrived in this human life with unique potentials, and we fall on more or less fertile ground to develop those potentials. We have choices, some of them seemingly tiny and insignificant, but if we make our choices in the direction of living out our own unique nature, the vista opens up. **** may still happen, but our experience of life can change.

(Since when does "****" get automatically edited?!?)

Yes i was saying that because like Lise was saying it doesn't feel right when notionsof karma etc are used as 'reasons' why someone is disabled..or someone suffers much and so on. Whilst I tend to believe there is karma I can't pretend to understand how it would operate in individual lives .


For example somewhere, on another thread Gene said that if we did not wake up we would reincarnate as slaves to a master race. Hmmm as i said to him I do not think he knows that....I think the way karma operates is beyond our knowing so to hold it over our heads, as is done in some societies as some kind of punishment is a misunderstanding of the concept.....

Well maybe theres some seers out there who know more than most...but most don't know including me


But yes our choices have significance...I would think...though i cannot claim to know even that...but how such choices impact on our karma i do not think we can know and it would seem better just to live as you see fit rather than worry how you are doing on your karmic scoreboard.

Peoples ideas of 'purpose' likewise can be similar to trying to keep an eye on their karmic scoreboard as in some worry that if they don't have this defined 'purpose' they are lost...but then that narrows it all down to the protestant work ethic and I doubt its all really so narrow as a score list for 'objectives achieved'.

A sense of purpose is good....but equally just living is good. people shouldn't feel diminished just because they have no driving sense of purpose. If there is purpose they probably can't avoid it anyway. Many beat themselves up over having not found their 'purpose'. I think their life, all our lives are bigger than that...noneed to worry so much about defining "aims and objectives for this incarnation !" LOL

We will probably find after death some angel with a scoreboard rolling around laughing because our 'aims and objectives' for maximising our karmic score weren't what the "Powers that Be" had in mind at all. They were more interested in how we treated our granny back in the 70s whereas we thought we had to purify our lower nature by meditating and never getting angry and being all detached and all that stuff. Yup they will be falling about laughing i reckon.... at me anyway


****** I wonder what my karmic score is...i bet its really crap


oh ***** has been automatically edited for some time. There are ways round it though for the determined swearer

 

[Sparhawk]

(Since when does "****" get automatically edited?!?)

There is an English profanity filter active. I would try French, Spanish or Welsh. Now, they, the Welsh, are very creative. Their versions of "aromatic waste" are: cacha, cachu, cachwch, cechwch, chacha, chachu, chachwch, chechwch, gachu, nghachu...

 

[Trojina]

'bollocks' seems okay though


thats an english swear word, quite a mild one meaning mens testicles

it just means 'rubbish' or 'nonsense'

don't know if you say that in US thats why i explained

'bollocks' seems to have gotten through the filter

 

[Trojina]

sorry for lowering the tone of this lofty thread


but hey it was Luis who started it not me

 

[Sparhawk]

hey it was Luis who started it not me

Happy to serve in properly instructing my brethren.

 

[Tohpol]

From "Being" to "Bollocks"

Loftiness definitely absent....

 

[gene]

Yes, I did say that if we did not wake up we would be slaves to a master race, but that is just one possibility. I want people to understand the seriousness of the situation, and what is going on in the world, that, with things in the state they are should be obvious to everyone, that we are slowly being enslaved. The constitution of the United States is eroding, power is being invested more and more in the Feds, congress is being bypassed by executive orders, and travel is being increasingly restricted. Did it ever occur to anyone that the government might know something about what happens after 2012 and is preparing for it? Their intention is to enslave souls on this reality and never let them find out there is a way out. People should be waking up to this as it is becoming more apparent by the day.

However, much depends on the intention of the soul. Those who are condemned to constant reincarnation without ever finding the way out have allowed this to happen to them because they refuse to see the light, so they never will.

Every 26000 years, as the solar system passes through the center of the galaxy, an energy field appears which allows those who have built a body of light to pass out of this reality into what in one sense might be called the kingdom of heaven. Those who are not ready will have to go through another 26000 year period. Nevertheless, within that context, we can be reincarnated into any dream world we choose or is chosen for us to help with the growth of the soul.

I want people to know the seriousness of this, because this is real, it is not speculation, it is the way the world works. There really is a conspiracy because there is a race of men who from time immemorial have wanted the enslavement of mankind. This has been recorded in pretty much every culture around the world, and it is real. In Biblical terms it is called the Luciferian principle. In other cultures it is more of a down to earth story, but it amounts to the same thing. We can only be enslaved though, when deep down inside we allow it. But people are not waking up to the truth, and the doors are closing.

Gene

 

[Trojina]

Yes, I did say that if we did not wake up we would be slaves to a master race, but that is just one possibility. I want people to understand the seriousness of the situation, and what is going on in the world, that, with things in the state they are should be obvious to everyone, that we are slowly being enslaved. The constitution of the United States is eroding, power is being invested more and more in the Feds, congress is being bypassed by executive orders, and travel is being increasingly restricted. Did it ever occur to anyone that the government might know something about what happens after 2012 and is preparing for it? Their intention is to enslave souls on this reality and never let them find out there is a way out. People should be waking up to this as it is becoming more apparent by the day.

However, much depends on the intention of the soul. Those who are condemned to constant reincarnation without ever finding the way out have allowed this to happen to them because they refuse to see the light, so they never will.

Every 26000 years, as the solar system passes through the center of the galaxy, an energy field appears which allows those who have built a body of light to pass out of this reality into what in one sense might be called the kingdom of heaven. Those who are not ready will have to go through another 26000 year period. Nevertheless, within that context, we can be reincarnated into any dream world we choose or is chosen for us to help with the growth of the soul.

I want people to know the seriousness of this, because this is real, it is not speculation, it is the way the world works. There really is a conspiracy because there is a race of men who from time immemorial have wanted the enslavement of mankind. This has been recorded in pretty much every culture around the world, and it is real. In Biblical terms it is called the Luciferian principle. In other cultures it is more of a down to earth story, but it amounts to the same thing. We can only be enslaved though, when deep down inside we allow it. But people are not waking up to the truth, and the doors are closing.

Gene

It is not my expereince that I am 'slowly being enslaved' and I'm not going to believe it just because you tell me so. The world doesn't begin and end in America anyway. You seem very Ameri-centric if thats the word...there other parts of the world you know.

But one thing does puzzle me about your world view Gene and its this ;

once we are dead...or any time we leave our body we aren't subject to the laws of any government right ? However horrendous the political or economic situation it will all disappear the day we leave our bodies, it just won't be relevant...I mean whether one believes in life after death or not it won't be relevant (to us) What is being enacted here on earth right now is a story in one tiny tiny little part of the universe. You seem to think theres no exit and strangely for someone so concerned with spirituality that death is undesirable


This is not to say its not important to care what happens here..and what we do about what happens here ...
....but you have no way on earth of knowing for sure what will happen after we die or how we will reincarnate. Well you may have a way to know for yourself, but you don't for me.

The stuff about building a body of light is just a theory it is not a fact. I heard it before...and I neither believe or disbelieve it but this threat of being condemned to constant reincarnation if we don't do what you think we should is not something I am going to have hung over my head by some human being....thats between me and ........'it'.

 

[Trojina]

From "Being" to "Bollocks"

Loftiness definitely absent....

I can happily talk Bollocks about Being especially if i have a Beer

see you later.......astral cafe. are you coming as a hare or a dog tonight...or maybe a hair of the dog

its your round !!

 

[cesca]

"Bollocks happens" doesn't have the same ring to it, or mean quite the same thing

 

[Sparhawk]

"Bollocks happens" doesn't have the same ring to it, or mean quite the same thing

Try "chacha happens"!! It is innocent enough, with a festive, Latino musical ring to it, unbeknown to casual viewers, and the same meaning. Those Welsh are wicked, I tell you...

 

[cesca]

It's gonna be my new motto

 

[sooo]

When I was 26, I knew what holy sages were. My sense of destiny was to get to where I am now. Now that I am here, I forgot what the point was.

 

[sooo]

This is the visual image I keep getting. Going with information that time is linked with space in some linear stretchy, fibrous way: if time were to be rolled up, as say an area rug, the last thing to roll out would be the present.

From that perspective, even if Yi's answers were derived by a committee of holy sages, priests, shamans, and the like, they'd have all the time in the world to discuss it before settling on the "best fit" answer. To us it would appear instantaneously.

I'm reminded of biblical poetry, or prophecy if you prefer: And all the host of heaven shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall be rolled together as a scroll: and all their host shall fall down, as the leaf falleth off from the vine, and as a falling [fig] from the fig tree. (reminds me also of 23.6)

Rolled together as a scroll. Isn't that also, more or less, how a hard drive stores information?

All one has to do to be a sage is to look back and around your present. Now is the end to us thus far. All the fuss about the future has already happened somewhere in the scroll. If one doesn't like the prospective outcome, now is a good time and place to change it.

 

[Tohpol]

Yes, I did say that if we did not wake up we would be slaves to a master race, but that is just one possibility. I want people to understand the seriousness of the situation, and what is going on in the world, that, with things in the state they are should be obvious to everyone, that we are slowly being enslaved. The constitution of the United States is eroding, power is being invested more and more in the Feds, congress is being bypassed by executive orders, and travel is being increasingly restricted. Did it ever occur to anyone that the government might know something about what happens after 2012 and is preparing for it? Their intention is to enslave souls on this reality and never let them find out there is a way out. People should be waking up to this as it is becoming more apparent by the day.

YOU want people to understand Gene based on YOUR need and YOUR desire. With respect, people will get it - or not. You are in no position to know what a person has come here to learn which is why it might be beneficial to let go of the need and desire to change people regardless of whether you are highlighting the truth or not. I don't think there is a"should" to anything. Only choices.

However, much depends on the intention of the soul. Those who are condemned to constant reincarnation without ever finding the way out have allowed this to happen to them because they refuse to see the light, so they never will.

That is a choice and a valid path to learning. Service to self is a path just as service to others is a path. And "never will" is yet another far too generalised statement.

Every 26000 years, as the solar system passes through the center of the galaxy, an energy field appears which allows those who have built a body of light to pass out of this reality into what in one sense might be called the kingdom of heaven. Those who are not ready will have to go through another 26000 year period. Nevertheless, within that context, we can be reincarnated into any dream world we choose or is chosen for us to help with the growth of the soul.

I want people to know the seriousness of this, because this is real, it is not speculation, it is the way the world works. There really is a conspiracy because there is a race of men who from time immemorial have wanted the enslavement of mankind. This has been recorded in pretty much every culture around the world, and it is real. In Biblical terms it is called the Luciferian principle. In other cultures it is more of a down to earth story, but it amounts to the same thing. We can only be enslaved though, when deep down inside we allow it. But people are not waking up to the truth, and the doors are closing.

Again. YOU want people to know based on YOUR need to share your point of view and have people agree with it. Maybe that persistent need is abridging people's free-will to choose as they see fit? People ask about such information when ready and if they align to it. It can't be forced. Your desire to "wake people up" according to your perception of reality is getting in the way of the message imo.

God love ya Gene I'm on the same page here but I think you really have to let go and allow others to find their own way regardless of what you want. The world will still be turning when we are all gone and folks will find their own natural way according to what reality fits for them.

 

[heylise]

"Those who are condemned to constant reincarnation without ever finding the way out have allowed this to happen to them because they refuse to see the light, so they never will."
The day, on which I decided not to read Gene's posts anymore, was a good day.

 

[ilemacedonia]

The day, on which I decided not to read Gene's posts anymore, was a good day.

Why you say that?

 

[ilemacedonia]

Why are you people affect and concerned about what Gene says? OK if you don't agree with his viewpoints just pass it away. I didn't expect on this forum such kind of discussions and with that tone. OK Gene has his views, let him have. "You're in no position to judge", "I like the day I stop reading his posts" and similar sentences sounds to me like the sentences I'm hearing in everyday TV political show. We're here to discuss a genuine book, a genuine oracle but I'm surprised by the tone of the some of the advanced nicknames on this forum...

 

[Trojina]

Why are you people affect and concerned about what Gene says? OK if you don't agree with his viewpoints just pass it away. I didn't expect on this forum such kind of discussions and with that tone. OK Gene has his views, let him have. "You're in no position to judge", "I like the day I stop reading his posts" and similar sentences sounds to me like the sentences I'm hearing in everyday TV political show. We're here to discuss a genuine book, a genuine oracle but I'm surprised by the tone of the some of the advanced nicknames on this forum...

I don't think you are in any position to judge after 72 posts since Gene has been threatening us with dire consequences (in the nicest possible way) for some time and if we want to just comment now and then why shouldn't we. It is a discussion forum..and I don't see any real attacks here in this thread


BTW where do newbies get this idea that people who consult Yi are all peace and love and that the Yi is all peace in love...It isn't ( though there are oldies preaching that too) Why do they come along and start preaching here about peace and love and saying they are shocked at behaviour.....you are misguided if you think there is a personality profile of the typical Yi user that is consistently

detached
reasonable
peaceful
non confrontational
able to resolve differences in a calm and adult manner


bollocks !



You are 'suprised' because of your own assumptions thats all


meanwhile if you wanna chastise folks you are meant to go to the chastisement chamber ...here is one already opened ...and actually its quite a peaceful one already on the topic so we could be making progress towards that personality profile thats meant to be desirable
http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?t=11607


the Stepford Yingers



BTW the person who you are chastising in this case is a moderator so you could report her...to herself


BTW what i don't understand is why people say on a discussion forum that if you don't agree with someone you should always just let it go by ?????????


Er then there wouldn't be a discussion would there

 

[ilemacedonia]

I don't think you are in any position to judge after 72 posts since Gene has been threatening us with dire consequences (in the nicest possible way) for some time and if we want to just comment now and then why shouldn't we. It is a discussion forum..and I don't see any real attacks here in this thread


BTW where do newbies get this idea that people who consult Yi are all peace and love and that the Yi is all peace in love...It isn't ( though there are oldies preaching that too) Why do they come along and start preaching here about peace and love and saying they are shocked at behaviour.....you are misguided if you think there is a personality profile of the typical Yi user that is consistently

detached
reasonable
peaceful
non confrontational
able to resolve differences in a calm and adult manner


bollocks !



You are 'suprised' because of your own assumptions thats all


meanwhile if you wanna chastise folks you are meant to go to the chastisement chamber ...here is one already opened ...and actually its quite a peaceful one already on the topic so we could be making progress towards that personality profile thats meant to be desirable
http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?t=11607


the Stepford Yingers



BTW the person who you are chastising in this case is a moderator so you could report her...to herself


BTW what i don't understand is why people say on a discussion forum that if you don't agree with someone you should always just let it go by ?????????


Er then there wouldn't be a discussion would there

Thank you!
I'm asking my self why I can't see such kind of replay from Hilary?
I know why, do you?
How can someone report divination readings (to others) with such kind of negativity?
If one has a provocative tone in his relationships (even via net), you expect not to interfere that negativity in himself with his readings? (and you Trojan perform a reading in every single post in the shared readings in this forum.)With your invalidations in your post: "You're misguided" and "ha-ha-ha" tone you clearly want to make me feel bad (but I don't).
And, thank you for counting the number of my posts - very nice of you!

 

[heylise]

I know, commenting like I did is not smart, not polite, and not a whole bunch of other such things. That is why I usually don't. But occasionally I just get irritated, like anyone gets irritated once in a while. Sun and moon both in Sagittarius might be the trigger...

I know I was not nice, but I didn't cast doom over anyone's head because of something he/she did wrong in my eyes, just told the world I was happy about a decision I made, because once again I saw the reason for it.

Umm.. thinking which one to choose or ...

 

[heylise]

But coming back to the subject of this thread. In the beginning Newlife asked about destination, and that is something I do believe there is. But with predestination I have no affinity, a destination which is fixed in advance.

You do have lots of qualities which make you go in a certain direction, and that feels to me like following your destination. Many (most??) people have not that much say in it, but there are those who have such a strong mind (or whatever else it is what they have) that they actually go in the direction they want to go.

I think everyone knows this feeling of wanting something really badly to happen, and 'making' it happen - but not in an understandable way. If you want to be rich and work hard day in day out with success, then you made it happen. The selfmade man. But it can also happen in a way which is not obvious. Like a miracle, triggered by your wish. I think both the selfmade thing and the wish thing are 'destination'. But both not predestination.

I think most destination happens because you have qualities which play out with or without you yourself consciously doing anything. It is very hard to make something happen which is not part of your mental make-up. I 'want' to publish a book, but I have no talent to actually finish something. Difficult combination, not one which makes your destination very clear. Now I am really curious if that book will ever be a book, or if it will forever sit in my computer as my own thing to play with. I love that, it is an endless source of entertainment for myself – but I would also like that tangible thing with a nice cover which can be bought by everyone.

Visualizing can help, people believing in you, self-discipline, there are lots of ways to help destination a little bit. But just a bit and very often not even that.

 

[Tohpol]

ilemacedonia,

There was no negativity on my part at all. Though responding to a persistant dynamic and flagging it, doesn't have to be carried with negative intent. "You are in no position to judge" is not in any way negative. It is simply a statement of fact. Gene is in no postion to judge the spiritual status of persons on this forum or anyway else. Nobody is. Which is why we have to be careful.

But I think I was in error in introducing that "defence" in this thread. It's a good thread and I think it would be nice to come back to it. My apologies for that.

while it's not necessarily incorrect what you say, I think you must also understand that there is a long history here between members with various personalities and characters that have knocked around each other for many years. That being so, you are naturally going to miss the nuances and reasons why things sometimes "spark" - rightly or wrongly.

Maybe this was all part of this thread's destiny....

 

[Tohpol]

But coming back to the subject of this thread. In the beginning Newlife asked about destination, and that is something I do believe there is. But with predestination I have no affinity, a destination which is fixed in advance.

You do have lots of qualities which make you go in a certain direction, and that feels to me like following your destination. Many (most??) people have not that much say in it, but there are those who have such a strong mind (or whatever else it is what they have) that they actually go in the direction they want to go.

I think everyone knows this feeling of wanting something really badly to happen, and 'making' it happen - but not in an understandable way. If you want to be rich and work hard day in day out with success, then you made it happen. The selfmade man. But it can also happen in a way which is not obvious. Like a miracle, triggered by your wish. I think both the selfmade thing and the wish thing are 'destination'. But both not predestination.

I think most destination happens because you have qualities which play out with or without you yourself consciously doing anything. It is very hard to make something happen which is not part of your mental make-up. I 'want' to publish a book, but I have no talent to actually finish something. Difficult combination, not one which makes your destination very clear. Now I am really curious if that book will ever be a book, or if it will forever sit in my computer as my own thing to play with. I love that, it is an endless source of entertainment for myself – but I would also like that tangible thing with a nice cover which can be bought by everyone.

Visualizing can help, people believing in you, self-discipline, there are lots of ways to help destination a little bit. But just a bit and very often not even that.

Hmmm. I want to see your book manifest into the wider world LiSe...I'm quite sure that's part of your destiny!

I think destiny is naturally linked to enjoyment which in turn, has a thread to the soul. It is of one's true essence which is why the activity is so enjoyable - it's a vocation not one's job.

I've known so many folks who've been intelligent, resourceful, dynamic and powerful. They used those traits to accrue a lot of cash, women, kudos etc. But generally, (though not always) the accumulation of material things were transient after several years or more in that the changes and "gold" that was really important - their inner growth and "essence" were allowed to atrophy and thus everything external that was "forced" into being came from fake influences from society and behavioural conditioning; they were like the spells cast at Cinderella's ball, but when destiny finally came calling at midnight, these things were seen for what they were and / or disappeared as a natural equation.

I guess my point is, if we are able to fulfil our destiny from working on what is real, at least in vitro, then the external manifestation of that, be it love, or material possessions arrive at a natural juncture and as part of the natural joyful, abundance of the Universe: not because we tried to force the Universe into our petty preconceptions as to what is good for us. At the same time, our attempts at forcing things is also a part of the learning, the suffering and the realisation that how well we connect to our own precious destiny is an expression of love for the larger Cosmic Destiny. In doing so, it can live and BE through us. And how then can destiny be anything other than infinite?

 

[heylise]

I think destiny is naturally linked to enjoyment which in turn, has a thread to the soul. It is of one's true essence which is why the activity is so enjoyable - it's a vocation not one's job.

Really love this.